.... yes I have been a fool a very patient fool who did DB( not great most of the times) along the way, but now I am finally letting that rope go.... I told him that if this is what he chooses we need to do it properly there is no friendzone there is no family dinners etc. he needs to live in what it means to properly separate not the coming and going and having me on the side.....I’ve lost all hope now....I think I am ok. I had my cry,....I am still hurting a bit.....I think I am ok, I am sad but ok. I tried my guts out for 7 months since BD, even was so kind and caring and patient for 3 months he has been gone...
You sound like you are moving through this process better than most. Keep up the DBing. The ultimate outcome of the changes is a better version of the old you. All the new behaviors are part of the growth we all need. Can't change others, but we can make positive changes to ourselves. That is what is important.
Originally Posted by Pattnee5
Sorry for the vent...I don’t know where else to go x
This is a really good place to vent. Getting those angry emotions out and off your chest will likely lessen you taking some actions you later might have chosen not to.
Do speak with a lawyer and find out your rights, and the likely default arrangements you’re looking at. Alimony may provide enough to keep the house. Maybe you don’t buy him out, rather you can assume the mortgage (or the necessary portion of it). To that end, speak with your bank and learn what your options are. You might be able to swing more liability than you realize. Or, you choose that you don’t want to. Always good to know what’s what. Knowledge is power.
You are divorce busting very well. Do not take on H’s view. Your path need not be dictated by H’s feelings and words. Let him own his decision. Let him to the heavy lifting.
H’s talking is just the script these folks seem to follow. You said it yourself: Believe nothing he says, and only half of what he does.
A year or two ago H didn’t feel like this. And his feelings changed. His feelings could will change again. Whether he will acknowledge that, or lean into that, or keep running from that, I don’t know.
There is still hope my dear. Yes, let H go. Give him to God’s hands. H needs a lot of work.
You, continue moving forward. You, find you. You, stand for you. Stand for those values and convictions you hold most dear. Invest the time to discover what and how that looks to you.
This also gives time and space to your situation. Remember, you’ve got the gift of time, use it well. Allow the future to unfold, no need to rush it along. What H is sure of today, he questions tomorrow. His mind is a ping pong match.
Stay strong. And hold your head high, you are doing great!
Thankyou db team, it’s nice to get stuff off my chest to people who have walked in my shoes
It’s good too that you’ve learnt to come here and vent, rather than to him. During my divorce, I felt incredibly alone in the world.
Even though I was aware the people here were from all corners of the globe, I got some comfort knowing people were a) listening to my heart break and b) I wasn’t the first person going through it.
Someone once said to me “millions and millions of people have been through divorce, and they’ve been okay”. That was incredibly comforting 👍
I’m glad you’re finally letting him go. It’s best for you, best for him, best for maximising the chances of reconciliation.
You’ve made mistakes. Don’t shoulder all the blame though. He’s made mistake too.
Perhaps in ten years time, you’ll look back on this time right now as your finest hour. When you were strong, faced your demons, carried your children single-handedly … and perhaps when you learnt your own worth.
Things happen for a reason Pattnee. Strength is built only through adversity.
Would Nelson Mandela have become the incredible human being he was if he had no adversity in his life?
Let his fire burn, it will run out of fuel one day.
Night ended up ok and I feel ok with today. Had another message later in the day saying again how genuinely sorry H was for yesterdays outburst and had even bought me chocolates to apologise. I was still working. Said he was feeling better and didn’t need alone time and asked about possibly having dinner together. I politely declined and said I would prefer some time to myself tonight. I was genuinely exhausted and emotionally drained and didn’t want to put on a fake happy “fake it u til you make it” facade. He acknowledged my response and said he understood and would go for a walk and touch base tomorrow I feel alot Calmer now. I genuinely just wanted to breathe today. Had my brother over instead and had a laugh instead. Far more relaxed than playing fake house. I feel I am getting stronger slightly I know H is not in a good place within dealing with his own emotion but I also know he needs to be the one to fix himself and get himself out of this hole in order For it to actually work. If I try to drag him through my ways he will revert in no time. I think the anger and feeling emotion is going to do him the world Of Good if he learns to harness it. The same way I am learning to harness my emotions too and my patience Goodness it’s a slog isn’t it. Hopefully a good weekend ahead
Pattnee, can you look at your last message and give me a % of the part that focused on him? And then they % that is focused on you
This man is sounding like a narcissist. He wants the focus on him. He feeds off it. "I want a day alone. No wait I want dinner together." Good job on telling him no, I would have preferred if you just ignored it.
Today when he asked why you never responded, you could have said "I was busy and giving you what you asked for."
My suggestion for you?! Turn notifications for his texts off. Then you can go in once or twice a day to see if he texted, and what they say. I get the impression that the minute your phone buzzes you're checking to see if it's from him, and what it says. Remember, he feeds off of that. When you become less and less responsive you'll be taking his cake away.
So you want to drop the rope? Turn off notifications for his texts. Drop that rope.
Thanks Dejavu. That makes sense about validating, instead of complimenting which falls on deafs ears. Didn’t think of it like that. And yea you are so right we can’t understand how they feel like this when we have so much love and patience for them and their terrible actions and reactions. It certainly is like being stuck in a rock and a hard place. I certainly don’t feel like he hates me that’s for sure, there’s geniune care there but it’s so buried deep within his emotional turmoil
He sent me a text this morning basically saying he wants a day of space away from us and will see me over the weekend during sports and errands with the kids. It took all my might but I didn’t even bother to respond to that message, if space is what he wants I’ll make myself scarce when he collects D in the morning for sport and be sure to not be around when he returns. I felt proud that I didn’t respond. I am learning a great deal about patience and self calm. I was such an impatient person.
Tomorrow I’ll get myself up and put on some nice clothes for the day and busy myself out in the sunshine, walk the dog, get my nails done( which has been forever) and smile at as many people as I can-
Realize H is on his path. Most of his blaming is projection since he cannot blame himself. He will twist and manipulate his world to fit whatever it is he feels he needs at that moment.
DNJ is 100% correct.
People in affairs or MLC don’t have the internal strength to admit it, and often have spent a whole life playing victim in their own mind.
It’s impossibly difficult for them to continue forward with a bad view of themselves. So they do the only thing they know how - they project blame onto their husband/wife… that way they can forge ahead with their crappy behaviour and yet it’s not their fault.
Most importantly for you, Patnee, you can’t do or say or be anything which is going to change him or wake him up. You being at fault is his get-out-of-shame free card.
Had his head on the table. I felt so sorry for him😞 he complained I smothered him ( and I corrected him and told him I didn’t smother him I showered him with love when he needed it most)
Bad response: I didn’t smother you, I was showering you with love when you needed it most.
Bad response (but truthful): Until you get your mental health sorted out with professional intervention, you’ll remain incapable of accepting love from anyone 🙄
Best DB response: Sounds like you felt a bit trapped by my affection, and maybe you didn’t know how to tell me. Anyway, I’m going out to a bar. *Walks out of the door in sexy clothes and new perfume*.
I think Pattnee, one of the things you need to work on most, is stopping feeling sorry for him. I know you love him and want to protect/look after him during this time, but it possibly makes you come across as needy and unattractive. When he has his head down on the table, validate and then leave. Don’t let your heart break for him, because then that will translate into gushing and bad DB responses.
You can feel sad for him when you’re alone, or when you talk to your friends/family/IC.
Around him, you need to be strong and unwavering. Validate, then leave.
You didn’t break him, so you can’t fix him. He needs to walk this road himself.
When my marriage was breaking up, at one point she asked why I was still there supporting her when she was being a complete b***h to me. I responded that I’d made my vows, I loved her and wasn’t going to abandon her in her worst time. Good response, yes? ABSOLUTELY NOT! She looked like she was going to physically vomit when I said that. She had complete disdain for my weakness. Six months later when she got dumped by AP and I served her with divorce papers, she told me “you must have never loved me” 😂😂😂
Keep working on your strength around him with your IC. Don’t be a love sick puppy running around under his feet waiting for him to fall back into your arms, that’s just going to annoy him and make reconciliation less likely. Be attractive, be fun, be missing.
Thanks Rock. Am always a bit harsh on myself unfortunately. Always been someone with a lot of drive and determination and positivity. So this whole life event has certainly taught me alot. I am not a fan of sitting back and not fixing things 🤣
I am just a tad confused should I just not be even observing his actions of caring behaviour or his own changes? Should I be ignoring them instead - does that somehow help detach more? I don’t want to become so cold toward him and ignore him, I thought it was about detaching from the rejection and the situation not pulling away and ignoring the actual person. Maybe I have that part confused. I don’t feel I need to cut off all contact completely, because I am fine in his presence now it doesn’t upset or phase me.
It is fine to notice H’s changes and behaviours.
Noticing; not obsessing. Nor inferring too much positive or negative meanings to a spouse’s behaviours. Time. Longer term, more consistent demonstrated behaviours give more data points and therefore a clearer picture. Still, things can and do change; especially whilst they are embroiled in their emotions and depression. Again, time. H’s journey is his, and it will be a while before he stops flip flopping about.
Cutting off contact - going dark; or less contact - going dim; is a tool, a strategy for the LBS to regain their balance. It’s not a modification tool to fix our spouse.
For LBS starting out, we are enmeshed with our spouse and the situation. We are not detached and suffer as we are uncontrollably dragged about by our spouse’s words and behaviours. Going dark/dim helps the LBS. After a while, the LBS is much less dragged about, much less hanging on to the rope. Detachment bringing a peace and a new perspective.
At this point, the LBS can ease back on the dimness. However, boundaries may need to be employed. This is similar to being dark, in that boundaries are for you. The difference is why.
One firsts goes dark for themselves. To shield themselves from the hurtful and constant barrage. Once one is healed enough and acquires a certain level of realizing / understanding - emotionally and intellectually - they find detachment. It’s here one moves from dark/dim to boundaries.
Boundaries are implemented due to our spouse’s behaviour, due to a spouse’s disrespect. It’s an important, yet subtle shift. A controlled response rather than the preemptive action.
As you stated, detached from the situation. It’s not ignoring H, and not being entangled. You live and move forward. You have controlled interactions (your side) with H during the limited exchanges. And enact boundaries when necessary; a high likelihood with a clinging boomerang.
That being said, time and space are still the best path forward. A spouse needs their space to consider and reconsider their choices. For a spouse who still interacts with the LBS, they will push and test you. And is when to enforce a boundary.
Detachment, indifference, withdrawal, letting go, discovering and organizing one’s beliefs, etc. Steps along the journey. Unearthing that which we hold dear, that which we will defend, that which is our life’s convictions; is the rock solid foundation upon which to build oneself. Know thy self, and know thy values. That, is the bedrock of boundaries and the why of how to interact.
Thanks Kind for that, and keeping me in check 😄😄. So very true I do apologise a lot, I think I have spent months since Bd just constant apologising too and I hate that for me. I completely agree now about spending less time beer or with him. I just have no desire anymore to keep doing the same dance to be honest. I am exhausted. I am spent. I feel so much lighter and better when I don’t have to see H and be reminded of his mess and lack of doing anything. So taking that on board now and going to keep an extremely wide berth. He wants “ space” and feels “smothered”( even though it was all him initiating on his terms), well then I’ll just remove myself from his picture
Had a great day with kids kids today did a lot of stuff, went for a run( have started running again and will try and work toward training for another half marathon in December) dinner out. I did get sad this evening and had a small cry. I couldn’t help itX the man who showered me with flowers and affection for so many years and now silence. I am selfish to even expect a token or anything, but just another cross against him in my books that he isn’t who he was and I don’t want this version.
I am much more at peace now. Today really did hurt me. In the past I would have been resistant to pull right back I would have allowed him to come and go again and play his game. Today sits different to the last few months. It’s almost like I have had an awakening to this all. Hey I do NOT deserve this, I do not want this version of my H, I deserve so much better than this. I’ve lost a lot of respect and hope.
I’m sorry for coming on here and venting. I feel I need to get it out ro people who get it and have walked in my shoes and don’t just brush MLc and all this aside. Thanks for all your advide, guidance, pushing and and keeping me going. The lighthouse still remains it’s just done focusing on a broken ship now
Just wanted to check in for the week. Still reading through my second time of DR and getting a bit more out of it this time. Have been out with friends on the weekend which was great fun full of food and wine, working, walking and working on my own self healing. A bit of meditating, reading, and honestly enjoying time to myself to reconnect with myself too. I even bought myself flowers on my way home from work last week.honestly just because I love flowers and they made my day.
I have also managed to just let the emotions happen and pass and not try to fight them and find things alot better now. The moments don’t happen often at all but sometimes my mind goes wondering and I beat myself up a bit. I’m still GAL as much as I can, trying to 180 in myself as a person and seen some major improvements. Situations where in the past I would have reacted differently toward kids or work, and just taking a moment to reassess and do the complete opposite and loving it for sure. I’m much calmer and balanced. It could be all the meditating I am doing at night before bed to unwind, or singing along to songs in the car on the way to work 😌
As for H he’s still around. I am now just kind of going with the flow. No heavy talks or anything coming up but he often asks if he can join me for a cup of tea or to watch some tv for a while and is being super chatty . I don’t bring anything up anymore, I can’t honestly tell you the last time I told him I loved him( even though I do). Conversations are very relaxed and fun( more than they have been in a year). He’s very interested in my work and life, complimenting my cooking even.He has mentioned a few times how he’s back at the gym and loving it and how hard it was last year when he never went( exercise and mental health is so important), he talks about work as well and makes jokes. I just sit and listen and smile and validate where I need to. There’s been a few compliments from him toward me and my appearance which is nice, a wink or two, and I even caught him staring at me smiling the other day when I was busying myself. He used to always compliment me in the past and I was so dumb I always just brushed it aside or didn’t give it much attention at all. It’s funny now having this happen and my self realisation how bad that was on my behalf to hurt his feelings like that by not at least acknowledging the compliment. You don’t realise how much you actually like it until it’s gone
I’m not reading anything into all of this behaviour,I know he’s still on a seesaw and until the day he wants to work on the relationship I will just let this slide and not get my hopes up. I have faith but I’m keeping my hopes on the low down. It’s good to see him changing within himself as a person though because he certainly was not a fun person to be around last year and this has been a big eye opener for me that I just plodded along the way co-existing in that negativity.
Just some observations I’ve made of H over the last week and worth a mention at least. He did thank me the other day for being patient with him. I just smiled and nodded. What else can you do really.
I’m still being upbeat and positive and trying to keep a positive mindset on everything I do now. I’m ok living in the unknown (gosh a month ago I wanted answers so bad) now I honestly don’t really care I am just getting on with life, working, planning outings, looking at hobbies, investing in the kids and home life. Hopefully he comes along for the ride eventually but I’m not putting my life on hold to find out. It’s up to him to keep up.
I know it’s wierd, my friends always ask what’s going on has anything happened. I just brush it aside now. It’s wierd living in the unknown really and in this state of limbo but it certainly doesn’t bother me as much anymore. I feel like I am really starting to create a healthy relationship with myself and it’s been a very long time indeed.
Unfortunately, you cannot presume that he wants to improve the marriage right now. If he seems to be doing everything that won't help, that might be because he wants exactly that.
Don't trust everything he says. He is speaking from fear and anger. What he does matters more than what he says.
I am in a similar situation. W has told her family, and I feel that there is a whole silent army lined up against me, since all they know is her perception of the story. I have always been nice to them, but not one has asked, "How are you holding up? How do you feel about this?"
Do what pleases you right now, what makes you strong.
It will be nice now not being around to blame I wonder whose fault it’s going to be in 6 months time when his issues still cloud him
That’s exactly it.
H looks around realizes Patt hasn’t been around, yet he still feels unhappy. Then maybe he thinks, hmmmm perhaps she wasn’t the cause or to blame. And maybe he looks inward and starts doing the work he needs to do.
That awakening will take as long as it takes. Some awaken rather quickly, some take years and years, and some stay lost for the remainder of their lives. He is on his sad path on his timeline.
When one is depressed they live in the past. Anxious you’re living in the future. At peace, one is living in the present.
MLCers are big time depressed. They remember, they live, those old past times. You can see this as H keeps bringing up stuff from a decade ago to throw at you. They presently have the memory of a gnat for appointments and responsibilities, yet have a steel trap for any faltering you do. It’s par for the course. He needs to burn his way through all that.
Originally Posted by Pattnee5
I can now see how whatever I do is irrelevant
Nothing you do matters, and yet everything does.
And like all the advice, it’s more for you. H, the marriage, are a bonus; you are the primary goal. For in saving oneself, you have the best chance at saving your marriage.
Sorry you’ve had a rubbish time Pattnee. Know we’re all here and we’ve all been there. You’re not alone!
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The fact he has entertained this idea even is absolute lunacy to me.
Here’s your old friend back again - expectation.
For a normal person, you’d expect them to identify this is a dumb move.
But for a MLC, crazy, possibly cheating WAS, this is completely normal behaviour.
You still need to keep working on this with your IC. You should expect that next week he will blame you on his social media, buy a MLC sports car, arrive with an 18yo girlfriend on his arm, and disappear overseas never to contact his kids for 6-12 months. You should expect him to continue to do dumb s*** and not be surprised or broken hearted by it.
He’s not doing it TO you. He’s just a person in deep emotional turmoil. He’s reached a point in his life where he is unhappy with himself, his decisions, his trajectory or something like that…. And he’s running away from facing it.
It just so happens that the easiest way for nearly all WAS/WS to do that is to (in their own mind) convince themselves that it’s not because they’re unhappy, but because it’s something external to them. Normally they land on blaming their spouse, so they’ll run as fast as they can in the other direction. Running overseas on a whim totally fits that narrative.
If your goal is 100% still to reconcile, to be frank, him running away overseas gives you a better chance. If he’s around you with a slow, painful divorce and remains unhappy, he can keep blaming you. If he disappears overseas for a year in a new job, with few friends, maybe has an affair and then he’s still unhappy - he may realise it wasn’t your fault and then arrive back home with his tail between his legs.
The slow burn divorce often cements it as a final outcome, because they build resentment for having to stay around or be involved when they want out. IMHO, a lot more MLC or affair driven crises would resolve in eventual reconciliation if the LBS kicked them onto the street on bomb day and WAS/WS disappeared overseas for a year. To that end, I don’t think him disappearing is the worst thing that could happen for chances of reconciliation.
The problem eventually becomes that you by the time he may wake up you will have decided you don’t want to be with someone so flippant and hurtful and selfish. I’d say the majority of non-reconciled members on this forum would refuse if their ex arrived begging for another chance.
Hang in there. This is the worst it will be, and from this point, life will slowly get better. Be the strongest, most stable Mum you can be. Unwavering in your support of your kids, never criticising their Dad, being their absolute rock.
Let his dumpster fire burn. The only way anything changes is if he alone has an epiphany.
Wanted to check in again. Been very up and down the last few days. Spoken to lawyer a few times and H a few times too about things. Made sure I put my “acquaintance “ face on when dealing with H face to face. I feel very empty even looking at him now.almost numb inside. I think I shocked H quite a few times too with the way I handled myself so maturely and calmly. I imagine he was waiting for me to beg and scream and when I didn’t and just talked amicably. Anyway I am just feeling a bit of a proud moment how much better I am handling myself face to face. It was always so hard before . I think I’ve noticed I am letting go. I don’t care or think about where he is what he might be doing when and if I will hear from him. All the stuff I used to cling to before.
Behind closed doors I have had tears in the arms of family and friends. Never in front of the kids and usually can dust myself off within a few minutes and keep going. the hollow numbness inside is what’s hard. I have been giving him a very wide berth. I just keep telling myself to keep swimming for now. Kids are happy I am making sure I and around them all the time and it’s amazing how healing they are ❤️🩹
At one point when my situation was at its worst, I went to a doctor to get a few days off work. He was a 70 year old man with white hair.
He listened carefully for a few mins, immediately wrote a certificate for a few a days, told me if I needed any more days off to come straight back, and then as I went to leave, he said “oh, one more thing I forgot…”
Bear in mind, he’s an old man and I’m a 41 year old male.
He stood up, walked around his desk, walked all the way over to me, and gave me a huge bear hug. For like ten seconds.
Then he eventually lets me go and says “I’ve been there. Divorce is the hardest thing you’ll ever do in your life. And sometimes you just need a random bear hug from a stranger to remind you the world is a good place and that everything, one day, will be okay.”
That hug was the best thing anyone did for me during my whole divorce.
