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DnJ, MikeP, Pattnee5, Ready2Change, Rockon, SteveLW, URS0
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#2945122 04/23/2023 10:18 PM
by Pattnee5
Pattnee5
In Dec ( a week before Christmas) my H dropped a bomb that he thinks he wants to separate. I didn’t even see it coming. I knew we had been both stressed with work and going through a busy time but I thought once christmas came and we relaxed everything would be okay. Boy was I wrong. Married 17 yrs together 20, 2 kids 14 and 12. I was blindsided, cried begged did everything I am not suppose to. Spent Christmas apart, he didn’t come to our family holiday then was away for work. Still remained in the house and was intimate affectionate and apparently was “trying” and wasn’t sure. I persisted to make everything amazing went to counselling made massive changes in myself and thought we were slowly getting through then in in March out of nowhere again he said he wants to move out and separate and he did. Again I probably did everything wrong, I was so sad, then I tried to be so happy and affectionate and welcome him home when he wanted (it’s still his home I still call him my husband) he would come and go come and make dinner bring me coffee hug me etc. I was being torn to pieces by people’s advice.

I think it’s a MLC but who knows. He kept making comments he is old he feels old he is tired he is exhausted. He buried himself in work, has withdrawn socially for the last 12 months and literally plays video games to avoid spending time with me (this has all come to light now as I self reflect). He has changed massively as a person in the last 12 months and I was so busy I didn’t even see it. He’s 48. Needed glasses and procrastinated for. Months before finally getting them.

Anyway I have heard it all from “I don’t love you” to “I don’t think I ever loved you” I don’t want to be married anymore etc. So many hurtful things. He has also had a few times of not being able to “perform” in the bedroom. There is nobody else, he is literally working, going to the gym to get his muscles back because he used to always love having a good body and let it go, and being a dad and doing stuff for the kids.

It’s a month now since he’s gone and I am still so so lost. He’s the love of my life I keep telling him how much I love him. He was never great at opening up but a few weeks ago we had a big deep and meaningful and he said how good it felt. I asked him what’s going on and he said he doesn’t know and he’s not ready to fully call it over as it’s so final and he doesn’t want to make a decision to be done and regret it, but also doesn’t want to make a decision to come home and do the same thing to me. What an absolute mindf&$k. I am trying to be so patient. I have DR book coming today from Amazon. I’ve read Gottman 7 principles I have been continuing with counselling solo (he won’t go).

Recently I had major surgery a week ago and he is always checking in making sure I’m ok wanting to come and help and cook. It’s so many mixed messages. I feel lost and exhausted. I am hanging on and being patient because if I can ride this out to have another 40 years with him it’s worth it. His signs and actions speak of someone who loves me but he says he doesn’t and just likes me as a friend and cares about me. I don’t buy it, I’ve known him since our 20s this isn’t his normal self he would never be this hurtful.

We went through a really rough patch 9yrs ago and I had an affair but he told me he forgave me and we rebuilt and had amazing times and he never once bought it up. Now he brings it up again, he also became a heavy drinker the last 6 months in his reclusive state.

I still feel like I am on a seesaw. When does it start getting better because my mind is still overthinking everything and praying he returns. We went about 10 days no visual contact or crossing paths recently but then I had my surgery and he wanted to see me and be around to help. I don’t know how to navigate this anymore. I know he is going through his own stuff and doesn’t want me a part of his process but it’s still so hard I am petrified another bomb gets dropped and he says we are done for good. He took his wedding ring off the day he moved out. It broke my heart.
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#2945203 Apr 27th a 11:16 AM
by Kind18
Kind18
I’m not sure why you’re being so hard on yourself.

He got angry because the truth hurts sometimes 🤷‍♂️ He sounds like a big baby.

Once you said what you said, you shouldn’t have apologised to try and smooth things over.

You need to get comfortable with being uncomfortable.

The real mistake here is interacting with him. Interactions lead to tensions boiling over and then people getting butt-hurt.

You seem afraid of conflict, and then revert back to trying to placate him by being nice.

If the truth dart hurt, maybe he needs to ask himself why.

Best thing you could have done after saying “I’m not the one who walked out” - laugh out loud, get up and do some dishes and act as if nothing happened.

Trust me when I say this… one day you’ll look back on this and realise how unimportant this one interaction was in the big scheme of things. You’ll probably even be annoyed at yourself that you were so worried about it.

It’s the tiniest of speed bumps and not nearly as bad as you imagine. Ignore it and get on with life 👍
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#2945154 Apr 25th a 03:55 AM
by Pattnee5
Pattnee5
I keep re-reading the detach forum and validation. Z
I feel like I need a cheat sheet so I don’t say the wrong thing. It’s almost like I need to think before I talk now 😂😂
Half way through reading DR ❤️ best way to recover from major surgery. Man I have been doing everything so wrong. So so wrong
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#2945204 Apr 27th a 11:27 AM
by SteveLW
SteveLW
Patt, we LBSs tend to overthink everything, and that's what you did here. The mistake, to me, wasn't staying the truth. The mistake was being so engaging with him to begin with. You said he came to cook dinner because you are still out of commission, but then say you cooked together? So which is it? If he is there to help then stay out of the kitchen and let him cook!

Don't start conversations and don't initiate affection. And certainly do not apologize when you tell him the truth! He did walk out. So what if that made him angry? Remember, you can't nice him back. There will be times when for are properly DBing where he will become angry. Because in DBing you're taking his cake away. But that is the only way he'll consider coming back. Because right now he is living the dream! Freedom but still gets to play house.

The other thing about DBing, no one does it well at first. The key is to learn from your mistakes. So learn from this. You're engaging him too much, so stop that. Don't apologize when he gets angry. Those are your two biggest learnings right now.
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#2945464 May 9th a 09:50 PM
by DejaVu6
DejaVu6
Hi Pattnee.

I so recall all of the emotions and fears that you and MA talk about. Now being four and a half years post BD, I can tell you that I know for certain that things will get better if you GAL for yourself...regardless of what your H does. It is so, so important... I cannot stress it enough. Force yourself to get out there. Do not turn down any invitations from anyone. Fake it until you make it. Slowly, over time, you won't have to fake it anymore. I remember people telling me this and being so afraid that if I didn't have to fake it, that would mean I no longer loved my H and the life we had together will be rendered pointless or a figment of my wishful thinking. Now I know that is impossible. No one can take that away from you. You just have to look at your kids and know that is true. What was, was. What is, is. For your own sake, you need to focus on accepting that last statement and worry less about what he is doing or thinking and more about what you are doing and thinking. The rope you are hanging on to is wobbly for a reason. It's wobbly because you are the only person who is hanging onto it right now. He has dropped it and likely did so long before you noticed the wobble.

Re: inviting your H on the ski trip. Do NOT do it!! You are way past taking a mini break together and fixing things. Right now the ball is fully in your H's court. He is still enjoying most of the perks that comes with having a partner. That is not helping you. He needs to miss you. He needs to recognize what he would be losing. He can't do that when you are around him all of the time. Take your ski vacation with your kids and let him wonder what he is missing. And do not contact him when you are away. Let him think you are having too much of a good time to bother getting in touch. I know this is not what you want to do. Been there AND ignored the advice I am giving you now. Now that I am this far past BD, I cringe when I think of the times I did what I intuitively wanted to do and it did nothing but push him the other direction. Trust me. You do NOT want to be in that position.

All of it is easier said than done, I know. Trust me... it does get better. (((HUGS)))
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#2945141 Apr 24th a 12:35 PM
by SteveLW
SteveLW
Pattnee, please read DR. You're making a lot of mistakes. This is not a chatisement but I'm trying to get you to see where you need to change how you deal with him. You're holding on for dear life and that's almost certainly a guarantee he'll never come back.

I always feel bad for LBWs. LBWs feel a obligation to keep having sex with their walkaway husband. It's as if the LBW feels "if I give him what he wants physically, then the emotional and mental will eventually come around". The problem is that most guys are perfectly fine with, and actually love, having unattached sex. For WAHs l, having sex with their LBW is having their cake, and eating it too. They get to have the pleasure of a wife (sure thing) without the responsibility of being a husband.

As far as your affair 9 years ago. That's water under the bridge. However, he's using it as an excuse for what he is doing now. It's an easy scapegoat. But it's complete bologna. He's been okay with it for 8-9 years and suddenly now he's not ok with it again? Too convenient. Listen, all of us heard about past transgressions in our situations. And they always get blown up to be even bigger than they actually were. He has an easy excuse to hold onto for what he's doing, but no judge or jury in the world would ever lend a shred of credence to it. So if you're beating yourself up over what happened 9 years ago, you should stop. You've made up for it and proved that you are past it. He did too.

Here is my immediate advice for you:

Stop saying "I love you". When your say that all you are doing is reminding him that he doesn't feel that way anymore.
Stop having sex with him. Take his cake away. When he protests (he will protest this one!), just simply state "I'm no longer comfortable being intimate with someone that doesn't want to be with me."
Read DR. Cover to cover. And start implementing the DBing tactics. You're already in IC, that's a great start.
Learn to listen and validate him. Read the sticky thread on validation. Be sure to do this right away, you'll need validation as a skill to deal with his protests over no longer having sex.

Finally, I know you've convinced yourself that there is no one else. However, I see a huge red flag on the gaming. Is it online gaming? If so, I'd bet dollars to donuts that there is at minimum an emotional affair with someone on the game. I've seen this a lot with gamers. Have a good friend who lost his wife to someone on an online game. In fact, he very well could be using you as his sexual outlet with her (she likely lives somewhere pretty far away). Let that sink in, and remember that if you have any qualms about stopping the sex.

DBing is about changing your approach. Gottman is great for strengthening marriages when there are two spouses at least willing to try. DBing is about changing your approach when your spouse has walked away.
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#2945185 Apr 26th a 11:57 AM
by MA1970
MA1970
Hi P, I'm really new to this too with my H BD being mid Feb. My H admitted to OW. I would completely echo what Steve is saying. Lessons I've learned along the way (& still actively learning) are that my H isn't any different than the hundreds of other stories on this forum. I really thought & still want to believe he is but his behaviour is very familiar to others. As such, I'm learning to trust the process. Admittedly, I still get hooked in and that's where people like Steve, DnJ, Kind help reset me. They have the experience and although some messages can feel harsh and I've certainly wanted to kick against them, they gave proved to be right.

Another massive learning for me has been the concept of time. Its all really awful and you just want certainty about when it will end (especially for a control freak like me!) But when you sit down and look at the bigger picture, it ends when it ends and there is nothing we can do to speed that process along. I was certain I wouldn't try and nice him back into loving me but as soon as he uttered those pre ious words "I think I've made a mistake", I was back sleeping with him, offering to cook meals, even offering to do his laundry!! I am shocked at my own behaviour. Its so unlike me & not what I want to be.

It helped me to sit down and write what I want a future relationship to look like, what values I want the oerson to have and what I want our life to be like. I then matched this against H current behaviours & they are poles apart. Detaching is really hard work. It comes and goes for me. When my emotions are really strong either from fear or sadness, I can easily get sucked back in to predicting the future and trying to initiate some certainty. My only words would be to try and notice when this happens & have a little list of what helps. On my list is walking, mindfulness meditation, speaking to my close team of friends, helping D do revision, cooking and cleaning. Different activities work better for different strengths of thoughts.

Most of all, I'm trying to be kind to myself. I'm moving slightly towards an angry stage with H & I think that is probably healthy but also risky to make sure I don't follow those instant urges to tell him how hurtful and cruel he's been. I'm still on the side of standing for now but actually thoughts of a future without him are also creeping in.

Keep posting, the vets on here are amazing. Take my words with a pinch of salt because I am a newbie in the grand scheme of things but they are my reflections on my experience of the first few months. BTW, I asked H to leave our home when he admitted to OW and wanted to continue living home life with us but still see her. This was the best thing I did and released a whole load of pressure overnight. Different strokes for different folks though.
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#2945230 Apr 28th a 04:47 PM
by Cadet
Cadet
Originally Posted by Pattnee5
He just said his emotions and is head is all a mess and he doesn’t know what he wants, and I guess someone who has bottled stuff up for so many years and never learnt to talk is struggling with it


He IS confused, that part is true.
Just remember that you need your own boundaries too.

Remember to believe nothing he says and half of what he does.

Start living for you,
you are not waiting for him - that is not going to work.
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#2945235 Apr 28th a 06:27 PM
by SteveLW
SteveLW
Wise words from Cadet. One of the biggest mistakes that LBSs make is taking a WAS at their word.
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#2945247 Apr 28th a 10:34 PM
by Pattnee5
Pattnee5
Thankyou Mike yes I ended up stopping the “dropping” by as H wants a few weeks ago. It was too emotional for me. Now I always know when he’s coming and he always asks.
Thankyou Cadet and Steve. I think for now giving myself a fixed date in my mind ( without H knowing) of when I am giving it to might be good for my own peace of mind just so I don’t keep thinking each day “ is today the day he wants to come home “
I certainly plan on GaL too when I can.
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#2945313 May 2nd a 01:08 PM
by SteveLW
SteveLW
Detachment is a process. Many LBWs especially have trouble with it because you all make the marriage staying together a matter of life and death in your head. Read the Sticky "You will not die". Once you get to a place emotionally where you know you'll be fine, better fine, your life will be awesome no matter what happens, then detachment becomes easier.

While you are holding on so tight, you'll never start detaching. You've heard the analogy of dropping the rope haven't you? Let go of the rope....
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#2945389 May 5th a 07:44 PM
by SteveLW
SteveLW
Pattnee, DBing is about consistency.

I see you quoting "believe nothing he says and only half of what he does". Then a few posts later "he says there's is no one else and I fully trust him". Huh? Which one is it?

One of the things I learned in my situation was that something had to change. Either I had to change my behavior or my marital status had to change. What I see from you is that you're holding on for dear life for things to go back to the way they were. How do I see that? Because you want to try to do the things that someone does to win someone new over. Problem: your husband isn't new. You've got history. Resentments built up. Past hurts. Mistakes, problems and worries. You don't have that with a new person. So you cannot treat your marriage like you could if you were starting over with someone new. Those tactics to win someone over will not work.

Another reason they won't work is he's seen that movie before. And he knows it is not sustainable long term. You simply can't be in limerance, do all the right things mode, forever. He knows that. Deep down you know that too. Even if becoming super wife could delay the inevitable, it would only be a delay. As soon as you became regular old wife Pattnee again he'd be off looking for something else.

So if you have to change something, and what comes intuitively has no chance of working, what is left? That's the power of DBing. GAL. 180s. Detachment. Removing all pressure and pursuit. Taking all of the focus of him and the marriage and putting it on yourself. That's the only real choice here. Trying to stay the same or treat him like you'd treat a new boyfriend will only cause the thing you fear most to come about.

The right answer to DNJ's question is: I don't know. I don't know if there is someone else or not. But regardless, it doesn't change what I need to do. See the difference?
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#2945417 May 8th a 12:19 PM
by Pattnee5
Pattnee5
I am just coming on here to vent. Nothing has happened to cause this I have just had a very flat feeling day and feel deflated, sad, tired. My patience is low. I’m sure all very common and you all had these moments. I know they pass, but sadness and loneliness creeps in from time to time and I miss H. I still believe in soulmates and believe he is mine. Sometimes I hate being a female and all our romanticised ideas and beliefs and fairytales. I’m still doing alot of my own personal work, trying to grow and learn more, read more, self improve. I have started to give myself a set time to grieve as suggested on here And feel and let the emotions go. However I am so sick of crying too.
My DB is going good, worked a bit today, spent time with the kids, walked the dog with friends then had dinner with kids. I never used to be a patient person, I think the biggest lesson I am going to take away from this is how patient I can become. This certainly stinks and is difficult. I still love him so very much. I’m telling you guys because I know I can’t tell H
😅
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#2945449 May 9th a 02:55 PM
by MA1970
MA1970
Hi Pattnee
As you know, I'm fairly new to this too. My own experience is exactly like yours. There are days / hours / minutes that I feel strong & am able to let go of the rope and there are times I'm hanging on to it like a lifeline. My head tells me to let go but I've noticed that the specific emotion of fear keeps bubbling away and pulling me into that tug .

One of the big things that helps me is taking a step back and thinking of time as my friend. I was with H for 26 years & BD was a few months ago! Theres plenty of time for R if that is what lies ahead. My inability to manage uncertainty & desire for control keeps me hooked in. I want an end date but I could well shoot myself in the foot if I push too much for that. It must be much worse for you having so much contact with your H. I am pretty much no contact at the minute. My emotions only tend to spike when H sees daughter & she feeds back. Otherwise, I can focus on me and GAL. I've had a wobble today after he had contact with D. I tend to use my small team when that happens. I just allow myself to experience the sadness. I'm grieving for my life that was. Even if we do eventually R, the relationship will never be the same again.

Like you said, try to recognise the small stuff. The big stuff is going to take much longer, especially if you're looking at the long game. You sound like you're doing everything you can at this stage so big high five on that. Keep going Pattnee
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