I'm going out myself to a club with a DJ along with some friends, so there's that.
Originally Posted by LH19
Yikes separate nights out on New Years Eve. Nothing like being in a club at middle age lol but I applaud you for trying.
How'd it go at the club last night?
Originally Posted by Doug54
Christmas went well. W literally bought one gift for one of our children and I did all the rest. I'm willing to give her a partial pass since Christmas wasn't part of her upbringing and she knew I was going to handle most of the kid stuff, but dang. She's mailing it in sometimes.
It's not fair, but continue to pick up her slack when it comes to the kids - it's not their fault.
Originally Posted by Doug54
There was one day when my parents had the kids out for quite a while and W and I went for a walk like old times and had nookie twice.
Originally Posted by LH19
If you want to shake up the status quo maybe you take cake/sex off the table?
Curious how these situations arise considering the situations. I've read on here some people continue having sex for awhile, but mine was not one of them - not even close to anything physical (hug, kiss...whatever) after BD.
To me you have to go into it honestly knowing it might not mean much and you just enjoy the physical act, which is probably easier said than done when you're the one who wants to keep the marriage/family together. If it's hurting your detachment it may not be helpful.
Originally Posted by Doug54
Sandi said it best to another poster a while back - "She wants to feel free and you are treating her like she is still your W...which she is, but she doesn't want to feel like she is your W. That is the point. She wants to be free and she doesn't want you controlling her life."
Yep - they're all striving to be "free" of their problems/unhappiness and believe it's you, when more often it's them.
Doug, I'm going to ask you a few questions. You don't need to answer them here, but at least please think about them.
1. Which one of you is racing towards Divorce court faster? It's been 2.5 years, and she's still there, in your home, with you. So, do you want to try to save this marriage or not?
2. What have you gained from all your sleuthing? Has it made you a better person? A better husband or father? How has it improved your life?
3. What about yourself are you avoiding by putting so much focus on your wife and her actions, and why are you avoiding it?
is this really how you feel or is this anger talking?
I'm starting to feel like I would prefer to cut bait when the time (financially) is right. Read LH's post in this thread about how he now realizes what it's like to be treated right and not feel anxiety whenever his wife's phone vibrates. I wouldn't say that last part applies to me in that exact form, but W's phone is definitely part of the duplicitousness.
Originally Posted by bttrfly
Focus on yourself. What do you want? What are your core values? How do you want to spend the rest of your life?
Trust and companionship would be two important ones if we're talking about relationships. I don't want to spend the rest of my life with someone willing to have affairs. Sometimes what gets broken doesn't go back together again.
So, I think I may have figured out who the OM is. It’s not someone I know directly.
Do you know OM's circumstances? (How old is he? is he married? In town or far away? ...etc.). Although I agree with others you should do your best not to dwell on him (though in my experience that's easier said than done) and to instead focus on yourself, some of those answers might inform your actions.
Originally Posted by Doug54
Does this change anything?
Probably not. It's was always very likely there was a affair...in any of these situations.
Originally Posted by Doug54
Should I tell W that I know, or drop the name to see her reaction?
Usually folks here advise not to reveal what or how much you know. First, your gut is almost always right so if you think it's a particular guy it likely is. Second, you can confirm it 100% if you really want to without floating it for her reaction. Third, she'll like fake a reaction and lie to you anyway. Fourth, you'll reveal your cards and she'll be extra careful hiding it.
Originally Posted by Doug54
I am leaning towards divorce but am stuck in the house with W for the time being.
Don't react emotionally. Process your feelings before making any decisions - and I'm sure you have some.
Originally Posted by Doug54
I forgot to add that she flipped out a little about thinking I may have a tracker on her car or had hired a PI the last time we argued, over her website visit.
Did you?
Originally Posted by Doug54
I was like, “is that something an innocent person says?”
No, it's not. She's projecting her guilty feelings onto you.
Originally Posted by Doug54
I think it’s fairly clear this bs with the guy has been going on in some form for quite a while. The meetup frequency can’t be often at all, but still.
Like LH & R2C said...don't be so sure. It's incredible the stories of how the WS met up with AP.
Originally Posted by Doug54
I like you bttrfly, but this feels like gaslighting.
Doug - bttrfly is asking you a whole bunch of really important questions. She's not gaslighting you. You're likely worked up about OM's identity. Trust me, I've been there. That's completely understandable. But once you step back you should do some self-reflection on bttrfly's questions.
I still struggle internally with a mindset of "As long as you're living in the house and we're not divorced or separated, it's not ok that you're effing around, up to no good on your phone or whatever else." I don't say that but it permeates my thoughts at times.
I understand your struggle with her behaviour. You cannot control what she does.
Originally Posted by Doug54
And my ego still gets in the way of having a complete attitude of "who cares what W is up to?"
A few thoughts for you.
It’s not about being non-caring. I still care what XW is up to (at times). It’s that those thoughts don’t drag me around; don’t limit my life, behaviour, or actions; nor do those thoughts or her behaviours define me.
It’s about accepting. And as you see, ego plays a part in that struggle. “It’s not ok that you’re effing around…”, yep true. And what can you do about it? Can you prevent it? Nope. Can you force her to not? Nope. Can you influence her? Maybe. Can you alter yourself? Find peace? Yes.
You can care what she is doing, and let go.
Ego. Telling yourself “it’s not ok”, is judging her. And that reinforces your emotions. Drags you around. Let that go. It’s for God to judge her, not you.
How to let go? Realize, yes it is not ok, or wanted, or proper, or right, etc, for a married women to behave that way. (You got that step. We all get that step pretty fast.)
Then, understand her behaviour/running. Realize why (more or less). That brings about compassion and empathy. I think you are doing well in this as well.
All this allows one to let go their self need to be right, to control. To put aside their ego, even just temporarily, until being nonjudgemental becomes a core value, a belief. You likely have some inclination of the trauma(s) W suffered in her early years. Not an excuse for her, however a reason to find acceptance and forgiveness. Ask yourself, if you suffered the same, where would you’ve ended up? Fate, luck, whatever it is, you and I are on paths different than our respective spouse’s. Realize how blessed that is. Rather humbling. And should highlight the influence of one’e ego upon one’s perception.
Acceptance and forgiveness. Accepting does not mean condoning. Condoning is ignoring something morally wrong or offensive, to allow its continuation. From a few steps up, you realize the immorality of it, and you realize you cannot prevent it. You are not ignoring and allowing, for the continuation is solely up to W. That’s acceptance in a nutshell.
Forgiving is completely upon you. Nothing W can do will earn her forgiveness, in so much as you need to see some behaviour or hear some words before bestowing your forgiveness. That’s not how forgiveness works. In fact, you likely won’t (and probably shouldn’t) ever even tell her. You find it within yourself to let go the grudge and write paid in full upon the bill, and your actions will display such.
Your path is to place your focus elsewhere, a good place is upon yourself and kids; to live and love your life; and give W time and space. That doesn’t mean ignore W, more just let her to her path and journey, while you traverse your’s.
Fortunately, your two paths still interact. Becoming the best version of yourself, is awesome for you, and maximizes your chances of reconciling.
There are three people you can choose to focus on: 1) Your Wife 2) OM 3) yourself
Which one are you going to have the most control over?
Originally Posted by Ready2Change
As I read through the forums on Divorce Busting, I like to grab the nuggets of gold and share.
My advise, commit to personal growth. What you judge in others, you condemn in yourself. Take all the focus off of your spouse and address your own issues. How hard is it to change your own behavior? Now think how hard (almost impossible) to change someone else.
If you have kids, commit to being the best parent ever. Frequent and equal contact with both parents is important. You are responsible for your relationship with your kids. Let your spouse be responsible for their relationship with the kids. Learn new ways of parenting. Lots of great books out there. Most of the relationship skills dealing with spouse will also help in parenting.
Set goals for the future and keep taking steps to get there. Do this in all areas (SPIES - Social, Physical, Intellectual, Emotional, Spiritual.) Get in alignment (Beliefs, Thoughts, Body Language, Tones, Words, Actions) with your core values.
Try new ways of interacting. Read about boundaries and learn how to set and enforce them. Be in the present. Let go of the past and do not fear the future. Learn ways of being more attractive, especially in your behavior. Learn ways of being seductive (indirectly attracting). This is an extremely important set of skills to understand.
The best way to respond to a particular event? Initially, the best action to take is no action. Do your homework here. Do not react emotionally. Stay neutral. Seek wise council here. Evaluate all the different options and the possible outcomes of each. Challenge your current beliefs. Make a choice and live with the consequences, good or bad. Things are predictable. Read and read and read. Get mentally ahead of your spouse in the whole process ASAP, they are ahead right now.
As far as your spouse, until you have enough info to prove this wrong, assume there is another person (Hint: This is your first 180). Do not reveal anything about what you know and how you found out. "We both know that is a lie." is a great way to deal with any deception.
I wish everyone well during these difficult times. Remember that everything will be OK no matter what the WAS chooses.
