Summary so far: H asked for a D and after I kicked him out I discovered he was having an affair with an ex-GF. For a while, I wanted to reconcile but after he made no effort to end his AF, I accepted the D but made him the one to file. He's off living his new life with his new partner in another state. I am still acting as step-mom to the boys I helped raise. I have moved into an apartment and I'm in the process of getting settled now that I am able to begin this new life I've been given.
Friends and Family: My SSs are staying somewhat in touch and are off living their young lives. My mom is very supportive, although she is not happy in her marriage so sometimes talking to her can be emotionally exhausting, but I learned to set some boundaries and that is helping. I have other family that feel that I should be happy that I am not in a relationship with this person they now hate, and they don't understand why I am still unhappy, struggling, stressed etc. If you look at the list of all the things not to say to someone going through trauma, they pretty much have said all those things to me. I try to not judge them too much, as they are helping me in other ways (financially) but it is still very hard to not be able to turn to your family members with the truth of the feelings you are struggling with. Most friends have been supportive and that has helped.
My emotional state: I'm starting to feel again and I've been doing IC. After years of stress and trauma, I've been suffering from emotional numbness and/or detachment. In many ways I have been doing better (my health has improved and I am functioning) but the emotional issues are dragging on. My IC feels that dating again will help to deal with these issues. So I'm considering looking at that in the coming months. I have accepted the D, I've come to terms with what I've learned about my XH and how he treated me, but I still do not really feel "alive" or excited about life yet. So this journey for me is ongoing.
No, not rhetorical . I would love to know what everyone’s view of healed enough to pursue a relationship again. Or even to just date
This is certainly a good part of the answer
Originally Posted by Ginger1
I agree, trying to fill one void with something unrelated never works.
Additionally it's also where you are no longer fighting "the last war". Where your former partner, the good, the bad, the whatever has no bearing on the person you might match up with. Certainly learning lessons like "hoarders can be difficult to live with" is important of course.
In my admittedly small experience with dating I have found that what some people are looking for is a more acceptable version of the person they used to have in their lives. In both cases the person I was dating tried to change my behaviour and lifestyle to match what they were used to. I'll keep buttoning up my shirt and not wearing gold chains, and it will be me that writes cards and picks out presents for my own children - thank you very much
And at least from my point of view there's more out to the question than just "healed enough". There's also the willingness to open yourself up to another, to take risks and to have the "space" in your life that could be occupied by another. For me, I'm quite sure that I'm "healed enough" - but those last 3 questions hold me back still.
• I did my best to be the kind of wife and mother my XH needed/wanted
• I realize now that I felt I wasn’t enough for him, and that I didn’t do enough
• I realize now that I was never going to be “enough” for him, or do “enough” for him
• I am proud of the way I treated my XH and the ways I tried to show my love and support and partnership in my MR
• I realize now that I WAS ENOUGH
• I realize now that his affair and his treatment of me was not because of who I am/was
• I realize now it was my responsibility to do my part in the marriage, and it was his responsibility to do his part
• I realize now that he chose NOT to do his part, and that’s on him
Throughout my journey, I had felt so much shame. It feels good to be able to take responsibility for my parts (I’m not perfect and I wasn’t perfect) and let go of the parts that were never mine to own. When you are deep in crisis, it’s so hard to see things clearly enough to process them. But, newbies, as you move forward on your journey’s, you will see things so much more clearly. And when emotions settle you can process the experiences more clearly. Better days are ahead! Keep moving forward, growing, and most importantly, be forgiving of yourself along the way!
El, I'm sorry you're contemplating leaving. I get it. I am going to do my best to keep checking in on the MLC side. Life's gotten quite busy lately here, so I'm not able to spend as much time here as before.
I recently went on an outing with many friends from my past...some that I have not seen in over 5 years. I was a bit worried that the visit would feel awkward. That everyone would want to hear the scoop on what has happened to me (many of them are aware already through others). I worried that I would get passive-aggressive comments about my lack of staying in touch (which I was getting when in my MR and we started to do less with these folks). Some of them had also started to see what my XH was like before I did, so they started to not care for him much.
I went fearing all of this but just decided to be open and friendly and enjoy myself, regardless. And I had a wonderful time and everyone was lovely and supportive. And I also received a lot of comments about how well I looked, how I glowed with happiness, etc. So that felt good! Of course, many of them had not seen me while my health had nose-dived, weight gain, hair falling out, skin a mess...etc.
My XH has been reaching out over little things that are not important to reach out for. I responded to one thing as minimally as possible but the other one was not a question, so I didn't even respond. I know he took the OW to visit the family (as I saw it on social media from other relatives that I am connected with), which bothered me a bit (yes, I can admit that). Even though I mostly felt like "go ahead...I hope she feels awkward around your family that supports me and loves me". I did get some lovely texts from a few of them during this time...not mentioning her or that they were there, but just to check in with me and to let me know they love me and miss me. Which really was lovely. I'm sure they will be nice to her, but I do not think she will ever be fully accepted. But that is their circus to live with. The timing of his messages is just interesting...but expected I guess.
After all the moving and stress I've been under this year, I have really put in some extra time on self-care these last few weeks. I put off all the settling in and other stressors that I could. I've lost some weight (fasting and exercise) and I'm physically and emotionally feeling so much better. It's amazing how when you are buried in stress and physically exhausted, how hard it is to feel better. And also shows how critical extra time for self-care is! My training course is going decently well and a job I am interested in came up recently. I need to get my resume together to apply, which with all the moving, is a project that fell behind. A gal that used to work with me and my XH is part of the management team at this company, so I am not sure how much she knows about my situation with the D or what she thinks of XH. But I'm just going to be open and excited and just see what happens. All I can control is me. Right?
In many ways I have been doing better (my health has improved and I am functioning) but the emotional issues are dragging on. My IC feels that dating again will help to deal with these issues. So I'm considering looking at that in the coming months.
I'm with DnJ on this one. If you're ready to date, go for it, but don't do it as a means to process through your emotional issues. That's not a good idea.
Originally Posted by Elbereth
Now that my D is finalized, there is a part of me that wants to reach out to my XH's OW's husband. I am curious about what he went through. They were M a very long time. And I am sure he knew about my XH as OW had a relationship with him before she met her H. Is this a terrible idea?
I'd be careful with this one. He's likely hurting as well. You two might open up old wounds or get attached to each other as a way to heal which wouldn't serve either of you.
I can only speak for myself, so this is my own definition, a standard I hold for myself: being whole as an individual. not looking for a relationship to fill a void, because there's no void to fill.
Put another way:
I know that I trust myself.
I know that trusting myself means that regardless of external circumstances, I can take care of myself, my inner self, in ways that I couldn't before BD.
Betrayal is a biotch, but the biggest betrayal is when we betray ourselves - our values, our instincts, our inner voice. I don't claim to have all the answers or even some. I just know that I trust myself more than I ever have, and I won't betray myself, my values, my inner guide.
I don't need any external validation. Nice to have, not necessary to my existence.
I don't need a romantic relationship to fill anything - I'm complete as I am.
To me, that means if someone compelling comes along, I'd probably be open to exploring possibilities with that person. Why the probably qualifier? Because I've so bloody much on my plate for the next two months I don't really see any way to ease open time to do something justice; keeps me focused on my path as a solo artist.
First off....this is MY answer, and everyone is different....
I think that if one has to ask if they are ready, typically, they aren't....
After my Divorce, I spent a lot of time in my own head, dealing with my issues, my responsibility to the part I played in my failed marriage. Gave it plenty of headspace, and dealt with things accordingly.
What I also did, was to make a template, or checklist, of everything that I would like in my next relationship.
I got to a point where I was much like E here, I knew the right words, I was pretty sure that I was where I wanted to be, yet I wasn't sure because I was never really up against those things.
I got to a point where I started to become sure, and trusting myself again, that I wouldn't fall back into old patterns and behaviors.
The last hurdle was forgiving myself, that I wouldn't be that person again....
And I know that ^^^ is deep, probably deeper than it needs to be for this...
Eventually, I stopped asking the questions about it. Was I ready, wasn't I...
It didn't matter as long as I was true to myself.
What also happened, was that I just wanted to live my life, didn't matter what else happened. I wasn't looking for anyone, wasn't hoping for anyone, I just wanted to have fun, and enjoy living again.
Being healthy and whole was more important.
I gave up all of that control up to the Universe, and whatever happened, would happen.
And when I met K, I wasn't looking at all....
It just kinda happened, because I was ready to accept fully what I wanted and would need to be in a relationship again.
It actually went against what I wanted, which was to just be me again...
If someone would have asked, I would have possibly said...'I don't know'.
Yet it wouldn't have been a 'yes' or a 'no'. I really hadn't thought about it much for a long time.
I get that what I did, isn't for everyone....that's the path that I took ....
And that is what drives my advice...
If you have to ask, chances are, you aren't....
So I guess to summarize, since I seem to be rambling a bit....
Trust, Forgiveness, making sure I don't bring any old baggage with me...??
Healing fully so that one is ready for whatever comes their way ??
Knowing fully who I was, so that I could recognize Red Flags early on ? (not that I had to worry about those in hindsight). Yet I would have if they were to have existed.
I guess the best thing I did, was to make that template for what I would and wouldn't accept in a relationship...
I would hold that template up against anyone that would, or could possibly enter my life.
That ^ was actually harder than I thought it would be, thanks though...
I’ll throw my two cents into the pot, based upon my journey and viewpoints of self.
Trusting in your self and your beliefs and convictions play a big part. A really big part. And trust is earned, just like it is earned from someone else. It is earned from respect. Self respect and self trust, leads to faith of self.
For me the first stage towards healed and whole, was knowing. The understanding of those values and beliefs I am strengthening and I aspire to. Oddly, the second step was feeling it. Emotionally connecting to trusting and such. A mind and heart union as it were. Lastly, is believing it. I liken it to the soul. This is one’s faith in self. Beyond knowing. Beyond feeling. And encompassing both.
Everyone sees the world through their own lens. A person who has difficultly extending trust to others, has difficult trusting themselves. They may know the trust they are after, yet at this time not feel or have faith within themselves. Respect, compassion, forgiveness, loyalty, etc. all similarly extended, or not.
The principles of self shine outward. One is open to others. Has faith in their fellow man. And can risk gain. A healed person will be ok when/if they get hurt. They do not fear being destroyed again. There is a strength in such knowledge and faith.
There are no voids that need to be filled. And yes, I mean “need”. Nature abhors a vacuum or void. After bomb drop, half my life was ripped away. The remaining chunk was smashed and destroyed. I was like most who find themselves here upon these shores, I was hurt, lost, standing within the wreckage, and had such a void within me. A void which demanded attention.
Detachment, letting go, indifference, withdrawal, compassion, forgiving, etc, all steps along a path of rebuilding. Steps which addressed and assuaged my void. Steps of grief and finding acceptance and forgiveness and such. One is not whole if one has a void within.
Life provides plenty of feedback for those who wish to, or are willing to hear and heed. My analytical mindset and technical predisposition melded well with the most fortunate advice/suggestions I received here. Counterintuitive positive actions lead to positive tangible feedback. Which lead to understanding and further positive steps and actions bringing about more feedback.
At times, life’s feedback was negative. I hazard to say negative, for it’s heeding that feedback that lead to learning and growing. In that sense, negative is really quite positive in effect, when one listens and heeds.
In the end, becoming healed and whole, shifts one’s perspective. And one’s situation and reality is defined by one’s perspective.
I think it’s deceptively simple, this question of when yo date. - you should be sure that you’ll never take your ex back even if they came crawling - because it’s terribly unfair to a new partner to dump them for your ex.
- you need to be healed enough that you can make healthy choices in terms of whom you date. It’s too easy to grab the first thing to fill that void, or to repeat old patterns that led to you picking your ex in the first place.
In my case, I’d been DBing my marriage for years, had one successful reconciliation after his affair, and when he finally left, I was truly done. I had peace in my heart that I had done everything possible to save my marriage, and that I would never take him back under any circumstances. So I started dating a few months after my ex left, and my first relationship was so healing. It actually showed me so many things that had been missing with my ex.
The new guy was a father who put his adult children first (my narcissist ex did not). The sex was even better than with my exH (and we’d had a pretty great sex life). He didn’t care about my imperfections or normal body functions the way my ex did. (I still remember this boyfriend offering me a bowl of ice cream, which I tried to decline on the basis that I’m a little lactose intolerant and it would make me fart. His response was to encourage me to enjoy it and tell me he didn’t care if I farted ALL NIGHT. I still love him for that! My ex was mortified if I ever passed the tiniest bit of gas in his presence! )
And even though the new relationship was no fairy tale romance - he was a Love Avoidant who eventually dumped me when his old high school girlfriend reconnected with him - I’m ever so grateful to him for showing me that there was life and love after divorce. And we are still great friends 14 years later.
Elbereth, I'm so glad you're getting past your shame! Yes, we own our faults, and they own giving up on a partner who loved them, was willing to do the work, and would've stayed to the end. You're strong and plenty of fish in the sea.
I’m considering leaving this forum along with the others that have recently left. Most of the folks that have supported me on my journey are no longer here, and that makes me sad. This forum was a lifeline to me, and I feel sad that the new folks that come along are not going to benefit from the knowledge and experience from which I benefited. I still am in need of the support, but it feels less and less like I will find it here.
I hope that those remaining and offering support to the newbies respect differences of opinion and advice, and that the focus remains on the those needing the support instead of bickering between posters over who is more right, wrong, rude, caring, fake, rightous, whatever. There is enough pain and drama in each of our MR experiences and in the current world. I hope this place becomes again the refuge it once was.
For those still here that have offered me support, I thank you. From the bottom of my heart.
Dear El, My sincere apologies for not replying to your thread sooner. I will log in from time to time as I have greatly appreciated your support all this time.
However, I completely understand your reaction because I also have a real hard time with how people sometimes react to certain messages. That is why I haven’t been posting for quite some time although I still follow your thread and most of the MLC threads.
I will also try to keep my thread alive by occasionally sketching a sequel of the situation. I personally find it important that others can make a comparison with their current situation. It makes me happy to read that you too are making so much progress and are on your way to a complete healing of the pain that was inflicted on you.
Originally Posted by Elbereth
No one has mentioned my XHs MR to OW to me yet. I’m not sure if it’s because no one really is aware (as they did move away from everyone) or if no one wants to tell me. Honestly, I’ve not really heard from anyone on his side since. So a part of me has fears that folks are distancing from me. My XH did reach out post his marriage about the kids, but made no mention of his MR. And I did not either. Maybe he was testing to see if I knew? On one hand, I did expect them to marry at some point. They have a story that they need to tell. But is it weird that I feel hurt that the ink was barely dry on our D before they did it? I know I don’t want him back, but I do still feel the feelings of being discarded. Rejection at any level hurts…so I’m doing my best to remind myself that being rejected by someone who really isn’t worthy is not worth focusing on.
Of course, it is normal for this to be a painful experience. Just because you don't want the relationship back doesn't mean the love you felt for him is completely gone. I am even convinced that this will never go away completely, but that we will be able to give it more and more a place in our hearts.
I am truly sorry that you are considering leave the Board. It can still be a lifeline to you and the newbies as well. One thing I learned many years ago is that....if you don't like what is being posted on a particular thread, then do not read it.
Again, I am truly sorry. The Board was not like this years ago. I understand people get frustrated and have good and bad days, but I do not condone being disrespectful regardless of who is right, wrong or sitting on the fence. This is a public forum and if they do not agree, etc., then leave the forum for a while.
I do hope that if you opt to leave, that you will leave the door open and return when you need assistance.
