If there is nothing in your M that you like, it is up to you to either work on the things you can affect, or to get out of Dodge. Otherwise, you'll be mired in the same rut you are in now for the rest of your life. It is up to YOU to find your happiness. No one else has the power to make you happy or not. What can YOU do to improve your marriage?
Cobra, I chip away at the R problem, some times by withdrawing,
You know this triggers her anxiety….
sometimes by telling BB she can have things she wants but I won't be part of her new life (the recent house problem where I said I wasn't moving but she could),
….as does this….
sometimes by coming back to problems and doing something a little different.
… this is the only thing that is positive, though doing something a LOT different might help.
On a personal note, would you encourage your imaginary sister to date me if we were the same age? Would you tell your sister this Lou guy had points “A” “B”, and “C” together, but he needs fixing in areas “D” and “E”? Anyone want to play match maker but change this first?
Date you? Maybe. Get serious or marry? No way. I wouldn’t want your interactions with my imaginary sister to turn her into another BB. And unless you could be more assertive, more steadfast and assured, I would have a hard time respecting you. I already have one brother in law who is controlled by his W (my W’s sister) and I have very little respect for him.
What I am looking for are hard rubber balls. Forceful but not destructive.
How much of this is what you really want and how much is fantasy? What I see in your actions is that you want “Guilt free forceful but not destructive.” You can go a lot further than you do in being more forceful without being destructive. Why you went on a house hunting trip when you have no intention of buying a house is beyond me. That is placating. Not going at all is not being destructive. It is simply a boundary.
I want to make am impact for the good of our M/R without breaking bones. Hurts are OK, broken bones not so good, especially when the bone comes through the skin.
Who says you would break bones? Why do you assume this? Are you afraid of your anger too? Look at Hairdog. He grew a set of hard rubber ones and no bones have been broken at all and very little anger exchanged.
So , I get the eyeroll sometimes, among other responses.
What’s wrong with an eye roll? Let her roll ‘em. Stop feeling responsible for her comfort. This goes with Nop’s comments on the difference between negotiation and blackmail. IMO, you have the “one down” position right now in your M. If anyone is blackmailing, I think it would be BB blackmailing you. Restoring the balance will mean that BB has to give some things up and make some accommodations for you. That’s what you want, right? So why is that suddenly blackmail? Why do you have to rescue her from what you ask of her? Again, you get in your own way. Stop letting those little guilt voices in your head dictate your actions.
I will admit to looking for the less cahotic/confrontive way to solve problems. I will admit I don't like your "in your face" ways many times. Other times I see where "in your face" works.
No one likes to be in-your-face. I don’t like it. But I have learned that the more I put off confrontation, the higher the probability that I will eventually have to use it, and to a stronger degree that I otherwise would have to had I confronted issues before they blew up. In fact, doing just that is NOT in-your-face. It is simple, clean, up front boundaries.
What I want to know is how do you see the w's as working on the M other than making/wanting themselves to be the center of attention, more princesses like?
BB IS working on your M, no doubt about it. But she is not working on it as you want, she is working on it to get what she wants. Like Nop says “It is clear that she is ready and willing to wait you out.”
When I am starving I tend to shoot and not be as careful. When I am not starving, not sure of what the many outcomes might be, don't have a plan to manage some of the outcomes, I proceed more slowly.
So what’s your point? Are you saying you don’t know what to do with your M? I can see how that would be true since you have a strong tendency toward inertia. Nop’s dancing idea was great. But it scared the heck out of you so you didn’t do it. You stayed put. If you stay put, how will you ever know what works? If you don’t know what works, I can see why you don’t know what to do.
You create your own self fulfilling prophecy. You get in your own way too much. Is that really doing what is right “for all parties involved, which is BB, “me“ , finaccial, our kids/grandkids, extended family members, and for so called ethical/moral/religious like reasons?”
I see CeMar's situation as him wanting to be desired and lusted after. I see myself wanting to be in a R where there is an exchange of emotional, social, sexual, economoc support or comfort level and other things. Too
The only difference I see between you and CeMar is where you want to go, though those two destinations are very similar. The similarity between you and he is that you both justify all sorts of reasons not to do something, anything. You obsess on an objective, which you really have no reason to do since you have no idea how things could end up once you start going down the road. But that uncertainty of where you will end up scares you so you make excuses not to go at all. Stop worrying about how bad things could get if you screw up, and look to how good things could be if you just did something, anything.
Before we go down that road, let’s be sure we understand what we are talking about. When I and others here say take back power, it does not mean something like “taking” a kiss. By that I do not mean cajoling, forcing, or manipulating someone to “take” some thing. It means not allowing the other person to cause you to become reactive and therefore dependent on their actions for your satisfaction.
If you go back and read all the recommendations made to you over the years, you will see one common theme. You ask how to create desire in your W, and you know very well that you cannot get into her head and flip a switch to turn on desire. So that means another method must be use, an indirect method. Are you with me so far?
Your wife will have certain things within her right now that she finds attractive, things that trigger desire in her, of one form or another. These are paths into her heart. Your task is to become attractive to her based on one of her currently existing paths. That path may not lead to the sex and desire you want, but as an indirect route, you can cause her to open new paths, that once were open, but which she has long ago closed.
Before she will open those doors, YOU need to be safe and attractive enough to her for her to open them. As one after another door opens, she will eventually get to the doors you want. If you keep focusing on HER and why she just doesn’t go and open the door right now, then you will continue to be stuck. She does not have to open anything if she does want to. That is the bottom line. As much as you might like to believe, she does not owe you any open doors.
So “taking” back power means two things to me: 1) becoming attractive to your W so that she might be willing to open some doors, thus taking you out of the position of simply having to beg her to open those doors, which is empowering to you, and 2) addressing her grievance against you so that she has nothing left to hold over your head and justify keeping those doors shut, which again is empowering to you.
Can you see what we mean by taking back power and can you work with this definition?
See CeMar...this is a perfect example of what I've been saying...you are STILL waiting for someone to do the work for you before YOY will TRY. You are still waiting for a guarantee before YOU will do the work that it will work for you.
Same thing, different day. How long are you really willing to continue this way due to your own lack of effort?
For my own knowledge, would you mind telling me exactly what I said that made an impact on you? IMO I did not say anything different than what has been repeated on this board over and over. Yet something got through. I think it is extremely important for those of us trying to give information to understand what blockages exist in those trying to receive it.
This could mean that I used a different tone, or maybe the "door" illusion was helpful, or something else. What was it in the comments from GGB, Nop or others that did not "click" with you?
