Thanks for that perspective on the whole alcohol thing. I appreciate it. I worked hard to not get too excited about it or overanalyze it. I'm sorry that that happened to you with the whole karaoke thing and it sounds like maybe other times, too; I know how much it hurts.
Not that it matters or I'm supposed to care, but I know H did stay at the office last night. Again, he wasn't with me, but at least it's one more night away from OW... Can only be thankful for that, but, again, did not get overexcited or read into it. He's still not home with me, and it's not time for him to be; I am growing to accept that.
Am exhausted again tonight and have so much work to do but wanted to check in with a couple of things.
Regarding the local therapist, she is an individual as well as marital therapist, and she has been doing it for 30 years. I don't believe she specialized in one (individual versus marital) over another, so I thought it would be a good choice for me, since she does individual counseling and also does marital AND is familiar with Michele's work. I thought it would be the best of both worlds. We'll see how the cards continue to play out.
So, I asked Jody (DB coach) about my thoughts/concerns with local therapist regarding: 1.) Local therapist telling me she doesn't think there is much hope for our M. 2.) Me feeling absolutely in the depths of hell after meeting with therapist - just feeling worse than when I went and not feeling uplifted. I don't know... just not good feelings.
Jody said asked me if I had voiced my concerns with local therapist about her response to me of "no hope" for M. I have not, and she said I should, that I should let local therapist know that my goal is to reconcile my M and that I have chosen to invest in the DB techniques and that I need her to facilitate those efforts. She also said that she has learned that one of the ways counseling differs from coaching is that counselors sometimes feel protective of their clients. So since I've been a basket case of tears both times I've visited the local therapist, maybe it is the protective side of her that is causing this reaction. It wasn't as if I felt like the local therapist was saying "2940, you are so not doing the right things to DB that there is no hope for your M." She told me she thinks H is being very abusive to me... I just don't know that she's totally on-board with the DB techniques. I feel like I get better advice and support from you all than I have so far from her. And it's not because she's not telling me what I want to hear. I'm just not sure if it's the best fit. Anyway, I'm going to give it a few more sessions and voice my concerns with her and see how it goes.
Jody also said that it is normal to feel the way I do after a counseling session as far as being so emotional. The interesting thing was that after I spoke with Jody I felt SO MUCH BETTER! I obviously was full of emotions still, but she made me feel so uplifted and made me feel strong and feel like I CAN DO THIS! She said she's obviously been a witness to the victories of DB techniques in the position she's in, so obviously she has a leg up in that regard, and that is probably what I need right now.
Anyway, I did feel so much better after having spoken to her, and I know I need to find the hope within myself, but she gave me hope - and she didn't even SAY "there is hope for your M." It was just the WAY she spoke to me and the encouragement she gave. I don't really know how to explain it...
So here are some ideas that she gave me. I know most if not all of these things you all have already told me, but I just wanted to share them with you and ask for your help in supporting me with these goals: 1.) Tell local therapist my concerns with her expressing "no hope" for M and ask for facilitation of DB techniques. 2.) Bump up my "sparkiness." Be less inhibited. Don't be so monotone. (I explained to Jody that I'm on lots of drugs right now to help with stabilizing my emotions, and she said that explains some of it. Obviously this can't be a permanent thing (as far as the medications), but I explained that I feel it's necessary for the time being. But I have been working on being less inhibited when we are out, have had a few drinks and tried to find the "fun" part of me again. I feel like I've made some good strides already in this arena. 3.) As a continuation of #2, Jody suggested that due to the "challenge" of us mostly, if not always, talking right now just about business items that I need to work on being more upbeat and happy and "sparky" during these conversations. Be interesting. She said it's hard, because there is really not many opportunties for me to interact with him on a personal level versus business. So, to that end, I need to work on making our business conversations more energized. How would I act differently if I felt like he would be making the worst mistake of his life if he leaves me? That is a GREAT question. I DO feel like he would be making the biggest mistake of his life, but I need to alter my actions to somehow SHOW him that by being the type of person he can't live without. 4.) By agreeing to be "just friends" and then still ML to him and moving back and forth between those lines, I am sabotaging my efforts. He truly DOES have the best of both worlds right now - and even MORE! As Jody pointed out, before this all blew up, we weren't even ML hardly ever, and now that this has come out, he's even getting THAT from me. Wow, that was an eye-opener. 5.) I'm still chasing him. I need to keep working on creating distance between us. She challenged me to find just ONE way that I could work on changing the current dynamics. I know you've all given me some great suggestions for that. Since you know so much more about our situation than she does at this point, can you give me a suggestion of just ONE thing that I could do and work really hard on that you feel at this point would make the biggest impact? 6.) I have to decide to do this WHEN I'M READY. She said that if I feel like I need to keep trying the methods I've been doing to see if they'll work then I should feel okay in doing that. Virginia kind of eluded to this when she said that all of your wonderful advice will still be here for me to read if I'm not quite ready yet. I explained to Jody that, no, I already know that that "bad" things I'm doing aren't working - I get that - that my challenge is in finding the strength to do what needs to be done and losing my fear that by letting go I'm going to lose him. 7.) She said I was doing great with GALing and encouraged me to keep working hard on that. I don't know if I told you that I went and got a massage the other day, and my friend did as well, and then we went out to a nice, long dinner afterwards and had a really nice time. Also, we put together the plans to put together our "girls' night." We are going to shoot for starting it the first week of April, every Wednesday night, and we put together a list of about 8 girls. We'll alternate houses each week or maybe sometimes go out somewhere and do this every single week. Whoever can make it, great, and whoever can't, they'll always me the next week! I'm really excited about this and am proud of myself for putting forth the efforts to put this together. This is not something I ever would have considered doing before this. 8.) I need to work on getting my energy level up so that I can be stronger in DBing and being more fun to be around, etc., all of the things I already listed. If I don't have the energy to do it, it's going to be that much harder. I think a lot of this is just going to take time of letting the sting work itself through a little bit, and some of it is the medication. I also need to get back to the gym. I know that will help. She said I need to maximize ME - become more attractive to him, not necessarily in the physical sense, but in the personality sense. 9.) I need to LISTEN to him. 10.) I need to work on my self-confidence. She told me to think about girls I know that are confident and how they act. I struggled with that a bit but came up with the things I notice is that they look people in the eye when they talk to them, and they just have mannerisms of confidence, and I can't really put that into words... Can you help me with some other characteristics of confident gals that you all are and know? 11.) Not be clingy. 12.) Don't ask H questions, and don't keep asking him about his feelings. 13.) And, one of the 180's she suggested for me to think about is to put my efforts into making H look at ME - don't put my efforts into trying to make him stay away from OW. That one really hit home for me. As you've told me, I need to stop worrying about whether he's with her or not and what he's doing and concentrate on what I need to do to make him notice ME and to WANT TO BE WITH ME! 14.) I told Jody that I thought if OW was just out of the picture that H would be willing to invest his heart back into us. She said no, that it would be someone else if it wasn't her. Just as Lin said, it's NOT the OW, it's ME. I've got to make him want to be with me, not worry that he wants to be with someone else right now. 15.) As far as the business, Jody suggested that I get some legal advice on this as far as the options, etc. I think I already understand our options but will definitely consult with an attorney if I feel a strong sense of things going "south." At this point, I don't feel that way and feel like it would make me hurt more than help right now, so will put that on the back burner at this point. Her opinion was that if I feel like continuing the business with him will benefit ME financially and otherwise, then why not keep doing it for now? She said I've got to make the decisions that feel right for ME, not based on how I think H will react. (or maybe local therapist told me that part) Anyway, I've decided at this point to not do anything differently and keep "acting as if" as far as the business goes. I pray that everything will work out, and if I have been working hard during this hell to further out business, we'll be that much further ahead when this is back on track. If it doesn't work out, I'll deal with it then. No sense in dealing with tearing my heart out now unless H says it's what he wants. Michele says something about keeping positive about things and not dealing with negatives until the negative is for sure a reality to deal with. So, if H says it's over and files or whatever or says it's time for us to make a decision about the business because he's not going to hold out any hope for our M, I'll deal with it then. For now, I'm just going to work towards getting stronger so that I can work harder than ever, and I'm going to work on just eliminating worrying about making any decisions on our business for the time being. It's one more thing I can take off my plate of things I'm worrying about, so maybe it will help me to just allow myself to let that go for now and know that I have plenty of time to deal with that if I need to, but for now, I DON'T need to deal with it, so just let it go.
Further, since the bulk of our interactions right now are business-related, if I can work on doing a damn good job at my job, maybe that will be something I can do that will enhance the feeling that he will be making a very bad decision if he chooses not to stay with me. Does that make sense, that by being the best I can be at my job and contributing to our success that he will appreciate that about me and maybe make him take another look at me, versus me complaining to him that I'm so distraught that I can't concentrate on our business (even though THAT is the truth right now), but just working on getting stronger and so that I CAN be more focused and having a more positive attitude about our work - being more upbeat and excited about it around him - maybe sometimes throwing in my own excitement about future business plans and putting my heart into my excitement. I don't know - what do you think?
So, we talked tonight, and he asked me what I thought about the investment opportunity that we had our business meeting about last night. He seems to ALWAYS keep asking me what I think or want - I'm not sure why. Maybe he doesn't want to say his opinion first only to have me have a different option and beat him up with trying to change his mind??? Anyway, I asked him what his thoughts were on it (but Jody said to not keep asking him his feelings...). I don't know; I just didn't want to be the first one to say my opinion and wanted to see what he would say I guess.
Anyway, he didn't really even address whether he thought we should make the investment; it was more how much to invest and when, etc., and how much it could make "us" in the future, etc. I know that the "us" could just mean that he's still thinking it will be "us" separately. I don't know. Anyway, I just went with the flow and eagerly discussed how/when we could do this and then made the call to let the person know we were going to take the opportunity.
BTW, I don't think I told you that when I had my meltdown with him the night before we left for his parents' house he told me that he was still really upset about the comment I had made that I didn't know if I wanted to contribute everything that I do to our business only to have him share our successes with someone else. He told me that he thought I was saying that I didn't think the HE contributed enough/equally to our business. THAT WAS WHAT HE GOT OUT OF WHAT I SAID! Oh, boy... So I explained to him that it wasn't that at all, that I just didn't know if I could/wanted to be in business with him and not be in a R with him anymore - how do you NOT talk about your personal life and what you've been up to, and I HAVE NO DESIRE TO EVER, EVER, EVER HEAR ABOUT THEM TOGETHER! The thought of her being at our properties that he and I built together and were our stepping stones to make our dreams come true as a couple makes me want to literally throw up. I don't ever want to see her, hear about her, etc. It's not that I don't want him to be happy, but I have no desire to have a part of that part of his life if it's not with me. I think it would just about kill me. I know I've told you all of this before... Anyway, how in the world could I ever be in business with him, with how closely we work together, and NOT deal with the above issues? I just don't want to do it. Anyway, I tried to explain this to him, that my "why" of why I'm doing this business was built around the dreams that he and I created together, and for my "why" to be shattered and still contribute to our business just didn't feel right.
So, the reason I am telling you all of this is because I know I've asked you a few times whether you thought I should tell him my feelings on whether I would want to stay in business with him or not if we aren't together. Well, I've now basically told him. I didn't say that this is "for sure" what I would want to do, as I'm obviously not in the position at this point to be making that decision, but I at least told him how I feel about it right now.
I also gleened from that conversation that he would want to split our properties up, whereas I feel like I would want to sell them and split the profits 50/50 and start over. I know a couple of you asked what I would do if I started over with my nest egg. Well, I would do exactly what I'm doing now, as I DO love it, but I would figure out a way to do it without H and fill in the pieces of the business that he does some other way. I guess that's my whole point in my feelings - where we're at today is based on our joint efforts of not just being successful at our business but in even DOING this business because WE created dreams and goals that this business is merely a vehicle to achieve. For me to now continue contributing to that business when the whole primary reasons for me doing it are to achieve OUR dreams - the equasion no longer adds up for me. So, his words on our first trip when we first discussed this were that we would create NEW dreams and goals. I realize that that is what would have to happen, but I guess I want to put an official end to these dreams and everything associated with them, all of the properties and whatnot that WE did together, and create my own new dreams with my own new properties. I don't know if I'm saying this very clearly, and I'm not trying to just restate this in different ways over and over; I guess I'm just trying to elaborate to you all what is going on in my head. I truly do not want to "stick it to H" by disolving our business - at least I hope that's not why I feel this way. I know that's part of what I'm working through. I honestly hope it's for the above reasons that I feel the way I do. I know H can do this business by himself as well or find someone else to do it with - maybe even OW - I don't know. But to work with someone and drag out the pain and have to see them everyday while going through separating, etc., and then having to watch/know/hear/see them with someone else? No, thanks. It would be hard enough to get over disolving our R without having the go through that torture...
Sorry, I'm ranting. Gosh, how long is this post now???? It was just supposed to be a short one... Sorry. Guess I needed to vent tonight. Thanks for listening.
So, couple more things... So the reason I wanted you to know that I told H about the reasons for my feelings about the business is that he now is "in the know." Yet, he still chooses to continue to talk about and want to make future business plans with me, even though he now knows my thoughts on staying in business with him. What does this mean? I know I'm not supposed to care... Is he even thinking about that? Who knows... I guess part of me just wants to hold out hope that he feels like there is the possibility of reconciliation and that that is why he's choosing to continue to build/talk about future business plans and that he wants desperately for ME TO CHANGE so that HE WANTS TO BE WITH ME AGAIN.... I know, I can't control or analyze his thoughts/actions... I know, I know...
So, one more thing I wanted to mention is that the person we met with last night was the same person that gave us the award I told you about the first night H came home after this whole mess blew up. And, again, last night, there seemed to be a shift in his attitude, even ever so slight, towards me. I honestly feel like this person somehow has a way, without even knowing what's going on between us, of making H feel closer to me, miss me, know what a good thing he's got with this business with me... I don't know. Our first trip away was with a group that included this person, and I guess I had hoped that because of that it might be a really good thing for us on that trip, but I didn't see the shift on our trip, but I noticed it ever so slightly last night again, unless it was just the alcohol...
Also, when this all first blew up, I told H that I didn't feel like I could hold this inside, that I felt like I had to talk to SOMEONE. He asked if I wanted to tell my mom (my BEST friend), and I said absolutely not. I asked if he had any suggestions of who I could talk to. Do you know who he asked me if I would feel comfortable talking to? This person I've been telling you about. Is there a connection? Is there something I need to work into my efforts that include this person somehow? I'm not sure, but my heart tells me there is something this personn contributes to H feeling closer to me. I may be wrong, but it may be worth exploring further. So is there a way I can somehow give it a try as part of my plan of saving this M to have this person somehow help my efforts without telling him what's going on? If so, how??? It's almost as if this person brings out the love for me in H that I'm trying to bring out.... It's confusing to me. Is it really the way that *I* act around this other person? ........
Okay. Now this is really too long.
So, Monday H is going golfing with this other person during the day, along with a few other folks. Then, we were invited out to dinner with this other person and his wife and some other couples on Monday night. H called and told me about this and asked if I was free. I said yes and asked if he wanted to go, and he said yes. So, we're going to do that on Monday. I will work hard on being myself, having fun, letting go, and WATCHING H and seeing if I see a shift again.
Okay, gotta go now. Sorry for unloading on you all. Thanks for listening. Oh, one more thing (I know I keep saying that)... I'm not defending my actions/emotions/etc., but I just wanted to mention, 1210, that you said I have been dealing with this now for 5 months. This is true, but remember that when this all happened in November, H told me about two weeks later that he had decided to give us another chance when "he was ready." I hung onto that like a lifeline, and it honestly kept me going and fighting. It gave me strength. I found myself getting stronger as time when on. Then, he came home right before our trip, and, as you know, everything went to hell from there. Then, he told me 3 weeks ago today and he didn't want to be married to me anymore. So, I feel like I had to start all over again. I only had to deal with not knowing if we were going to try again for about 2 weeks the first time, and he NEVER told me the first time that he DIDN'T want to be with me anymore. The dynamics are different this time, and I'm not only having to start all over again in so many respects, but I'm also having to deal with different emotions and circumstances than I did the first time. Again, I'm by no means trying to justify my recent meltdowns and issues; I just want to put some perspective on them. Also, I think it was 1210 that said that H had told me for 2 years that he was unhappy. If I said this, I misspoke. H didn't tell me that he had been unhappy for years until this all blew up. Did I KNOW things weren't perfect? Yep. But it wasn't as if he was telling me for two years that our M was in trouble and he was having feelings for OW and didn't know if he wasnted to be married anymore, etc. I THOUGHT WE WERE FINE. Anyway, again, I guess I'm just trying to give you some further perspective/information so that you know where I'm coming from, and I guess I'm just for some reason deciding I need to type a novel tonight...
Okay. Will go now. I probably wrote so much that this post alone is going to lock up this thread! LOL
So, have a good night, everyone. As always, thanks for listening and for all of your advice, encouragement, and strength. Thanks for continuing to believe in me when I don't believe in myself sometimes... I will forever be grateful to you all, and I can only pray that it will be with a smile in the days/weeks/months ahead that I think of you all/write to you all with my H by my side again BECAUSE I CHOSE TO MAKE ME A BETTER PERSON...
