Journey of a Happy Heart 2

[Rollercoasterider]

Nicola,

Think of the first eight quotes as bullet point to show how you are either saying you are worried he will move on and you want him still...mixed with a few where you talk about it being over.

I commented on a few...but that was other aspects. They were really meant to be examples showing how you still want your marriage.

Yes, I did ask him. Yesterday, I truly felt that all was lost. I am still feeling that today. I am really, finally grieving my M. That is why I did the big NO-NO of initiating R-talk. I figured I had nothing to lose.

You only have nothing to lose when you do not want to reconcile. Feeling that the chances are slim is not nothing. Look at what Happy_Again said on the first thread he started last week...I've been meaning to post these back to his thread to stress them.

when i felt the freedom to say no without being made to feel like an ass then i began saying yes.

it was when Allie stopped pretending and started to be real and i could trust her only then did i make the long journey towards home again.

These are DIRECTLY realted to the Finally_Free/Happ_Again excerpt I posted with my Limbo article.

Whenever I had doubts about my decision I would email or call my wife and as she was either crying or being a bitch it was easy to tell myself I made the right choice. When she stopped reacting I starting thinking.

Let it be...how long have you ever gone without saying something about your relationship...not understanding, not wanting a divorce...ANYTHING? Start now.

But isn't a decent person nice to everyone?

But then what of those 'decent people' who are sick mentally?

I had wanted to say this before...but when I sat back down couldn't recall the thought.

Your blaming yourself or feeling that this is because you are at fault or somehow not good enough is akin to my Aunt blaming herself for my Uncle's schizophrenia. But no one (these days at least) would consider doing such a thing.

MLC is mental Dis-Ease. It is not disease, and it not something 'wrong.' It is a transitional stage wherein some people expereince greater turmoil.

If we considered those in life transitions to be truly diseased, we'd have to lock up all the teenagers.

I wonder b/c he is actually, in a strange way, trying to be nice to me, unlike so many of the MLCers here who just spew horribly. Maybe he is just a WAH, who doesn't want to hurt me, but just doesn't love me anymore. Is that not a possibility?

I think you've hit on a common LBS fear. Whenever their MLCer isn't reacting as most others react she fears he's just a WAH...even when the way he is acting is positive compared to other MLCers. We so much want to diagnose MLC...well, first, I believe he is MLC. But I als feel you need to forget about that...it just doesn't matter.

But many MLCers do not spew. Some because they've learned that it will not cause a spousal reaction--Sweetheart spewed very rarely... And even lately when I've posted about going into Bitch-Mode I would not call his reactions spewing. Sure he was arguning...but spewing was beyond that...it was mean for the sake of meanness.

But I believe spewing is mainly Replay behaviour. That's not to say it doesn't happen in other phases. But I see it as an early behaviour used to get the LBS to see that it really is over. If the LBS continues to react to the spews, they will continue.

Wso he doesn't spew...he should be beyond spewing at this phase.

Nothing has changed. I was actually doing very well emotionally before this. I've just dropped like a stone. Yeah...we can tell. Maybe something isn't working as well as it used to work. I don't like pharmaceuticals and wouldn't have brought them up had you not already had issues with clinical depression. Please see your doctor.

Yes, that's true. You also comment that it is often slow, but this really seems slower than most. I mean, if it started a minimum of three years ago, shouldn't it be nearing the end???

Well first this goes back to that quote I put from Jim Conway. Your lack of Acceptance of this being a lengthy process may have served to extend it. And that in no way means the crisis is your fault. But it does mean you have held on to him and he has thus not been able to retreat into himself for deeper work.

And...MLC is 2-7 years. Some take a long time. BND...four years so far...and just now coming to an end. Snodderly's husband began some reconnecting last year...with the death of a family member...? Her register date speaks for itself.
2-7 years is the Conway range. This board is not a good indicator because how many do you think will Stand for 7 years. Four is considered extra long for a person to Stand. So I believe most Stand down...and if there MLCers reconnect later, we may never know.

What we see here is mostly Replay and Depression. I can really say that Acceptance is a mystery to me...and Withdrawal, well I still see that as a subphase within Depression...but it could simply be my lack of understanding due to not seeing those MLCers.

I have been happy. RCR, I have genuinely been happy and friendly and warm w/o being overwhelming. Truly. He likes being around me. He likes talking to me. He says he still thinks I'm beautiful. I was really getting the sense that he wanted to be in my life again.

And until now you were handling things well. But what happened is that because you were happy he became interested...and then you showed him that you are hopeful...he then became scared, retreated and you crashed. I think I talked about this in my Limbo post last week.

What this shows is that first your expectasions were still above zero... and he felt that. But also that there was some manipulation in your happiness--not deliberate. But some of the morivation behind your happiness was to get him to notice and move toward you. Do it for yourself...tough, I know when we say to do it for yourself BUT when you do he will begin paying attention.

you of all people should recognize that last statement as the Hopeless stage of Depression...the lowest of the low. "I'm bad, so I might as well live with it because there is nothing I can do to change it." He sees no end in sight, no way out and this is his lot in life.

RCR, that's what I thought. I thought good, he's finally opening up to me, maybe there's a chance now that he'll really work on things. But then, w/in weeks of that, he began casually dating ow2, and now, since VD, they have been serious. What happened???? Was it b/c I said then that I was ready to start LS if that's really how he feels? Damn, I am just kicking myself now.

Well, first don't expect him to open up to you. Sorry...I know we all want that. But he still doesn't feel safe with that. Just be relieved that he is opening up...and trust it is happening outside of your presence.

As for the new OW...forget about her. Decent women do not date married men...PERIOD. MLCers cycle and he is doing that. Perhaps he got scared of more Depression and ran back for some Replay fun. They also do this at Acceptance...though I"m not even considering he's there. And as for it being a rataliatory response to LS...who knows. Maybe he will be yupset and say I'll show her. Maybe he will feel relief...that you are letting go and moving on.

Those all have good things...realtiation means he is upset at you...and thus thrwoing a tantrum. Relief shows he needs space form you...there are other eason...and too many for you to fret over...OWs are as important as doo doo on shoes. They stink and cling a lot...but they go away.

I am mostly doing that, but if I am honest, part of me is still wanting H to sit up and take notice.

Me too. That is okay...as long as you just shrug it off when you cannot tell that he has taken notice...and for the record...he has noticed, you just weren't aware.

I feel that I must do the LS for my own sanity. I am very worried about money, and I feel like that is part of the reason I am still attached to my M. I want to feel like I can really do it on my own, feel independent and strong. At that point, I will really be coming from a place of strength, not weakness.

I think so too--but that shouldn't matter. If you feel you need to do it...then do it with complete confidence in your decision.

But if he is in a depressive/hopeless stage, why is he even in a position to be dating? Why isn't he at home crying?

Ho do you know he isn't crying...inside or out. Depressives need shoulders and perhaps the OW is being that. Early OWs validate and affirm--as do later OWs. But perhaps early OWs are the partyers...Replay OWs, and Depression OWs are nurses and nurterers...or perhaps Mothers.

Many have OWs beyond Replay.

In all honesty, I don't really expect him to look back, but of course, it is always a possibility. He keeps telling me to date, which just ticks me off! Yesterday, he told me that the way I'm feeling is normal, of course it hurts. I said I thought he'd be jumping for joy when I get serious about somone else. He said, no, he won't, in a sad voice.

They all tell us to date--but you knew that. So what do you say in response? I told Sweetheart I will NEVER date--unless he is dead. That wasn't said in some morbid way...but 'til death do us part. I told him as long as we were both alive we were both married to each other and I wouldn't date and that no matter what he would be commiting adultery if he did. Those are harsh words...and I don't recmmend that harshness with your MLCer right now...but it's an example. And notice he even admitted it wouldn't make him happy if you dated...that's because he wants you and regrets that he feels he cannot have you--the martyr.

the tipping point for me is this ow. I just don't get it. I mean, those great feelings of being w/ someone new can go on for years. What am I supposed to do?

[color:#6600CC]Yes...that was clear...it was at the disocvery of the OW that you began talking of standing down.

What do you do?
Nothing. You go on and do not react.
Be glad that he has someone to cry on...

And be glad and sad both that unfortunatley she is being used...she's a depression nurse and will be dumped or when he can take care of himself she will dump him.

And trust. Being without doubt is important. MLCers always look back toward the wife...Jim Conway stressed that...ALWAYS.

As for Sweetheart. He came and left six times...and No, he was never gone for long and always a complete Drop-In.

But consider that he wasn't gone long because I accepted.

HUGS,
RCR