What I see going on in your date night conversations is a pattern of both of you playing a certain amount of martyr, not just her. Neither of you want to “put yourself out there” and take a stand, even on something like choosing a movie. You each take the safe position first, ask what the other wants to do, so you can then approve or veto that suggestion.
You tried to break this cycle when you stepped up and got her a fish sandwich. She vetoed that and you internalized it, saying you won’t ever do that again. This is major enmeshment.
When I got home, like I said, she was in a mood.
Which set off your defense system. You reactivity is already rising before the dialogue even began. My guess is that you are anticipating being blame for something.
Choc.: "Come sit down, I got you something to eat." Mrs. Choc.: "What?" Choc.: "A Filet-o-Fish sandwich and some fries." Mrs. Choc.: "Oh no, I won't eat that." Choc.: "Why not?" Mrs. Choc.: "Because it's not healthy. I don't eat fast food anymore." (at this point I'm exasperated)
This last statement is an invalidation of you efforts and your concern for her, which is why it hurts and makes you angry. But, can you see that you are tying your sense of self esteem to your wife’s approval. You are not the fish sandwich. If she doesn’t want it, it has nothing to do with you as a person. There is nothing to get upset about. You made an assumption. It turned out to be wrong. You should be upset with yourself, not her. (Fearless, you like that validation of your assumption ideas?!)
Now in the functional relationship, she could very easily say “Thank you for your consideration,” so don’t think I am letting her off the hook. Whether you decide to get her another sandwich in the future should depend on your ability to do so without validation from her and not depend on her obligation to be thankful to you. If she says thank you, then it is a separate gift to you. She does the same thing too. You can see her martyrdom more clearly.
Choc.: "Well, then just throw it out. I thought it was better than not eating anything.” Mrs. Choc.: "I mean, I appreciate it and all, but I eat healthy now."
Maybe her conscience got the better of her here, which means she is considering your feelings.
Choc.: "OK. Then we'd better get going." After this, she was in a HORRIBLE mood, that even my kids noticed, as D19 kept rolling her eyes at me. Then: Choc.: "If you don't want to go out tonite, we don't have to."
This is Choc going into martyr role…
Mrs. Choc.: "No, that's fine."
….MrsChoc trying to mayrtyr role back….
Choc.: "Cuz you seem like you don't want to go, and I don't want to go if you don't want to."
…but Choc won’t let her have it….
Mrs. Choc.: "No, let's go." (still in a HORRIBLE mood)
…. she’s going to be the martyr tonight, damnit!
(NOTE OF MAJOR ANNOYANCE HERE: After biting my head off, my kids' heads off, and generally being in a pissy, grumpy mood, she gets in the car and proceeds to call her mother on the cell phone, because if she doesn't call her every day, she'll never hear the end of it -- something she points out to me now for the 3,225th time. All of a sudden, WHAMO- she's talking excitedly on the phone, and in a good mood. Called her sister-in-law, too, and was in an even better mood. I'm thinking "WTF is that? She's nicer to them, than she is to her own immediate family??)
So what is it you are complaining about? First you don’t like her being in a grumpy mood, then you’re upset she flipped over into a good mood? How can she please you? Do you see this has nothing to do with her mood, it is about YOU not feeling validate by her. She is not acknowledging the pain you put yourself through because of your loyalty to her, then she is not giving you credit for the effort you made to please her. She turned to a good mood because of someone else, not you, right?
I understand this and it used to piss me off too. Why can’t W be grateful for your efforts to please her? Why does she intentionally defy my good intentions? Implicit in that statement is the message that your good intentions should control her emotions. That one way road is ok, but she should not control YOUR emotions, right. Now way are you going to be beholding to someone like her! Just know that this hypocrisy is not missed on her. Fix this.
After the movie, neither one of us had eaten any dinner (she did wolf down maybe 1/3 of the fish sandwich, while STANDING at the table.
What’s up with her standing and eating? Whether you think that is appropriate manners or not, you are judging her with this statement. It is just another aspect of the power struggle you two are waging.
Good thing I didn't immediately throw it in the trash, which is what I FELT like doing). She saw a pizza place near the movie theatre, with the same name as a place we used to like, and wondered out loud if it was the same owner. Then:
Choc.: "Wanna go get a slice?" [b]
There’s that non-committal setup starting. Ask her to stick her neck out first so you can judge her…
[b]Mrs. Choc.: "No."
… she won’t take the bait….
Choc.: "We didn't eat."
… you keep pressing….
Mrs. Choc.: "It's late, they're probably closing." (It was 9:30)
… picking up the martyr role again…
Choc.: "OK."
Good that you dropped it.
(I know that "It's late, they're probably closing" is Venusspeak for my W, who really wants to have an entire back-and-forth converation where I say "No, it's not that late," and she says "Yes, it is -- I hate it when we're trying to eat, and they're like putting the chairs up" and I say "It's Friday, I'm sure they're open later," and she says "I don't know" and then I finally offer to either call on my cell phone to see how late they're open, or go in and ask them (she feels stupid walking up to the door and then walking away, so I do it), and anyway I know this is what she's REALLY trying to say, and I'm just not up for it.
Do you see the same dynamic playing out here? It just keeps repeating.
I've got leftover, homemade pizza in the fridge at home, and at this point I just want to freaking get there.
Again, I understand. It is frustrating when someone else just will not see how much you care and how hard you try. So do it without expectation of any return acknowledgement. Detach. You are too enmeshed.
Becoming more differentiated is not easy. In fact I am coming more and more to believe that for most dysfunctional people, it is simply not possible. You can make advances, and perhaps over a long time (like years) you can advance.
Better to go with the adult attachment approach. Understand exactly what dynamic is playing out in your marriage. Talk to your wife and try to explain this to her. You will both need to study some. Once you see how reactive you both are, and can agree on the final objective (having a happy marriage), then the process of short-circuiting the power play can actually be quite easy. You need to both be honest with yourself and each other. You both need to agree to think more of the other and make your primary focus the soothing of each other. That can stop the destructive cycle and allow other relationship building ideas to take hold. But this does require that dreaded heart-to-heart talk, IMO.
Lil,
You asked earlier why I hadn’t commented on any narcissism in Mrs Choc. It never occurred to me she was narcissistic, and after thinking through this latest dialogue, I am more convinced that she is not. I think she and Choc have fallen into a typical powerplay, akin to Schnarch’s marital sadism ideas. They each know each other too well, can anticipate what the other will say and how they will react, and are both in self protection mode.
