Heather has made it abundantly clear what her limits are, and that she has reached them.
She has made an offer of communication and negotiation to her husband. She may keep the offer on the table for a while, but she has said that she has gone as far as she can go. I started this process with her knowing that whatever was done, had to be done within the boundaries of her divorce filling and her limited ability to handle additional pain.
-NOPkins-
I will ferret out an affair at any opportunity.
-An affair is the embodiment of entitlement, fueled by resentment and lack of respect. -An infidel will remain unreachable so long as their sense of entitlement exceeds their ability to reason.
I've been reading your posts, and I felt very happy for your breakthrough last week. I'm not feeling the rollercoaster that you seem to be riding, though.
How can you talk to H? Email seemed to work last week. Can you send an email to tell him a little of what you're thinking and feeling right now? You want change, and it's about d*mn time you got some, but he's very aware that you've filed. The truck is a big issue for him, but if I were in his shoes, I'd be wondering about the legalities hanging over the M.
I am not trying to say, "Drop the D filing." I am suggesting that he is at least as confused and scared and hopeful and uncertain as you are right now. But I don't believe that he has anything close to the level of communication skills related to these feelings that you have developed. I've never read anything in your posts to support that idea.
What you focus on expands. Do you see it expanding? Each of you has focused since last week on what's unchanged, on what the other has yet to do.
If you let him know what you want and need, what you need before you need other things, and if he can feel sure that you want to know what he wants and needs, you can make more progress. It took years to get to the point you were at ten days, two weeks ago. You did make a breakthrough, but that's only one of the many, large and small, that it will take over time to get on the road you want to travel with him.
You started the breakthrough in communication. Someone has to start the next one. It ain't "fair" if it's always you, but two (or even ten) times in a row isn't the same as "always" in a lifetime together.
Hang in there.
Thanks,
Joe
My sitch More importantly, Light A Million Candles
Thanks for the thoughtful posts LFL, Cobra. H and I did communicate last night, YEY! Not for too long, I was so proud of myself because he said this statement THREE times in this convo "When you don't get what you want or things don't go your way, you are ready to leave". That statement is completely blowing off any real, valid concerns I have with our R and making it sound like I am a childish, whimsical brat. BUT. I let it go. The third time he said it, I simply said "Ok, it's time to quit. We'll pick this up Friday or Wed or whenever. Because that statement is very unfair, but we'll just let it lie for now." And I gave him a kiss on the cheek. That seemed to work out well.
The conversation began when I straight up asked him if I am going to continue to be banished to the computer room. He maintained that I am not committed and said he has no idea how things would be next week. I said I think I know exactly where things will be in the near future if things don't change, I've already tried to live this way and I can't. I have to be honest with myself and the people around me. That was a borderline statement, I didn't want him to perceive it as a threat or a demand for change, but like I said, I HAVE to be honest. If I'm not, we'll all pay the price. I want to give this the best possible chance. Commitment is obviously a big issue for him. I said 'Ok. What if I give this...a year? I'm here, for the next year. And we have that time to make this a R we both want to be in.' He said that he thought a year was completely optimistic but that he was all for it. I said well, you said yourself that I've gone four months without mentioning leaving and that didn't seem to be enough. He said 'Definitely, if we could go a year then we could...'. I sort of cut him off (oops) and said 'No. A year to FIX it, meaning at the end of the year, the major issues are resolved and we can look at each other and say 'yeah, this is good'. Not a year and THEN fix it. Another year will be four years since we've been at this....if we haven't found our way by then, it isn't to be.' He said 'It depends, I don't know what all the issues are'. I said 'I'm not going to make demands and tell you that this needs to change or that needs to change. You know what the issuea are and I want us both to contribute to making things better by telling each other what we want in a M, how we wish things could be different, changing the way we relate to each other in times of conflict, etc.'
That was pretty much the gist of the conversation. I have tentatively committed to this for another year, but we need to discuss it again. I need to be sure that we're on the same page...it's not me be here for another year and THEN we work on fixing it. It's a year to fix it. And that, my friends, I can give.
"Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you."
I said 'Ok. What if I give this...a year? I'm here, for the next year. And we have that time to make this a R we both want to be in.' He said that he thought a year was completely optimistic but that he was all for it. I said well, you said yourself that I've gone four months without mentioning leaving and that didn't seem to be enough. He said 'Definitely, if we could go a year then we could...'.
A year?! What happened to one month or less? I just don't see how he is putting in the effort (through ACTIONS not emails) about how much he wants this to work.
I think you did great. And I think a year is doable, especially for him. Good job.
And I hate to tell you, sis, but you are already 'giving.' And you did it by hearing him, acknowledging him, not blowing up at him for his view (you only want to get your way), but you didn't back off of your view, either.
One thing I think you could say to him is, "H, please understand that I don't want MY way. But I do want an 'OUR' way, and I can't do that without you. That could be why it seems like I am so persistant in getting MY way. I want to work with you, and I'm willing to go slow. I'm still not sure of all the things I want out of our new R, but the one thing I do know that I want for US, is for me to be back in OUR bed."
You are learning patience, Heather. I'm so proud of you.
I meant a month for him to decide if he wants this M enough to make change. I'm not going to fall back into the same old patterns and accept the old marriage back. No way. I can give more than a month, and reasonably have to, if we're both giving. Our issues can't be solved in a month, but a month is sure as heck long enough to decide if he agrees changes need to be made.
He has a valid concern with the commitment issue. But in the past, he's not been willing to define what being 'committed' means. It seems that now he is defining it as just being present with no talk of leaving. I can do that.
His actions are increased affection, a more obvious concern for my feelings, willingness to talk, not burying his head in the sand. Last night he bought me a bottle of wine, which was nice. He passed it off 'show Mommy what we got for her...', which is a little tacky, but it's still trying. I mean, I know my four year old didn't suggest buying Mommy a bottle of wine. If she did, perhaps I should re-evaluate my drinking habits, eh?!
"Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you."
These are all good signs. His overture to you with the wine, passed through the kids, is tacky, but... let's give him credit where credit is due... he's inching out of his comfort zone. Flash him a BIG ole' smile and tell your daughter to tell her daddy how wonderful he makes you all feel.
CATCH HIM BEING GOOD, Heather, and do not let ONE instance pass without notice and encouragement from you. He'll begin to mirror you. Hesitantly, at first, kind of backhanded... but he'll get it.
As an example, remember a few pages back on your very own thread when I gave Cobra a compliment and he sputtered and nearly fell over... but he liked it.
Corri, Thanks for the reminder to give compliments when they are due. Sometimes I feel we all need a remedial relationship workshop, with the basics, like, " You capture more flies with honey."
Playing diplomat, negotiating, feeling out her H’s position, couching her comments to avoid hurt feelings… WAY TO GO!!!
If he made a comment 3 times, then that should tell you it is REALLY important to him. You do not have to agree with him, but it is EXTREMELY important that you validate what he says and how he feels. This sounds like a MAJOR issue that you two need to talk about sometime. My bet is that it has nothing to do with you leaving per se, but is an abandonment issue for him, just as your “threat” to leave is a control tactic meant to protect yourself. You don’t really want to leave. Be radically honest when you bring this issue up.
He has a valid concern with the commitment issue. But in the past, he's not been willing to define what being 'committed' means. It seems that now he is defining it as just being present with no talk of leaving. I can do that.
Does that surprise you? He has the same trauma you have. He is scared just like you. When he is hurt, he wants to run, but he runs into his shell. You run away. Same difference. Let him think his way is more committed. There’s plenty of time to talk about that later.
That statement is completely blowing off any real, valid concerns I have with our R and making it sound like I am a childish, whimsical brat.
I know this is how you feel. He may not realize that you take it this way. Then again, your interpretation of what he is saying is just that - an interpretation. Be careful with that. Assuming to know what the other person means cause a lot of your past problems.
Do you hear "When you don't get what you want or things don't go your way, you are ready to leave" as an attack? Maybe he is telling you this not to attack but to tell you that he feels controlled, powerless and scared, ya think?
Corri,
As an example, remember a few pages back on your very own thread when I gave Cobra a compliment and he sputtered and nearly fell over... but he liked it. \:\)
Wooahh! I did NOT nearly “fell over.” I tripped over something… skinned my knee.
Cobra, Here's an observation: When you ditch the anger towards women and add in humor, you are transformed ( and it looks good). You have a sense that people's issues are not logical in origin, they're emotional, and you have to work with what's being presented. We would all be in better shape if we could apply that in our own situations. I so often feel taxed on my empathy and compassion.
