I certainly hope that I never disappoint you. You're a tough bird too. I think that, like me, you've been through your share of battles and have always had the strength to pull yourself up again. I can hear it in you writing.
I didn't just read what these men on here had to say and just dismiss it outright. I'm not angry, I am not envious of my wife's career, I have never not been a man--these are assumptions that were made. I have no reason to lie about or try to hide my feelings. Hell, I wish these assumptions were correct--everything would be on me to fix and my wife and I could live happily ever after, problem solved. We are not fairy tale characters in a fairy tale marriage. I cannot fix all of our issues on my own. Anyone here can accuse me of "placating" now. The reality of the situation is that if my wife or mysaelf decides to leave the marriage tomorrow, there is nothing that the other spouse can do to stop that. That's not me talking, that's the divorce laws of my home state talking. So, marriage is not something that you're obligated to be in; it's something that you want to be in. My wife is making no effort to show me that she wants to be in our marriage. Am I to make ALL of the effort to save my marriage? Am I to jump through the hoops to please her, to win her back? If this is what I'm missing in all of this, please tell me. I am sincere; I am not being a smart***.
You're right, I do have hard and fast rules about marriage. I hope that everyone has rules about their relationships, any kind of relatioships. Behavior, you can't control someones behavior, you know that. But yes, there are behaviors that we expect in all forms of interaction. I'm no different. I am expected to behave, and I expect my spouse, son, coworkers, or anyone else that I come into contact with to behave in a certain way.
Yes, we went to marriage counseling seperately twice. After the second time that we went my wife told me that marriage counseling would not change her feelings towards me. She would only go to see the marriage counselor again as a moderator to divide our assets. I have not gone back to the counselor; I really don't see the point.
I am very concerned about my son in all of this. The little guy is seven and our heart, and he sure as hell didn't cause or ask for any of this. That rips me apart more than anything.
Corri, it's late. I am now thinking about my son in all of this, and I'm going to sign off for the night. Thank you for all of your attention concerning me and my problems.
I agree with Corri, your W is waiting for something from you, just like you are waiting for something from her.
There are couple of things that you can change about yourself to improve your M. The good news is that (it seems) that you arent acting unattractive. Your not needy, chasing or any of that. The bad news is that, you are being P/A. I know you think you are being 'decent' and 'respectful' and seeing if she really loves you, by expecting and hoping she will step up and act certain ways. She is too. I see you as behaving exactly the same way I did when my M fell apart. your 'doing nothing'.
If you want her to step up, your going to have be radically honest and let her know how to step up. I used to find that concept extremely distastful, because I would not apprecaite it at all. She is not a man, though. Ill be happy to talk about some specifics, if you like.
So, I really don't know what to do; the ball is in her court, and she's doing nothing with it. you cant score if you give someone else the ball.
My self-esteem is returning, and I've taken the power that she had over me away from her. I am in control; I am proactive--not reactive. Good. You have you under control. Keep this. Take care of you so that you can maintain this. This is very good. That does not make her feel anything though.
My wife has known me for 16 years; I will be very disappointed if she is gambling with our marriage. She does know you, and bases her decision on that. Time to shake up what she knows
it's something that you want to be in. Yep, and you want to be in there when the OP makes you feel something. She is not making you feel anything, nor are you her. My wife is making no effort to show me that she wants to be in our marriage. Well now that you have gotten over the chasing part of it, neither are you. Am I to make ALL of the effort to save my marriage? No. your just to do your piece of it Am I to jump through the hoops to please her, to win her back? Barf If you do Ill be happy to bring you back to your senses with a solid slap. If this is what I'm missing in all of this, please tell me. I am sincere; I am not being a smart***. Good. The first thing you have to say is I DO NOT WANT A DIVORCE. This 2 months baloney is hedging your bets and defeating yourself. When you can say that to yourself, then you can say it to her, and not gives a damn about her reaction or the outcome. Its about what you want, not what she will do.
Do you know what it means to stand naked (vulnerable)in the face of fear (strong) and feel, I dont care (impervious). This is what I want (honest), and I am proud of me (be real, have boundaries).
When you dont give your wife the time of day, your not standing naked, nor strong. you may look impervioius, and be trying to fool others, but its not honest.
You have expectations and so does she. If you drop the P/A, and tell her what your expectation are, you will amazingly enough be satisfying most of hers.
First thing you can try.
Abyss: (out of the blue) I dont want a D. I think D is destructive and cowardly. Mrs. A: If you didnt want a D then this and that and this and that.... Abyss: (listens impassively and saves for reflection) Im not arguing with you. You heard what I said. Your opinion may very well be differant. Its good that I know.
I cannot fix all of our issues on my own. Anyone here can accuse me of "placating" now. The reality of the situation is that if my wife or mysaelf decides to leave the marriage tomorrow, there is nothing that the other spouse can do to stop that.
There is something you can do that does work: that is change yourself so that you are more attractive. Not just to her, but to others. Please do yourself a favor and go to the search tab on this website, search the sex-starved-marriage forum for name=CSW and date range older than 1 year. Read CSW's history. He started out in pretty much the same place you did. NOPkins gave him good advice, he followed it to the letter and made a new man out of himself. His wife became attracted to him once again, broke off her affair and they are back together stronger than ever. Note, he did nothing to change her, he only changed himself. She saw the changes and realized they were genuine. You can do the same, but you need to be open to the advice here and to be willing to take a very critical look at yourself to see why she's leaving in the first place.
You might also read LordGrenville's current thread for the advice NOPkins is giving him. It is solid advice.
If you're waiting for her to change, why isn't it ok for her to be waiting on you to change? I'm not asking you to beg her back, but for me, I felt unimportant to my H. If you let her go, she might be feeling the same way....that you don't care enough to respond.......but will just let her go because you're too proud to beg. Again, I'm not asking you to - but put your pride aside and decide what you want out of this life - and if she's worth fighting for.
....Understand, that I can't, not be what I am I'm not the milk, and Cheerios in your spoon ~ Avril Lavigne ~ ..."Nobody's Fool"...
I certainly hope that I never disappoint you. You're a tough bird too.
You don't know me... why in the world would you ever worry about dissapointing someone you don't even know? Whew... that's a lot of power to give to someone...
Quote:
I think that, like me, you've been through your share of battles and have always had the strength to pull yourself up again. I can hear it in you writing.
Yep. And I've also learned, the hard way, that my strength can be my biggest enemy. When I felt threatened or lost, my 'strength' became an impervious castle/fortress. It's a lovely, lovely thing for protection... problem is, no one can get in or out... including me. It gets very lonely.
Quote:
Yes, we went to marriage counseling seperately twice. After the second time that we went my wife told me that marriage counseling would not change her feelings towards me.
A counselor can't do that, and I don't think that is the purpose of a counselor anyway, just my opinion.
I think Blackfoot has given you some really solid advice... I'd be curious to know what her response might be if you try it.
I'm sure right now you are feeling at the end of your rope, pissed, and feeling like... 'why try? Maybe we should just chuck the whole thing.' No one blames you for that.
Dig a little deeper, guy. Use your strength to stay OUT of that castle/fortress. It keeps your options open, and that is very important. You are correct in saying that if your wife leaves, there is little you can do about it. That doesn't mean she has all the power. Refer to my first paragraph. You are giving her the power, and I don't think she wants it.
In knowing THAT, how do you best use that to your advantage? Now think about BF's advice.
Don't worry about how she says she feels about you right now. You are changing... and women's feelings are very sensitive to their men.
Quote: Abyss:I certainly hope that I never disappoint you. You're a tough bird too.
Corri:You don't know me... why in the world would you ever worry about dissapointing someone you don't even know? Whew... that's a lot of power to give to someone...
Corri, is there is a chance in the world this could be someone you know IRL? I'm getting weird vibes.
You're now the third person to bring up CSW, and I followed his sitch closely from the early days. I remember him coming on within the last few months and updating us, and I don't remember anything in either his old posts, or his new update, that indicated he was having much success at all?
If I'm wrong, can someone please clarify, because I really, really, REALLY wanted CSW -- and his methods -- to succeed!
My recollection is of a guy who did danmed near everything the way you're supposed to do it, was persistent as hell . . . and still zip-nada-zilch.
If you do Ill be happy to bring you back to your senses with a solid slap. 
