I am utterly confused as to whether or not my h is going through MLC or not. He is 36 years old and last August began telling me that he felt disconnected from me, and from life in general. I found out at the end of September with much prodding that he had had an affair seven years ago while deployed oversead for six months. Our first child was only seven months old at the time. The pre-deployment stress had been intense, with issues surrounding my health as well as first-time parent/baby concerns being contributing stressors. He felt much remorse for that affair, but was not forthcoming about it until five months ago.
Following the disclosure we attended weekly therapy sessions, and after my initial blow-out reaction to the affair, I made every effort to focus my energies on healing our marriage. The more I tried to draw closer to my h, the more he withdrew, to the point where he was feeling intense panic and boderline depression.
Early in November, after some blatant red-flags went off, I came to uncover the fact that he was in the throes of yet another affair. It had started while he was away for a three-week training deployment in August, which was just prior to his announcing that he was feeling disonnected. The time that he was gone, and during which it was consummated, happened to fall over our tenth anniversary. Suffice to say, our anniversary was overlooked, over which I had felt deeply hurt and disappointed.
The affair has been on-going for about six months now, with seemingly no hope of it ending any time soon. We have been living apart since the time the second affair was disclosed.
This business of affairs seems so out of character for my h. He has always espoused strong values, especially concerning fidelity in marriage, or so it seemed. He has been seeing a therapist since October, and has come to understand some things about himself. (I have to question whether his sessions with her are clouding his judgement and making matters worse). He believes that he has been a pleaser personality throughout our entire marriage, that in fact he was prior to marrying me, and that he may have "latched on" to me ten years ago out of fear of losing me, that marrying me was nothing more than the next step to take in the evolution of our relationship, and that he's been unhappy for some time now, just going through the motions and that perhaps much of our marriage has been a pretense. We had dated for five years before getting married.
He has said some of the usual things that people in his shoes feel like, "I'm feeling stifled and trapped", but he's also said things like, "I don't know if I've ever grown up", "I don't believe I was the practicing R.C. that I was with you, that I only did it for your sake, and I don't want to nurture my faith or my spirituality", "I don't know if I can be bothered to try", and "I don't want to grow", and "I don't know that I wouldn't stray again". He has told me he feels that the marriage is dead, and that he's "fallen for another woman now". He's also said something to the effect of how he'll always love me but as a friend.
All of these things sound nothing like nothing more than rationalizations and excuses to not take responsiblity for his choice to continue on this affair. He's admitted that he has no intention of stopping it, and that he has no remorse over having started it in the first place.
He is a man of few words, and so I didn't know how unhappy he was, I was shocked when he dropped the bomb(s) on me. I admit that I sensed a low-grade resentment from him for some time but whenever I would ask him what was bothering him, he'd deny anything was wrong. We did seem to feed off each others' moods and both of us, having been products of divorce ourselves, never learned how to effectively communicate our needs or negotiate and resolve conflicts. He did placate me much of the time during our marriage to avoid conflict at all costs.
Clearly, there are some issues in our marriage that need addressing, and I do take responsiblity for my part in having created the imbalanced power dynamic between us and the conditions within our marriage that made things ripe for this affair to happen; however, not only am I stunned by his behaviour, so are his family and friends.
Is this a mid-life, existential sort of personal crisis? One where he's trying to shed his old people-pleasing persona? Is he trying a new one on for a time and wanting to caste off our marriage because of what it represents to him? Is he in fact not on the right path in his life? He loves his military career, which has been a contentious issue between us in the past because life within the particular type of unit of which he's been a part for most of his career isn't conducive to family life and values. His contract comes due within the next few years, and while he had said for some time that he had every intent of getting out of the military at that time, now he's changed his tune and doesn't know what he wants where that is concerned. I know he's questioning whether he's living the life he's meant to live (by being married), and that he's taking time and more importantly, FREEDOM to explore who he really is. He doesn't seem to be exhibiting any other MLC sorts of behaviours, but then again, I don't see him much and I don't know what he's doing other than having an affair with the OW. He is making the effort to see his children every day.
If it's not a MLC, then is this nothing more than a matter of emotional immaturity due to an emptiness within, that he's now clinging onto someone else to fill the void because I stopped not only meeting his emotional needs, but his need for approval? Does he need someone to project back to him that he's okay, or more than that, perfect? Does he simply lack boundaries and impulse control, or was he truly that unhappy and now he's changed his values to suit his present actions?
It's an affair that's still being kept "secret" although the rumor mill was long since going before I found out about it, the point is, it's as far from being a "real" relationship as can be, it's still in the infatuation stage, and as long as it is kept under wraps, it may remain that way for some time, prolonging the intense feelings of euphoria and deferring reality from setting in.
The OW is someone with whom he works, and is, from what I can ascertain, the exact opposite from me in many ways.
If anyone can give me some insight as to what he/she perceives from the outside looking in, I'd appreciate it. I am trying to come to terms with it all, taking good care of myself and my girls, and chunking things down, but having a better understanding of what it is I'm dealing with will make it easier to make decisions for my own life. If it is a MLC, I will try to keep going as long as possible to see if he will extricate himself from this affair in time. If it isn't, I must question his character and his behaviour as this is the second affair after all, and especially if I accept what he is saying at face value, then whether or not this could ever possibly be a marriage of integrity.
Thanks to anyone out there who's willing to respond. lostinconfusion
So, so sorry to see you here. It's a trying period in your life you have embarked on, yet here you may find the strength and companionship to help you struggle on.
Your husband's decision to check out of his old life is one that may put you into a tail spin. I hope not, but if so, we shall attempt to pick you up, brush you off, and start you back on your way again.
Take care of yourself, sleep, eat, rest, relax, all as much as possible. You deserve it.
People who were happy and in love, are not, but they are.
People who were happy at home must party.
People who had it all, suddenly want none of it.
This is not about you so don't let the world turn you inside out or upside down. Don't try to think how you could have avoided January becoming December, or your H losing his direction in life.
You must keep your sense of self above all else, and let those that can help, reach out to you.
Sorry you need to be here, but under the cicumstances there is no place better. Keeping in mind that to my knowledge my H has not had any A's.I asked the same question about whether my H was MLC or not. Ultimately for me, the bottom line was if he was in MLC I could have compassion for what he was going through. Then the question was posed to me that the man I love is in alot of pain, so how would it hurt to show compassion for that MLC or not? I thought is was a good question. J and W2S are very wise, listen to them.
Sorry you find your way here. But this is a great place to be due to our sitches. There are lots of information on this board so start reading and learn all you can about MLC. This journey is all about him so the best thing you can do is take care of yourself and your children no matter what happens. I had to learn the hard way. For a long time I blamed myself every day for what has happen dispite everyone telling me this is about him.
Reading your post was like reading my own sitch, except that my H could not be honest with me about his affair.(I had to snoop to find out but still have not confronted him). And till this very day which has been 7 months still have not been able to speak to me other than responding to my questions.
Listen to FriendlyOne and Was2sad. Take care of yourself physically, emotionally and mentally. This will be a rough ride if you choose stand for it.
All I have to say is wow. I felt like I was reading my own story here. Except that we don't have kids and I don't have any proof of an A.
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I am utterly confused as to whether or not my h is going through MLC or not. He is 36 years old and last August began telling me that he felt disconnected from me, and from life in general.
My H is 34 years old. I don't know if he is MLC or not. He also began telling me that he felt disconnected from me.
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I found out at the end of September with much prodding that he had had an affair seven years ago while deployed oversead for six months.
My H is a Marine and was in Okinawa for 6 months in 1997-1998. We weren't married yet. After being there for 5 months, he called me on phone and broke up with me. No explanation of why. If there was another girl, I never heard of it. We were back together within 5 months.
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Following the disclosure we attended weekly therapy sessions, and after my initial blow-out reaction to the affair, I made every effort to focus my energies on healing our marriage. The more I tried to draw closer to my h, the more he withdrew, to the point where he was feeling intense panic and boderline depression.
Me too! I kept asking what I could do or say to help make things better between us. My H never had a single answer for me. And our MC didn't even try to help. She made it OK for my H to not give me any clues. My H didn't even try. I really don't know why we went to our counseling sessions.
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This business of affairs seems so out of character for my h. He has always espoused strong values, especially concerning fidelity in marriage, or so it seemed.
Me too. My H once said to me "Semper Fidelis isn't just about the Marines. It's how I live my life. It's who I am." It seems to me that "always faithful" and integrity should include taking responsibility for a vow you made before God.
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He has been seeing a therapist since October, and has come to understand some things about himself. (I have to question whether his sessions with her are clouding his judgement and making matters worse).
My H is still seeing the therapist that didn't even try to help us out. It's my belief that she is enabling him, so much so as to his mental detriment. My therapist says that it's actually unethical for our MC to continue to see just one of the partners in a couple that she had previously counseled. I agree with her. I felt that the MC was in my H's corner the whole time. I felt ganged up on. I guess I was right.
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He believes that he has been a pleaser personality throughout our entire marriage, that in fact he was prior to marrying me, and that he may have "latched on" to me ten years ago out of fear of losing me, that marrying me was nothing more than the next step to take in the evolution of our relationship, and that he's been unhappy for some time now, just going through the motions and that perhaps much of our marriage has been a pretense.
So scary! I could have written this about my H word for word. H is definitely a pleaser, has been his whole life. And it is all because of some deep-seeded insecurities he's always had. I never had any sense that we weren't completely in love until one day he just announced that he was unhappy. Like you, apparently my H feels that we shouldn't have gotten married. He never actually said that, but he may as well have. Instead, he said "We're just incompatible."
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We had dated for five years before getting married.
Me too.
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He has said some of the usual things that people in his shoes feel like, "I'm feeling stifled and trapped", but he's also said things like, "I don't know if I've ever grown up", "I don't believe I was the practicing R.C. that I was with you, that I only did it for your sake, and I don't want to nurture my faith or my spirituality", "I don't know if I can be bothered to try", and "I don't want to grow", and "I don't know that I wouldn't stray again". He has told me he feels that the marriage is dead,
I got "I don't have anything left to give." "You hurt my feelings and I can't get over it." "We have communication issues." "We're not good together." (Oh yeah, then why were we so happy together for 10 years? Why were you writing me love notes just 3 months before the bomb?) "We grew apart." That one is my favorite because he acts as if it's completely irreversible! As if we now live on 2 separate planets (well, we might as well since he's refused to talk to me except for twice since May).
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All of these things sound nothing like nothing more than rationalizations and excuses to not take responsiblity
Yes. As if they had nothing to do with making these decisions. That these things just "happened" to them. They are just running away from themselves and their past and their own individual (not marital) problems. And they must find reasons that they tell themselves in order to justify their actions. It's crazy, but it's all too common.
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He is a man of few words, and so I didn't know how unhappy he was, I was shocked when he dropped the bomb(s) on me. I admit that I sensed a low-grade resentment from him for some time but whenever I would ask him what was bothering him, he'd deny anything was wrong.
I also had no idea that he was unhappy with me. He had been depressed and full of anxiety due to his situation at grad school, but he never once led on that he had an issue with me. Then all of a sudden the "I'm unhappy with you" speech. Wow, where did that come from?
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both of us never learned how to effectively communicate our needs or negotiate and resolve conflicts. He did placate me much of the time during our marriage to avoid conflict at all costs.
My H told me that "we have communication issues." Um, like what? Like you never bothered to tell me that you're unhappy? My H will avoid conflict at any and all costs. For example, apparently he believes that walking away from a marriage and never speaking to me again is a much better option than having a discussion about it! This conflict avoidance/pleaser thing is something he's had his whole life. It just cracks me up that he's a Marine, yet avoids any kind of conflict whatsoever. He'll go way out of his way to avoid conflict.
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Clearly, there are some issues in our marriage that need addressing, and I do take responsiblity for my part in having created the imbalanced power dynamic between us and the conditions within our marriage that made things ripe for this affair to happen; however, not only am I stunned by his behaviour, so are his family and friends.
I feel EXACTLY the same way, sister. I know I wasn't always perfect in our marriage. But his actions are completely out of proportion. We never fought, no abuse, no infidelity, no substance abuse, no gambling, no deceit, no lying, no mistrust. Nothing. I guess he just didn't take his marriage vow seriously.
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Is this a mid-life, existential sort of personal crisis? One where he's trying to shed his old people-pleasing persona? Is he trying a new one on for a time and wanting to caste off our marriage because of what it represents to him? Is he in fact not on the right path in his life?
My H has been going through an identity crisis for about 4 years now. I don't think it is exactly MLC. But for a very long time now he has been trying to be different things. I don't think he really knows anymore who he is, or who he wants to be.
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He loves his military career, which has been a contentious issue between us in the past because life within the particular type of unit of which he's been a part for most of his career isn't conducive to family life and values. His contract comes due within the next few years, and while he had said for some time that he had every intent of getting out of the military at that time, now he's changed his tune and doesn't know what he wants where that is concerned.
My H left active duty in August 2001 to go to grad school. I had no idea that he would even consider going back to the military. Especially since I felt so lucky to have him out before Sept 11 happened. Then 4 years later, after I had put him through grad school, he all of a sudden tells me that he wants to join up again. I flipped out, but then a few months later I told him that I was OK with him joining again. I thought it just might be the thing to make him smile again. Wrong. He moved out about 3 months later. He'll be deployed (probably to Iraq) very soon. I'm surprised his unit is still in the states.
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I know he's questioning whether he's living the life he's meant to live (by being married), and that he's taking time and more importantly, FREEDOM to explore who he really is. He doesn't seem to be exhibiting any other MLC sorts of behaviours, but then again, I don't see him much and I don't know what he's doing.
These guys are just lost. I don't know why. And I'm sure they don't have a clue as to why either. I'm also in the dark. I have absolutely no idea what my H is doing since he moved out in May.
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If it's not a MLC, then is this nothing more than a matter of emotional immaturity due to an emptiness within, that he's now clinging onto someone else to fill the void because I stopped not only meeting his emotional needs, but his need for approval? Does he need someone to project back to him that he's okay, or more than that, perfect? Does he simply lack boundaries and impulse control, or was he truly that unhappy and now he's changed his values to suit his present actions?
Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Whether he's MLC or not. Yes to all of the above. He's lost, not sure what to do and is looking for approval from someone, anyone. Was he truly unhappy? I would doubt very much that even HE could answer that question. They just don't know.
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The OW is someone with whom he works, and is, from what I can ascertain, the exact opposite from me in many ways.
Very poor form to have an A with someone at work. Bad judgment on both of their parts.
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I am trying to come to terms with it all, taking good care of myself and my girls, and chunking things down, but having a better understanding of what it is I'm dealing with will make it easier to make decisions for my own life.
Good for you for taking care of yourself.
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If it is a MLC, I will try to keep going as long as possible to see if he will extricate himself from this affair in time.
Does he have a history of depression?
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If it isn't, I must question his character and his behaviour as this is the second affair after all, and especially if I accept what he is saying at face value, then whether or not this could ever possibly be a marriage of integrity.
You sound like you have so much of this thought out in a very healthy way. Is your H at all open to joint counseling, even for the kids' sake? Is he taking any legal action? If so, please make sure you look out for yourself and the kids. Perhaps the military can offer some free legal assistance for you?
You are not alone. I don't have many words of wisdom. But I hope it helps to know that there are others going through this same thing. We can help each other.
M 33
WAH 33
M 6 years
No Kids
Bomb 4/21/06
he filed for divorce
he filed for divorce - now what? part I
Things look so bleak now. I don't really want to resign myself to things being over, but my h has said that he feels it's too late. I've thought that it's been more about him, but he feels it's about him in our marriage. I think he has been ingenuous in our marriage as he didn't stand up for himself and his needs, he has told me he felt too controlled. Apparently, it was everything, but other than feeling controlled, he hasn't specifically said what were the key issues for him. I'll admit I do have my control issues which stem from my own insecurities, but I know that I would have negotiated with him had he shown the courage to assert himself. No one can take away your power without your permission. Then again, some of my expectations weren't unrealistic, but perhaps some of our values are don't line up. As a people pleaser, he's never known how to act from the core sense of who he is, he doesn't have a strong identity and he placated rather than truly engaging with me out of fear of losing me and for his own approval's sake. Rather than learning how to be more authentic in a relationship with me now, he'd rather walk away and start fresh. If only he knew how painful separation and divorce would be. I think it's a huge mistake, but maybe he won't learn and grow until he goes through the pain of separation/divorce, then again, not everyone does grow through these experiences, do they? They just keep repeating patterns of behavior in subsequent relationships. He's admitted that he'll probably regret it in time.
All I can control is whether or not I grow from all of this, and should we not make it, then I will be in a better place to have a healthier relationship with someone else in time. He must be in a lot of pain, midlife crisis or not, and so yeah, regardless of what happens, I will choose love and compassion rather than bitterness and resentment. From my perspective, at the root of why he won't try with me is fear, and perhaps stubborn false pride as well, something which runs rampant in his family unfortunately. It's so ingrained in him. Before I found out about the second affair, he had said "I don't want to lose you". Once the second affair was uncovered, he did a 180, I can only assume it's because he didn't want to have to face up to what he'd done and deal with the pain and hurt he's caused. He told me last night after I said that we had had something special, "I messed it up". I told him it wasn't too late but that's when he said, "I think it is".
I feel desperate some days. I have nothing to fall back on financially as I've been a homemaker/stay-at-home mom for the past eight years and have been rendered dependent on him for financial support (yes, I was naive to believe that I could trust him to always be there for me). I will have to go back to school to make something of myself, which will probably mean I will end up moving back home to have my support network around me to help care for my children. I don't want to move away and compromise my girls' relationship with their dad, but his job doesn't guarantee that he can always be there to take care of them if I'm going to school and besides, there is nothing for me here if he walks away from the marriage. It's a small military community. My options for schooling here are limited and it would take much longer for me to complete certification or a degree here than if I were to move back home.
I really am stuck between a rock and a hard place right now, because moving back home will bring with it some real struggles too. It would mean a big downgrade in our standard of living for a time, and I would have to rely on student loans to help pay for my schooling. I feel so overwhelmed and fatigued. I am trying to chunk it down and move in a healthy direction for myself and my kids. He's had years to get himself to the point where he's now at; I've only had months, but it seems he expects me to accept that it's a done deal.
I can continue to follow the divorce busting principles and hope in time that he'll realize that grass isn't greener, but I do need to protect myself financially, for mine, and my children's sakes.
I am on sleeping meds. I didn't want to take anything, but I do need my rest and insomnia has been a recurring problem since November.
I do laugh sometimes, even at the situation at hand, (black humor). I am trying to spend some time with my friends, and doing more fun things with my girls as well. Some days are better than others. Yesterday and today I'm not doing so well. For those of you of faith, keep me in prayer, thanks. lostinconfusion
I will choose love and compassion rather than bitterness and resentment. From my perspective, at the root of why he won't try with me is fear, and perhaps stubborn false pride as well
I think this is a good choice no matter what you ultimately decide you want to do. You're right that he is in a lot of pain. If you can see and validate that, it will be a gidt to him and yourself.
There's new book out (I just got it yesterday, so I'm not far into it yet), titled "How to improve your marriage without talking about it" by Patricia Love and Steven Stosny. It talks about how men operate out of shame and women out of fear (no generalities of course). It's just more info, but I find comfort in that. Protecting yourself and your kids is your first priority and I'm happy to hear you're doing that. As far as black humor, I've always been pretty twisted, so now....you can only imagine. Post here lots and let us listen and help where we can,
I think you are doing a fine job of weighing your options.
I encourage you to make yourself and kids priority one.
If making yourself better educated, skilled, and employable for life is in your future ... there is no day like today to start. If that means moving to a locale with better support in place for you and kids ... what was a H? If he becomes history, that is where he belongs. If he chooses to make the effort to exist, he will be visible.
He is not your priority although it is great if you can keep him on your radar somehow. But if the confused lost souls of the world feel they must leave, let em go. It is the only way they will ever learn whether it is right for them or not.
Oh yes, they run a huge risk of trying to come home one day only to find we all hitched our mobile homes together and left to start a commune of lovely people somewhere. Since it will only be for wonderful happy souls, we will likely just be a vague memory to the wanderers.
They will hear us doing the happy dance out in the fields they can not see.
They will hear the crunch of Doodles they can not taste.
And as they long to quench their parched thirst they will hear a resounding cry of "Tequila!!!!!"
