Interesting points MJ. I think incorporating a little of all three ways is a possibility. I see a little of H and I in many of the things you noted. And yes, I see option 3 as being fairly successful for many of the HD women on this board. I disagree with Cemar that men cannot attain option 3. Ok, I'll give you the fact that men may be driven biologically more by sex than women but it's hardly opposite sides of the spectrum. If it was, we wouldn't have so many LD men out there. I also see HD people using the whole "but I can't control my needs/wants" idea as an excuse to stand firmly entrenched in their own viewpoint. And thus, make no M progress. Marriage demands some compromise.