Journey of a Happy Heart

[COG]

Nic,

Whoa, you are fired up right now! I'd be standing at attention too if I were your H.

Good for you for wanting to set some boundaries, and stick to them. That is absolutely appropriate and well deserved. I hope to help you with the approach, that's all. Not judging the appropriateness, just trying to help you with the delivery.

It's sounding more and more like you are DONE, and I'm not judging that either. But maybe my POV might help you or somebody else that reads this.

Example: If it hurts you, or insults you, for your H to sit and read the paper while you do dishes, then he needs to know that. I know you must feel like just hitting the SOB up side the head with a pan. I'd feel the same way. But we guy's sometimes need to hear it straight. Look me in the eye and say, "H, I love you and I want our M to survive, but when you dirty the dishes and sit and read the paper while I clean them, it makes me feel like dirt. Like a monkey just threw poop in my face. It stinks, it smells and even a shower won't get rid of it. I really need and expect more from you. I know you probably don't even realize how it hurt me, but please help me out by being more respectful, and let me know if I ever do things that are disrespectful to you." Smooch on the cheek, end of story.

I had to learn how to communicate that way with my W. When she did things that hurt me, I tended to just let them(anger) build up, then I'd reach a breaking point and jump on her or critisize her for something she did that might be totally unrelated. At that point, her defenses would come up, and she would'nt hear a word I said. So, she would'nt know nor would she care that SHE was really the jerk, because my outward hostility overshadowed everything. Mind you I did not break things, or yell and scream, but I was clearly being hostile in the attitude, words and the approach that I took.

I agree with you 100% that it is VERY important to set boundaries, clearly state expectations, and voice your concerns. Equally important is how these things are delivered. A delivery that is mature, loving, patient, kind, and supportive, will get much more respect than one that is short, defensive, or in any way controlling or hostile. The old catching more bee's with honey than with vinegar thing.

I understand you've reached the point that you know who your H is, and you are pretty well sure he's not the man you want to stay M to, and you'll not stay M to him unless he changes. Nic, he's always been the way he is, even was that way before you M him. You knew how he was, yet you still M him. It was probably cute for awhile, but enough is enough after all these years it's way old.

IMHO he's been a jerk. He should not have had an A, he should be more responsible, a better father, and not such a flake. You have my complete sympathy for being stuck in the sitch you are in. But have faith, there is a purpose and a reason for this struggle. You will and are, growing, healing, and moving forward with life. Please be patient with your H, forgive him for being weak, be open and honest with him but be gentle and kind. Show him, teach him, how you want to be treated, and do it in a way that will give him no other choice but to admire you.

God Bless,

COG

[Bworl]

I'll just say that any man who has abandoned his wife, then comes over for dinner and sits his backside down to read the paper without offering to help clean up is NOT just a "man" who doesn't understand. He's a buttwipe and not deserving of any explanation whatsoever about how it would be nice if he helped clean up. For crying out loud. We're talking common decency.

Bill

[princess_nic]

Kiki - Thanks for stopping by.

Ever - Your H sounds worse than mine, actually. My H does make sure that we have enough money, thank goodness. I am just really upset that he said nothing about this money. I find it disrespectful.

Bill - Thanks for your support.

COG - I think that your ideas are great for a couple who is not as far gone as we are. No way would I be able to say that I love him and give him a kiss at the end. It just isn't going to happen.

It's sounding more and more like you are DONE, and I'm not judging that either.

I guess it depends on what you mean by "done." I am not going to file for Divorce, nor am I going to date. However, I am not really hopeful anymore. I am not going to try extra-hard to be kind and loving. I will treat him with the kindess I would treat a casual friend, not a husband.

You know how hard I've tried. I have really tried to break down the barriers, but now it's his turn to reciprocate in a more obvious way. If he's feeling worthless or whatever, he still needs to take the risk of telling me that he loves me and wants to be with me, if that's what he wants. I've had the guts to do that, and I am worth having it done for me.

I am still very sad for the loss of my marriage, for the loss of my dreams. But a desire for the past to be different is not enough to build a marriage on. He has made some changes, but much remains the same.

Whoa, you are fired up right now! I'd be standing at attention too if I were your H.

LOLOL! Boy, this is nothing! I'm annoyed, but calm. You should see me when I'm really mad!

I know I will be sad if he still wants a D, but I will not be devastated. You are right, COG, that he did have these same qualities when I married him. I thought his irresponsibility was charming b/c I am so over-responsible. I thought his fun-loving side was refreshing b/c I tend(ed) towards seriousness. However, those qualities became larger than life over the years, whereas the ones I thought I needed help with have mellowed.

I'm actually feeling pretty good. I'm peaceful. Somewhat sad, but peaceful. I remain open to the God and the Universe, and I will see what happens next.

Love to all,
Nicola

[amd]

Just checking in, Nicola. It is very frustrating to give your all and to feel like the other person just sucks it all in and doesn't give anything back. FWIW, I often didn't offer to help clean the kitchen after my H made dinner. He never said anything, so I figured he didn't care or didn't need me in there. I don't know if he did or not...because neither of us was good at saying what we really wanted.

I have no real advice. Just continue to treat him with loving kindness and take care of yourself. Be well.

[COG]

Nic,

I hear ya, and I understand. I admire how far you've come, and how much you've grown and healed.

You know how hard I've tried. I have really tried to break down the barriers, but now it's his turn to reciprocate in a more obvious way.

You've hit the nail on the head with that one. That's the way it should be.

You are right, COG, that he did have these same qualities when I married him. I thought his irresponsibility was charming b/c I am so over-responsible. I thought his fun-loving side was refreshing b/c I tend(ed) towards seriousness.

I guess the point is that maybe YOU have changed, he's still the same, so how can we blame him. Sure he should have grown up, been more responsible, more caring, but he's never been that way. He does'nt know how to be that way. He's untrained!(No excuse for infidelity mind you.)

Just so ya know, my human side would like to shake the man. I mean why the heck would he be walking away from such an awesome person. Not perfect of course, but you're just all around so far above the norm in so many ways. It just amazes me how lame some people are.

I'm actually feeling pretty good. I'm peaceful. Somewhat sad, but peaceful. I remain open to the God and the Universe, and I will see what happens next.

Well you sound really good and your attitude is in the right place for sure. God Bless, and keep up the good works.

Love,

COG

[lovingme]

Nicola sweetie I so know how you feel. When I am nice to my h it seems he is short and angry but if I stick up for myself a little and put up my boundaries then he is back to being nice.

I also wonder ALOT if the reason my h is being nice to me is so he doesn't get screwed in the D. He already has said he thinks I am trying to take advantage of him so I can live and easy life while he is broke for the rest of his. WHATEVER. I always heard being a single Mom was EASY!

I think you are doing the right thing and looking out for you and taking care of you.

Much love to you!
Christy

[princess_nic]

I have a quick question that I need advice on before I do anything about it.

A few weeks ago, H took $5,000 out of our joint checking acct (almost all his bonus). He didn't tell me about it, but when I noticed and asked him, he said it was to put towards a car. He did this also in June (he gets two bonuses a year), but used the money to furnish his apt instead.

Today, I saw that last week, he spent $250 at Ikea. I want to ask him why he is taking money out of our checking acct to pay for stuff for his apt when he already took $5,000 out. We ended up overdrawn, and I had to transfer money from the line of credit to cover that and so I could buy groceries today. Tomorrow is payday.

Any ideas on how to approach this, or even if I should?

For those of you wondering why we still have a joint acct, it's b/c we are not legally S and I do not want to come to any monetary agreement w/o consulting a L.

Thank you!

[amd]

This is an area that I struggle in as well. You should approach it because it affects you and the kids when he withdraws money without realizing the needs of your household.

What was his response when you asked about the IKEA purchase? His reaction will give you clue about his state of mind about this issue.

You need to think about what your goals are here.

Is the main concern the $5000 dollars being withdrawn? Is it more that he is spending money in a way that you don't agree with? Is it the fact that he left you stranded with an overdrawn account?

You probably cannot control how he spends or even if he spends, BUT you can tell him that it left you in a lurch and that that isn't OK. If possible, I'd try to include him in the solution, something like, "H, this happened. What should we do?" Then let him come up with a solution.

I'd also try to avoid the temptation to lecture. He's a grown-up and he knows better, but he doesn't need mommy to rub it in that he screwed up.

That's just my two cents, and it's definitely biased by my own situation.

[princess_nic]

AMD,

Thank you for replying. You asked a really good question about what the real issue is. To tell you the truth, it's the $5,000. We have a line of credit with a big debt on it b/c about half of the mortgage is on it. However, we also did other things with that money, like put in new windows and H just got some major work done on his teeth, only half covered. If we D (or LS), half that debt will be mine. My understanding last summer was that he would use his bonus to put on that...but he didn't. I thought he would put this bonus on it...but he didn't. I'm feeling very scared about the future and how I am going to pay of this debt that just keeps getting bigger and bigger. I will never make a lot of money if I stay in teaching. He will always make a lot more than me, yet our debt load will be the same. It sucks!!!

Also, in going over our acconts for the last two months more carefully, I discovered that the last time he wrote a cheque to the T was two months ago (Dec 14). And he told me 2-3 weeks ago he's still in therapy? He's lying. And it makes me sad. I want so much to believe in him, but he makes it so hard.

[hopefloats7]

For those of you wondering why we still have a joint acct, it's b/c we are not legally S and I do not want to come to any monetary agreement w/o consulting a L.

nic,

What I know is that half of anything in a joint acct. is yours. Period. I know it was his bonus, so ok, maybe you don't want to rock the boat so you don't mind that he take his bonus out. But he should not leave you high and dry that you're overdrawn and can't buy groceries.

These men get very angry and touchy about money during this. My H included. I can tell you that we left the joint accts. open for many months while we lived apart and were not yet legally sep. but eventually I got smart, opened my own acct. and put my paycheck in that. Away from his MLC spending sprees. I would suggest you do something similar. I know how scary it is, believe me. I got sick after I went to the bank that first time, to move everything around. But you do have to be sure that you will be ok.
I would tell H that you ended up overdrawn and needed to buy food. It's the truth, and he should know that you can't be left in the lurch this way. You need to get away from his debt, too. I know how you feel, as I don't make nearly what my H does, and now I'm trying to live on my own with very little help from him.
He will continue to lie; they all do it. He wants you to think the best of him, that's why he lies. If he didn't care whether you thought he was helping himself he would just tell you he stopped therapy. But you see, he wants you to think he's working on himself.
I'm sorry you're going through this. Just remember what I said: protect your finances.