Okay, tantrum over. Here's what I want from you guys. Is there anyone on this BB who can tell me why (besides the fact that I still have one minor child at home) I shouldn't leave this relationship OR what I can do to stop the inevitability that I will leave this relationship once my daughter leaves home? I should note that I don't think that a change in my mental attitude will be enough. Something concrete needs to happen here.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
I can't answer that, but I do recall that you were very upset when you thought your H might move out. I think you first have to figure why that was the case.
I can't answer that, but I do recall that you were very upset when you thought your H might move out. I think you first have to figure why that was the case.
I was upset because he was threatening to just quit his job and head out west. I would have been left to deal with the whole mess of the finances and the kids reaction to his behavior. Corri called me on this previously wondering why I was able to calmly consider the idea of my H being married to another woman but lost it when he threatened to quit his job. Basically, I got upset for the same reason Corri would get upset if her X told her that he was quitting his job and moving to Tahiti and she should no longer expect any child support from him financially or emotionally. Remember my H also kind of threatened suicide. How would anyone like to be the spouse left with the aftermath of that? I can't even begin to explain how desperate and trapped that makes me feel. I am having a persistent fantasy that some other woman will come and take him off my hands.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
"I don't think that a change in my mental attitude will be enough."
Yes it is.
I come back to this board after many months and everyone is still dealing with the same sh*t. In fact, the conversations are almost verbatim of what they were 2 years ago. I miss all you guys and our discussions, but they really are not that helpful FOR THE MARRIAGE. It's nice to have friends though, so I get it. BUT dwelling on how crappy the M is, is not beneficial. My M is not that different now than it was before (in terms of the sex), but we are at some level of peace now. It feels great. Not getting the nookie, but I feel love and respect for my H again. I made lots of mistakes on this board and outside the board but I have learned a lot too. Micro-analyzing every M interaction is NOT the answer. If you say something "concrete" needs to happen, you may be waiting forever. You all sound miserable. I UNDERSTAND, I have been there. BF hit me over the head with the 2x4 many times about how whiny and annoying I sounded. Well, as someone who is somewhat more objective now, I am hitting all your heads in return. Feel free to ignore me as I know you will but maybe someone will take it to heart. Hopefully this board is about growth and not just a pissing match. I really do mean this in the most sincere of ways. Hope it comes across that way. I care about you guys. I truly believe most of the M on this board are going to be just fine. But you need to mentally believe it first. Take care.
I have no idea if you will leave the R once your daughter leaves home. I'm pretty sure you stay because your R meets some litmus test of not being "bad enough" to leave while your child is at home.
I guess it boils down to - what do you like about your H as a person and as a spouse and do those things balance out the things that you don't like?
What I hope for you is that your H gets a clue at some point and considers whether or not this is the way he wants to live. I'm sure he has some aspirations for himself and his homelife but he needs to recognize that he could probably get what he wants with you IF he talked about it, made some personal effort.
LFL - I do respect your input. However, as you may be aware I have often been the one giving others pretty much the exact same message that you are giving me in your post. I am not saying that you haven't successfully resolved your situation. I'm just saying that I haven't found "improving my attitude" to be a way to successfully resolve my situation. At least not yet. I feel like I've practically done every tantric-improving-my-attitude-exercise that there is and still I find myself back in a bad place in my marriage. I also understand what you're saying about this BB being a possible contributing factor to my bad attitude through negative reinforcement. However, I find that it has worked both ways for me. I've been on and off this BB since I've joined it and sometimes I come back when things have gotten better and sometimes I come back because they have gotten worse while I was gone. Overall, I think I have experienced personal growth vis a vis the BB because I no longer have bad reactions in response to the posts of LD spouses like I used to. I feel compassion for both sides of the picture. I think that both "bad" LD and HD behavior can be damaging to a relationship and I hope to avoid manifesting either in the future. (In spite of the fact that I am sort of manically swinging back and forth between the two in my above posts. AAARGH.)
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
I have no idea if you will leave the R once your daughter leaves home. I'm pretty sure you stay because your R meets some litmus test of not being "bad enough" to leave while your child is at home.
Actually he pretty much flunked that litmus test when we had our fight in which he said "We don't have a happy family life.". The essence of what he was communicating during that fight was that he didn't have the emotional capability to support me in my effort to have a happy family life. I was "delusional" to think that it was possible to ask this of him. His essential "unhappiness" was more important than what I valued in terms of "family".
Just recently, a few days after my Bday disappointment, he said something to me like "I guess what it comes down to is that I just don't have anything left over to give to a relationship." (due to his depression over his job situation etc.). How am I supposed to "make do" with that? Am I supposed to smile and say "Oh that's okay, honey. I don't need anything. You just take care of yourself and I'll keep on doing all the many things that I do in support of you.".
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I guess it boils down to - what do you like about your H as a person and as a spouse and do those things balance out the things that you don't like?
For some reason that doesn't seem like the right way to look at it to me. Like I'm comparison shopping for cereal or something.
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I'm sure he has some aspirations for himself and his homelife but he needs to recognize that he could probably get what he wants with you IF he talked about it, made some personal effort.
My H rarely complains about anything to do with me anymore and when he does bring up stuff, like the ugly shoes complaint, I do what I can. His complaints, unhappiness all have to do with his "job" and his "life". It is not clear to me what I can or should do to "fix" this. What could any of the wives of the men who jumped from the buildings when the stock market crashed done to "fix" things?
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
My H literally never complains about anything to do with how I dress, take care of the house, behave in the R or anything. Once in a blue moon we will discuss a parenting issue that he sees differently. However, I remain convinced that he has aspirations, goals and a vision of marriage/homelife that isn't being perfectly met. He just won't discuss it nor be a party to any discussions that involve my suggestion that he must have some thoughts about how I could improve as a wife/person/lover.
I'm not suggesting that you should or could do anything to fix whatever Mr. MJ fails to verbalize. However, like with my H, I suspect that Mr. MJ probably has much more going on than meets the eye and that he is capable of more than he is putting out. However, his depression, FOO, personality, whatever block him from asking for what he wants (not just b*tching about ugly shoes) or for that matter, trying to meet more of your needs. If you don't stay, it will be this reason that will ultimately, be the cause. It won't be because he wouldn't participate in a sex life, it won't be because he is mopey complaining about his "job" and his "life" - it will be because he didn't participate in finding a solution to those things. That position is difficult to respect. My ex-H was a chronic complainer about his sucky "life" - believe me, I understand. That alone made it ever so much easier for me to walk away especially after he laid waste to his sucky job and life via lost jobs, legal charges, burned bridges etc...
My question for you is - if your H already failed the litmus test then what is keeping you there? If you don't want to look at it as a cost/benefit analysis of a sort (there are emotions involved so it isn't quite that really)- then what is the appropriate determinant of when it hurts too much to stay? I must profess that I do believe that your M is workable if only because you are one heck of a lady............
My question for you is - if your H already failed the litmus test then what is keeping you there? If you don't want to look at it as a cost/benefit analysis of a sort (there are emotions involved so it isn't quite that really)- then what is the appropriate determinant of when it hurts too much to stay? I must profess that I do believe that your M is workable if only because you are one heck of a lady............
It's almost like it hurts too little to stay. Like I was a bouncy ball with a little jingle inside and I kept bouncing up against the walls of this relationship and the wall hasn't budged but my little jingle is broken. There is nothing left to break anymore because I'm all rubber.
If I initiated sex tonight and my H rejected me it wouldn't bother me in the least, even if he said something cruel. I'd just be thinking "whatever". That is probably why I won't initiate sex. It would just be a nihilistic exercise.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
That is very sad. I remember knowing I was ready to leave in part because I felt so neutral - not angry, not sad, just nothing. There is no doubt that your H has taught you that it is not worth it to feel anything about his words and behaviors. I think the statement that you made on another thread about your H saying that he just "fell into the marriage with you" - well, it p*ssed me off. Has there ever been a time that you accurately labeled the crap your H throws at you and then walked away without further discussion? For example, "H that was a mean thing to say" or "H, that was uncalled for." I don't know that it will change what he says one iota but it might help you accurately assess things and feel your feelings again. I hate that it "doesn't bother you in the least" to be turned down by your H - that smacks of resignation not differentiation. You are too good a person to go around resigned and unfeeling.
With the emotional armour you have learned to shield yourself with can you tell how much it would hurt to stay or go? Maybe you should visit a C to help make this decision. A decision about leaving your M now or in the future certainly bears some exploration before you just respond to one of Mr. MJ's sh*tty comments with a a packed suitcase on the spur of the moment.
