z, thanks for your words, I know the anger has to go, I am doing my best to stay calm when talking with h, and actually am finding myself asking him to tone down at times.
i do know it as fact that he was leaving me not just because of her but she definately was a factor, he himself said he was planning to be with her, fell "in-love" with her etc.
I do know that she asked her h for a d and expressed her feelings for my h.
my h and ow did have discussions of how they would trust eachother etc...
so I do know that they were planning to leave their spouses to be with eachother. that is not to say that they were leaving for that reason alone but it helped. when i talked to ow in july she was not planning to leave her h, said at some point maybe i don't know but not now. then low and behold in aug (when my h expressed his feelings) she asked her h for a d. and is still going through with it. (really smart thing for a woman with two young kids and terminal cancer to do, don't you think)
these two think they can still be in contact with eachother, she can call to say hi and see how he's doing, how she's doing etc, she can call to say happy birthday. sorry I am not comfortable with that type of r between them, I know you can relate to that z.
I am trying to try, but I guess the way for me is to not call h, not ask him to come over, not ask to spend time and not talk about anything, keep my mouth shut. not the type of r I really want to have but I think if I do otherwise at this point I will be pushing him away. so then we will have a on sided r once again only this time it will be him wanting me and me not wanting him.
I am tired and I just want a normal marriage, I don't want to walk on eggshells anymore. I want to enjoy my family and not feel threatend that h will run away again.
Please to meet you LL.
I can relate to the pain you feel and how you are scared. We initiate the change in our M's by changing ourselves. then we wait though their skepticism as we wonder why it takes so long to accept our changes. Then one day, usually when we least expect it, they change and want the M to be right again. Then we become the the skeptics as we seem to have just a difficult a time accepting that they really want to come back. LL, basically the roles have been reversed and now it is our turn to work through our issues and given time we work through them just as they did.
About the rings, might it be that he is not asking because he doesn't want to pressure you, thinking you are not wearing them because YOU might be ready to? Perhaps, you might want to put them on in his presence, then he might interpret that as a sign that you are ready for him to come home. Just a thought. He might be hesitating because he may be picking up a vibe from you that he is interpeting as you are not ready for him to come home. It may be the both of you are waiting on the other to make the next move.
P.S. This post in response to yesterday's post. That is what happens when I go off line to write a resonse. Now I will catch myself back up with today's activity.
You get too tired to hate, to fear, to be angry. You just let things alone, because it's just too hard to try to make them work. The, somehow, they begin to work themselves.
z, my fear is that in getting to tired of dealing or thinking about all this, I will simply just get tired of being w. yes I love my h, but I am reaching a point where I am just getting tired of trying and waiting. then it will be a one sided marriage, h will be trying and I will just be numb as I am getting. LL
Read what Michele says about affair. I am quite sure it must be severed
- no contact to reconcile/restore the marriage.
Of course, you have no control over H, but your changes can trigger his changes.
(Re-read DB/DR - you are in the best place now to use these techniques for the best results.)
For me no-contact is the only answer. As relationship is an evolution of a friendship.
Boundaries were ignored or non-existant and thus the A.
Boundaries are a challenge (for me).
No-contact would be a primary for me, but that is me - fully realizing I can't control OW attempts
but expecting H to not respond (being too "friendly" was the problem!).
Ignore OW to the point that she is so insignificant she eventually disappears,
which is how I deal with OW - I will not obsess and I will not bring OW into
our M in conversation, thought, etc
(in any addiction the challenge is to keep addiction out of addict's thoughts).
Also, don't concern yourself if he is lying about OW - concentrate today on laying out your future w/H.
Stay focused on (maybe re-write) your goals.
It is significant to know if you are dealing w/MLC or A or both.
Educate yourself on the life cycle of MLC and/or A. Plenty of info on this BB and Jim Conway's site.
thanks lsl, I do not know if it is a mlc or not, h is acting different but there is no way for me to know if the differences are really different or him just getting comfortable showing me who he is, h was very detached and withdrawn for a long long time. definate a, they can call it a friendship if they like, ow actually at one point did admit to it being and ea. both claim no pa. I have read the infidelity section of dr and have some understanding of why it happend. h has read the infidelity section for the betraying partner as well. this is a slow road, I want the r I have been waiting for and it seems to be right at my finger tips, how to get it in my palm is the question. h seemed to be more interested and calling more when I was more reluctant. I am not pursuing him physically (don't have to, he can't keep his hands off me) started calling him just a few days ago, hasn't worked in my favor as his calls have slowed. h seems sincere in his wanting to come home, lets me know that he will get angry and frustrated but he isn't going to run away. thing is he isn't here yet to run away. I just wish I knew what I was really dealing with. an ea as a result of unhappiness? a pa? a mlc? h has not been a real part of my life for so long that I don't know how to tell. I belived him when he told me the r with her was over the last time, he has confessed that it didn't end he lied and asked her to lie to me to (about when they had last talked) I want to believe they have simmered the r down, I want to believe there was no pa (at least not before he left the house) honestly I want to skip all this and have h come home so we can begin developing some sense of normalicy, it is difficult to have a marriage when your spouse doesn't live in your home. LL
I was able to say to my H that any contact w the ow was 'unhealthy' for the rebuilding of our R. That was the reason he (said) used when he emailed her telling her to stop calling. Seems she complied.
Our C asked me just what it would take for me to kick him out. I said "another affair" and said more concerning the heritage of our children. What he heard seems to have been "the affair".
It took a lot of self-talk to get myself to the point where I could cover those two topics. This was done before I read Michele's books or started my spiritual journey. I was calm, so calm, when making my statements though. That is important when you draw your lines, set your boundaries.
LL, you set the boundaries just for you, your self-respect. Your H either accepts them or not. Heart's Blessing would post that if they don't accept them then we can't lose them---because they've already left.
If you're dealing with MLC you have to stand for yourself, he can't tune into your emotional needs cause his journey is all about him. Did you post that there had been a PA?
If there was and it is a MLC then you have a midlife transition of your own to traverse.
LSL knows far more about this than me so I give her the podium.
Regardless of whether it's MLC or some other "Issues" thing, you will want to find that inner peace and calmness that will enable you to make your baby steps in the recovery process.
Good luck!
Hey, did you know that Anger isn't a bad thing? It's an emotion. It's what preceded it (fear, anxiety, hurt, frustration,etc) that you need to examine and heal.
I used to internalize my emotions and blow up in anger. Very bad. Couple that with my Hs habit of pushing my buttons then harvesting my anger and stuffing it inside him. What a mess.
Wouldn't hurt to get a book that deals with the effective handling of anger. I figured out that most of my anger was preceded by my frustration at not being able to easily "control" my Husband. Ah-ha! Give up the control and there goes the frustration which eliminates the anger.
Go figure.
Currently I am basking in the understanding of how to spiritually release my Husband to God. I did it!
thanks lily, I know my anger is used to hide the hurt, realized that six months ago, I get mad and throw words (and on occasion fists) instead of crying and letting the hurt out. I am an acoa, had a controling father (who would hit), a brother who took on fathers ways, and another brother who took to molesting me. so there is alot of hurt behind the anger! and obviously a huge problem with trust!
I am still not sure of mlc status of my h, I always thought he'd be a canditade for one, started his own business at 19 and lived rather like an old man for a long time. our r suffered as a result of his over dedication to the b and my over dedication to the r. the ea was a result of burnout, and possibly to test his manhood, didn't want to be with me anymore and couldn't stand it anylonger. still does not admit to a PA though. h did say something that makes me think mlc (among other little things that could be just part of his awakening) he feels trapped, made sure to point out not trapped in the marriage, just trapped in general.
he knows that he has caused a lot of pain for a lot of people, I have not been the only on losing sleep over the past year.
even while he was walking away, there were plenty of occassions when he would say "this sucks" well then why are you doing it I'd ask. no reply.
h never stopped taking care of me or the kids, infact in his leaving he learned to be a daddy, and started helping out with the house, dishes and cleaning up stuff.
h could be in mini mlc, is def having withdrawal from ow, he had been talking to her everyday for the past year at least.
I had my own mlc through this, I went from being perfect mom and housewife, to smoking a pack of cigs a day (had been a smoker before) got a tatoo, started dressing like I used to going out with friends again etc...
I don't know what is going to happen, but basically for now h can drive, if he choses to have me in the car fine, if not, I'll go read a book or go out!! LL
LL-Sounds like midlife crisis all around. Thye want their cake and to eat it too. My h had a PA fro 2.5 yrs before I found out about it. Kept telling me how unhappy he was and blaming me for everything. IT made me feel crazy-still does. HE says the A is over but I don't know. Don't ask anymore. He has to decide who he wants-its his hell right now as he has withdrawn from me for who knows why. I am loving and kind to him-I will not make it easy for him to leave me. I want him to stay. I want him to want to stay, but he has free will. SO.. I wait to see what he does. He also told me he feels trapped. It must feel awful to be them and have to be so miserable. Our C thinks my H is depressed. I also think this but he will not admit it. It would take a miracle-one I am always praying for. He is a man of integrity. IT will nopt be easy for him to walk away from 30 yrs of marriage and a family sitchuation and a commitment he made. I am riding it out-sufffering much along the way, but getting stronger as I see its him and not me. I am not perfect and have had to let go of the control he did not used to mind. The whole system has changed and I have had to change along with it. This is the toughest thing I've ever been through. You and I have been through similar things.I too was molested by my step brother for yrs. My H and family have been everything to me. I lost me somewhere in all of this and am having to find me in this process by no choice of my own-its a matter of survival for me. I am so tired of the panic and anxiety that I am letting go of him. Not stop loving him, but letting go and let him find his own way. best wishes,and good luck, Rachael
rachel, thanx for stopping by, I know you've been having a hard time, I've been reading your thread for a while, hope being back at work it helping you "get away"
I do not know if this is a "true" mlc or not, h has always been a different kind of guy, maybe it is maybe it isn't I do not know, but either way it isn't my issue it's his.
tonight h came over, didn't actually ask me to be around so I wasn't as I have been throughout the reconcile unless I actually had things to do, so tonight shortly after his arival I went out. went and saw "white orliander" and then went to a local dive and shot some darts, was asked to play and then played a team of real dart team members, got my ass kicked but didn't mind. h called cell phone at 10:15 to let me know he was watching football on the couch and starting to fade, said I could wake him if I wanted to, hoped I was having fun. (I didn't tell him where I was going except out) H is sorry for all that he's done, sorry for hurting everyone including himself. never thought this would happen to us. h is wanting to come home, needs space and time, and most importantly needs me to heal from all the pain that he has caused. I say that he has caused not because he is to blame for everything that went wrong in our r, but because instead of talking to me and dealing with our problems he chose to always walk away or go to sleep and hoped everything would just work itself out, (things just don't work that way) and then chose to start a relationship with one of his female customers that became a bit too much of a friendship and ultimatley led to his having feelings for her and visa versa then leading to him walking away from me and his two kids, mind you our d was three months old when I discoverd the friendship and six months old when he walked out. I feel so bad for my kids they are now 3 1/2 and 1 and they have seen me cry way to much. I am truly spent on this. basically the ball is in h's cort I can carry it no longer, it is up to him to decide what he wants. he says he wants to be a daddy and a h. he is trying and I am trying to let him try. it is new, it is scary, I am trying to lose the resentment and anger I feel toward him but it is really annoying that it has taken all this to happen for him to finally realize the importance of actually spending time and "being" a couple. I know I've just rambled a whole lot, hope there is something in what I've just said that someone can make sense out of.
LL, basically the roles have been reversed and now it is our turn to work through our issues and given time we work through them just as they did.