Well, I sprung the question this morning...went over like a lead balloon! W's walls sprung up so fast it was incredible. Here's the short of it: W: What would be the purpose of this? Me: It would help us to think about the future and what we want as individuals and as a family W: You just want everything to be the way it was Me: NO, the way it was,was not good. W: I do my own thinking, I don't need someone to help me think besides it's none of her business"..."I know what it will be, I have lots of issues to deal with and I'm the one to blame for this" Me: I would never suggest a process that would do that. This is positive, future oriented and respectful. The therapist asked me to tell you that. It's not about blame or digging up the past, it's about helping us to look forward and figure out what we want in our lives" W: Well, what do we need it for? It comes down to I stay or I go and I choose to stay. You can choose what you want to do and the kids will have to adjust to it. Me: I don't think it is a matter of me or you making decisions it is about us making decisions together, even this one if it has to be made that way!" It went on for a bit after that. She said she's not happy but chooses to live that way and that is that! I asked her to at least think about what I've suggested and that I wouldn't pressure her. I said "you will think about it,at least,right" She said "why do you have to keep bothering me, of course I'll think about it, it's in my head now!" We'll wait and see. Again, I assured her that I would never take her into a counselling situation that would be judgemental or disrespectful, I would never do that. I told her I chose a SF Counsellor for that very reason. Wow, she was bristling. She wants everything to remain just the way it is. I told her that I am having difficulty with the way things are and can't see this going on forever. She said "then do what you have to do". Afterwards we got dressed, went down stairs and carried on as a very pleasant couple! What a life.
Well, W and I just returned from a lunch out together. I took her to a new Cafe neither of us had been to. We talked through the whole lunch. We discussed the usual kid stuff but I also brought up my school experience last weekend. I began to describe to her the SF approach to counselling and she asked me questions, which I tried to answer as best I could. I deliberately did this to keep our conversation of this morning alive in her head and to give her a better idea of what this counselling model would entail. Maybe relieve some anxiety. I feel pretty good about this morning because I did something different, I threw a little wrench into the works! Things are NOT the same now. She must respond in some way, hopefully in a positive way but either way the status quo is now in question.
I feel that she basically wants to take no responsibility for anything here, it's the "try not to be the bad guy" approach. If I decide I want to leave then that makes me the bad guy, not her. This is what I want to get away from and get to a mutuality in decision making. If we split, then it is a joint decision, if we try to make a go of it, it's a joint decision. I don't want bad guy versus good guy here. So, I'll wait this out a bit and let W process this new development and go from there. I've planted the seeds and watered them now lets see what grows!
Thoughts for today: W told me she didn't want to traumatize the kids by leaving yet she seems OK with allowing me to traumatize the kids if I choose to leave. If she really cared about not traumatizing this kids, wouldn't she do everything possible to make sure this m really was over? Wouldn't she work on this first? No, instead she is basically interested in herself, not the kids. Again, she doesn't want to be the bad guy. That has nothing to do with caring about the kids, that is ME ME ME! Btw, I know this thought has absolutely no value in keeping up my PMA or probably anything else! Now my next thought: W is always reading things that talk about following the heart. The OP used to always send her little cards and thoughts with this kind of crap on it, "your heart knows what is best". Well, to my knowledge the heart is an organ that pumps blood, WTF can it possibly know? The heart is but another term for doing something regardless of the thought processes that tell you it is wrong! Go with the heart is just another term for ME ME ME! So that is my last useless, PMA reducing thought for today! I think it's called anger, but hey, I'm just going with my heart here! OK, enough. Back to doing something constructive now.
Whatis, I had a talk with W that echoed what you posted pretty closely. W talked about my statement that I could only see us being friends post divorce if our parting happened under a certain set of circumstances. She told me that I was being unreasonable because I was going to punish her at our S's expense. Nevermind what she's doing. She still thinks we can somehow be very close, and even be better parents together living in different houses because we won't have to worry about money and all the day to day stuff that pisses her off about living with me! Talk about fantasy!
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
Muddle, I think they are just so locked into the way they are thinking that anything that threatens that gets a viscious kick right where it counts! If her R with OP is so wonderful and secure then what is the problem with going to see someone and showing that to be the case. Hey, maybe I would see the light and give up! Wouldn't that be a possibility too. She could then say "I went for counselling and did my part". My W is embarrassed and ashamed and wants to keep it all tucked away, exposing it to noone. She wants to carry on just as is, on auto pilot. I want to discuss with her all the ramifications of separation and what that will mean but, again, to use a utilitarian approach to keeping our M alive would be useless. She must choose to stay and work on us because that is what SHE wants to do. We'll see how it all shakes out. Thanks for dropping by.
I just wanted to drop by and see how your are doing brother.
I echo your thought process on the kids but what do I know...I guess I am a complete idiot because the W knows that the kids will be just fine and dandy with whatever happens.
Not good from the post. Now get your head out of your but and let the emotions go.
Hope you day goes better than the way it has started...
Later, Ben
Ben 32 STBXW 29 3 kids (D1,S4,SD8) (1 dog 5months) Status: Fighting for the Kids.
"The only thing we know about future developments is that they will develope."
1210, great to see you dropping by...I got your message on LL's thread. You really think she'll go to counselling with me? Personally, I don't think there is a hope in Hell! But, I've been wrong before I just think that for her to go to C'ing would mean she is doubting her decision (in her mind) in regards to OP and if that is the case then the Hell she is inflicting on her family is and has been pointless. So by not going she is showing that she is firm in her decision. She is not interested in anything that could be considered an attempt to try and save this M. That would be disloyal to OP. Now, will she ever see it differently? Who knows, one thing I am a believer in is never closing the door because you "think" something is a certain way. I am willing to wait it out for a while and see what comes but the next step (in consultation with the therapist) may well be to pull the plug on this as I will not live forever in such an insane situation. This could be the way to actually save the M, if that makes sense. The problem is that right now the day to day life seems relatively normal and sane but the underlying stuff is crazy! I have worked hard to keep my homelife as healthy and loving for my family as possible (my W has too, for what she's able to do). Time will tell how this story plays out. Talk to you soon 1210!
I just think that for her to go to C'ing would mean she is doubting her decision (in her mind) in regards to OP and if that is the case then the Hell she is inflicting on her family is and has been pointless. So by not going she is showing that she is firm in her decision. She is not interested in anything that could be considered an attempt to try and save this M. That would be disloyal to OP. Now, will she ever see it differently? Who knows, one thing I am a believer in is never closing the door because you "think" something is a certain way. I am willing to wait it out for a while and see what comes but the next step (in consultation with the therapist) may well be to pull the plug on this as I will not live forever in such an insane situation. This could be the way to actually save the M, if that makes sense. The problem is that right now the day to day life seems relatively normal and sane but the underlying stuff is crazy! I have worked hard to keep my homelife as healthy and loving for my family as possible (my W has too, for what she's able to do). Time will tell how this story plays out. Talk to you soon 1210!