I hate to hear the biopsy took so much out of your Mom. I hope tomm is a brighter day for both of you. God heard your prayers friend. No, it wasn't out of line for you to ask him to look after you too. He wants you to need him, he loves you.. you, your Mom, and your W are three of His most precious creations. That always gives me strength when I'm down.. of all the beautiful things in the world, he values and loves us the most and because of that, answers our call for help.
((((Jeff)))) If there's anything at all that J or I can do, please don't hesitate to let me know. And since I've been a Mom so long.. I have to ask if you're eating and taking care of yourself too. It hasnt been very long ago that you were down with pneumonia and well, I'd hate for you to get run down and sick again.
Just thinking of you and sending warm thoughts your way....slight subject shift - your kids...what of them? You haven't talked of them recently....please do so if only to remind yourself of the Circle....of why you're taking the high road in your life....
And then go buy yourself a Bill Cosby CD and laugh - just a little bit....
Be over here to join you as soon as my old thread is done...I like closure....
Oh hey - DYD - ran across a thought for you to muse upon when your brain is ready for such....when we make "decisions" we live....when we don't - when we're passive with life, we stop living....what decisions is Jeff making for himself right now?
Jeff..still praying as well. You know, if YOU need an ear, I'm here too. FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
My mom is a bit better. Many, many tests. Her pneumonia is improving but her age is against her still. She has negative reactions to massive antibiotics and drugs. She also has a “mass” in her abdominal area that is still to be determined. But I expected her to be gone by now so who knows. Her doctor is also worried about “hospital disease” – the longer you are in the more chance of getting something else.
My W finally visited mom Sunday. The first week W only came once for 15 minutes and as I wrote above mom was put out. But W did show Sunday, and then she came each day since. She has talked to the doctors and is now playing the role of concerned daughter-in-law. If W learns something she lets me know.
Her behavior is not affecting me in the least and I am not reading anything into it. I am glad she is involved – I think my mom appreciates it and I do too.
There have been several great posts recently concerning detachment and giving up.
WCW: Detachment vice withdrawal. “A light bulb went on for me. Sometimes I can detach, and add lovingly. But just as often I just plain old withdraw. That's not a good thing, and I KNOW H feels it, feeds off of it, does it too, I feel it, feed off of it, H feels it,.....see the pattern?”
Nicola: being “detached in the sense that I am not tied to the outcome”
Bill (Bworl): “Getting a life, detaching, these seem to be the bugaboos that so many of us struggle with. I was thinking last night that both are so critical to BOTH our survival and improving the chances that there can be restoration one day. …Getting a life helps us to realize that we can be happy on our own, that we don't HAVE to have our spouses to find meaning, purpose, and satisfaction in our lives. …Detaching keeps us from being lambasted every time our lunatic spouses do the things that tear us apart inside. ….There is never a reason to be satisfied with a relationship that is not fulfilling to me, that doesn't give me the opportunity to feel happy and content.
More from Bill: “Detaching, letting go, moving on, and yet at the same time trying to understand what it means to stand. These are such difficult things for me to feel comfortable with. At various times I feel good about where I am with any one of them, but I realize that rarely do I feel good about the whole package. …Being a stander to me means that there is always a bit of uncertainty hanging over your head.”
Walkingback: “The issue of 'Standing' is one I've never really got my head around. I can kind of understand RCRs views on standing, in that she is fundamentally opposed to divorce, there are no issues of abuse or addiction and she considers her husband is going through some sort of metamorphis from which there will still be a place for her in his life when he emerges. I'm less enthusiastic about those who stand in the face of high levels of disrespect, addiction and abuse. God may hate divorce - but I don't reckon he's too keen on human beings crapping on each other either.”
Great stuff folks, but too much to get my head around. I have come to some personal conclusions but first I have to look deep within and ask what I am really feeling one year after the bomb:
Rejection of my M: My W rejected our M. I do not handle rejection well. I believe I am a good, decent person and I never intentionally set out to hurt anyone. So my self-esteem defense kicks in: I will not accept that W has rejected our 15 years together. She will see I have changed and she will return to me.
Rejection of me: In order for her to detach, my W has chosen to have little interaction with me. If I try to talk to her or show kindness/love it is taken as being controlling and manipulative on my part. She is in effect rejecting me as a person. Not just the M and our life together, but me as a person. My self-esteem defense kicks in big time: This is even more impossible to accept. How can she feel this way? It may sound self-righteous but I will prove that I am a good person; she will see it and return to me.
Blame: I am the LBS therefore I must be to blame for everything. Again the self-esteem at work: self-pity is a very strong defense mechanism. It protects us from being hurt b/c we have already taken on all the blame. Again self-righteous but W will see how sorry I am and how I have learned. She will forgive me and she will return to me.
Her disrespectful behavior: Objectively, W is treating me with complete disrespect. She calls me manipulative. She is taking my kids away from me 60% of the time. She is taking my house and half of everything I own. She does not have the courtesy to discuss things with me. She hurts me every chance she gets. My self-esteem defense again: It is not her fault. She must be in some form of personal “crisis”. She must be sick and/or mentally ill. How else do you explain her behavior? I know her too well. The “aliens” have her. I will forgive her (self-righteously?) and she will snap out of it and she will return to me.
Her attitude: She is cold and she tells me there is no chance of reconciliation. Self-esteem one more time: Her behavior is confusing and I sometimes see “baby steps” towards me. Sometimes she is nice and treats me like a H so she must not be indifferent; therefore she still has emotional attachments. Those attachments must be strong b/c I see how her “hate” towards me appears to be a strained “act” like she is trying to talk herself into something that she does not want. It is not about me, she is just confused. She does not mean it. She will sort it out and she will return to me.
If you put the self-esteem defenses aside and look at it with cold logic then let’s jump to the most likely assessment.
I have been rejected, totally and on purpose. I am totally to blame in her eyes. She is not respecting me, on purpose. She is cold, on purpose. Her attitude is clear: she wants me gone and she wants a new life. There is confusion b/c it is hard to just let-go cold-turkey but she is in no “crisis”. She is not an alien; she is a big girl and she knows full well what she is doing. There are no “baby steps”, just my misinterpretation of what I am seeing b/c I want to see otherwise.
Bottom line: She is NOT going to return to me. I really must accept that fact and the sooner I do the sooner I will be whole again.
So?
I will allow her to be who she wants to be. I will accept her behaviors and not fight them, question them, or interpret them.
I will not tolerate her crossing my boundaries. I will not tolerate disrespect in hopes of getting her back.
I will stand by her and our family; not withdraw. Standing means unconditional support and unconditional love; I will treat her like a human being who is the mother of my children and as I would a friend. “Standing” does not mean “waiting and hoping”. I must give up all hope and I must move on. I am open to the possibility of reconciliation but I will not expect it to happen and I am not tied to this outcome.
I will not beat myself up or allow her actions to tear me up inside. I am better than that.
I forgive myself and put her actions in the proper context. I will pray for further guidance. To me, that is what it means to place my life in God’s hands.
Quote: I will not beat myself up or allow her actions to tear me up inside. I am better than that.
Well said. This is helping me too. H and I argued - he is in a sulk, but you know what? He chose to be there. Yes, I influenced it but I'm not keeping him there. He can come out of it any time he chooses, but in the meantime I'm not going to pander to it.
I love this, Jeff - very strong. Your W has chosen how she wants to feel and refuses to accept any alternatives. You have shown her things can be different but until she bites the bullet, looks deep into herself and asks herself if there could be a better way there is little you can do, except to carry on being a great Dad and treating her as a friend, but not accepting mistreatment.
Bomb (ILYBINILWY, don't want to be married)Sept05 Seperated Sept/Oct 05 Oct 06 - H recomitted July 11 - I am now a WAW.
Jeff..my friend. Strength and honor as always. I think that you've stepped up to the plate and are doing great. I think, as we spoke, that the absence of your W initially was her fear, or , confusion as to how to react to your mother's illness. "Hold the line". It's MY turn to tell you that you are doing great.
As mentioned, I can tell you that you are making EXCELLENT health decisions with your mom. No surgery for now. I pray for her recovery.
Strength and honor.
FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
Regarding your last post of moving on. A wise friend told me the below when I was stuck in the "future".....worrying about if my ex would change her mind one day.
" I would like to win the lottery someday but I'm not going to live my life as if I am"
Quote: I have been rejected, totally and on purpose. I am totally to blame in her eyes. She is not respecting me, on purpose. She is cold, on purpose.
She must continue to feel this way and treat you badly in order to justify her actions. She can not accept responsibility for her unhappiness. It is so much easier to blame you.
Quote: Her attitude is clear: she wants me gone and she wants a new life. There is confusion b/c it is hard to just let-go cold-turkey but she is in no “crisis”. She is not an alien; she is a big girl and she knows full well what she is doing.
She wants a new life because she believes there is something better out there and she deserves it. If she gets into a new R, she will realize that things will be the same because she hasn't changed. I do not believe that she knows what she is doing. Within the last year, 3 women I know who have left their H have finally hit rock bottom, all who believed that they did the right thing because they believed there was something better out there. How long did it take each of them to realize their mistake? WAW #1 - 11 months (told her H she wants to try again) WAW #2 - 21 months (too proud to tell her H she made a mistake especially since she filed for D and it was final this summer. She told me she was very depressed this past Christmas as she realized what she had the M she always wanted) WAW #3 - 30 months (had her sis ask her H if he would try to work it out) None of their Hs want them back. None of them held onto hope for very long and 2 of the 3 are in another R.
Quote: There are no “baby steps”, just my misinterpretation of what I am seeing b/c I want to see otherwise.
I don't think you are necessarily misinterpreting the baby steps, it's just that when we start being hopeful and the WAS notices, it scares them because they do not want to feel conflicted and are SO SURE that they do not want to reconcile. So, I totally agree with what you said below:
Quote: Standing means unconditional support and unconditional love; ....... “Standing” does not mean “waiting and hoping”. I must give up all hope and I must move on. I am open to the possibility of reconciliation but I will not expect it to happen and I am not tied to this outcome.
I, too, must do the same with my H.
Quote: I will not beat myself up or allow her actions to tear me up inside. I am better than that.
I forgive myself and put her actions in the proper context. I will pray for further guidance. To me, that is what it means to place my life in God’s hands.
Amen.
You sound so much stronger. I am happy that your W finally went to see your Mom. Regardless whether your M will be saved or not, your W and Mom both need this time together right now.
Man..they really screwed me up with this software upgrade. Feel free to post some tips. FIB
Me 55; XW 47; 2 kids (S13, D11) Bomb 05/19/06 Original thread http://tinyurl.com/yg2ou2t Last anniversary 04/25/10, Divorced 5/12/10 Status: Loving father of 2 beautiful children;
