The fat lady is warming up....

[catfan]

Hey y'all mind if I jump in?

I read through this thread and it just struck a cord with me. You can catch my two threads here
my 1st thread
2nd thread

Sorry I realized I probably shouldn't have started the second one but at the time I was looking for advice about that specific topic.

On the subject of joint counseling remember you have to at least try every possible vehicle to reconciliation that you can. You won't know if it will work if you don't try. You must also believe it can work because if you don't then it won't. We haven't started joint counseling but she's finally agreed to it, now I got to get her there. But its at least a baby step and its movement forward one way or another.



PMA BABY PMA

[alamogirl]

Hey oldfool,

I'm doing ok. How are you? How was your Thanksgiving? I spent mine at my sis's house. I'm not sure what my H did for Thanksgiving. His parents invited him and his son over, but he said he wasn't sure if he was going. My H's stepson also invited them to have Thanksgiving with him and his biological dad. My H's son and stepson are half brothers...I know, it can get very confusing .

Hi catfan,

No problem with you jumping in. Nice to meet you. Good luck on your joint counseling session. Let us know how it goes.

Take care.
alamogirl

[OldFool]

Glad to hear you're surviving OK. My TG was OK as well. Quiet, but nice. Spent part of the afternoon with my parents and gave myself some time to think about things other than my M problems.

WAW left me a VM saying "Hi" and talked a bit about past TGs and hoped I was having a good day. Who knows what that all means...but it's the first time I've heard her voice (outside of one joint counseling session) for a month. Surprisingly, hearing it didn't make me sad. Right now, I pity her more than anything else.

There is a young woman in the "Walk Away Wife Syndrome" section with a thread titled "Confused, thinking of leaving....". She's about to bail on her marriage and is looking for advice. She didn't get much response, so I took several hours over the long weekend to craft a reply.

I'm not sure I can help her, but I thought someone needed to try. A female perspective would probably be better (or at least more appreciated by her), but I'm not the proper gender to offer that. I hope she gets help before doing anything drastic. For all of us here who are looking at things from the "other side", it is heartbreaking to see someone so near to crossing over.

Keep us posted on how you're doing. My prayers are with you.

[I_Wanna_Make_It_Work]

OF - Not updating your thread? Or nothing to report?

[OldFool]

Not much to report. The lawyers pass papers and documents between themselves every now and again as the D progresses toward negotiations. But no new news, per se.

WAW still in joint counseling "for closure". Had a meeting last week and have another one tomorrow night. Last week, she said she was sorry. First time I think I've ever heard it in a way that made me think she might have actually meant it. Prior times (the few there were) were more perfunctory.

I figure as long as she's in counseling of some kind, it's a good thing. It's true when they say love is blind. Now that it's been over two months since the separation, I can see my W more objectively and am amazed at the number of problems she has. However, many (most?) are from what is apparently a low self-esteem. I didn't even know/recognize this was an issue until now...not that I could have done anything about it (that kind of thing has to come from inside a person, not from someone else).

At any rate, I've stayed detached and dark, have continued to go along with the joint counseling, and have continued my own individual counseling. I've also continued to stay connected to this board and tried to help others (which has helped me refine my own perspective and thoughts).

I continue to be extremely pessimistic about the chances for any useful reconciliation (or at least one in any kind of time frame that would make a lick of difference to me). Still, I have left the door open if she can work through some fairly fundamental issues she has.

This weekend I had a small holiday party (six people) and it was very good GALing. It forced me to put up the Xmas lights, tree, and decorations. My heart wasn't in it, but after getting everything up, I have to admit I do feel more "in the spirit" than I expected. The evening was very nice, everyone had a good time, and the WAW came up in conversation just one time and I didn't give her a second thought for more than six hours. I didn't think that was too bad and it was a delightful respite from my sitch.

It's been interesting to see the response from my WAW about the party. I didn't tell her anything about it, but two of the guests were a couple we were friends with when together. As they were the only connection, they must have told her about it because she made a point of mentioning the party at our last joint counseling session (and twice later). I found this interesting because if she doesn't care about anything, why ask about it or mention it?

It was also interesting that the W of the couple (who was my WAW's best friend back in high school) didn't end up showing up and spent the night with my WAW instead...though her H still came. Was she bothered that I was having friends over on a Sat. night and she was doing nothing? Who knows.

One of the guests was also an old (and now divorced) female friend I knew back in high school. She has been very kind to me during this period of my life and I have enjoyed her company and her insight greatly. We aren't an "item" (as some of my friends have asked) but we're very comfortable with each other and are old enough and have gone through enough to just be ourselves and enjoy whatever we may be doing together.

Of course the H doesn't know all this (and I wasn't going to tell him) so all he saw was this unknown woman who was very friendly, pretty, and complimentary who just dropped in and made herself right at home. Before he even left, his W (who was or had just been with my WAW) called him and was apparently asking him about the party, who attended, etc.

I'm sure all of this went right back to my WAW sometime today so it will be interesting to see if the topic comes up in Monday's counseling session. I'd guess my WAW figured she leave the marriage and move on without me. But it appears I'm moving on without *her*! If the party bothered her already, the fact that it looks like another woman is checking out the goods is really gonna bite.

Of course, that's not the case (though I wouldn't rule it out forever and ever). But she's not going to get enough info. from the friend to know that. And that's fine with me. She's filed for divorce and wants closure. Part of that is the other party moving on to new people and she's going to have to come to terms with that. She has her OM, but funny how the shoe pinches when it's on the other foot.

As an aside, it's kind of nice to know who the mole is. I can use this to my advantage by controlling the flow of information back to my WAW (who, for someone who says she can't stand me and wants a divorce, is surprisingly interested in what I'm doing, who I'm seeing, and where I'm going). I can hold back certain information I do *not* want to get back to my WAW and make sure certain things are known that I *do* want to get back to my WAW.

Well, I guess there was more to report than I thought. Sorry for the length. Thanks for checking up on me. All things considered, I'm feeling pretty good.

[I_Wanna_Make_It_Work]

OF - Thanks for posting on my thread. Any updates on your sitch?

[OldFool]

Not really. WAW said she was sick and bailed on joint counseling last week. Now scheduled for this week...but we'll see if she shows up.

The only other thing is something I forgot to mention in my previous post. At the last session we had, I came in with a book I'd bought a couple weeks earlier titled "The Five Love Languages". My WAW had arrived before me and when I walked in, she and the counselor began laughing. In my next personal session (without the WAW), the counselor said my WAW had just told her she'd bought this book over the weekend called "The Five Love Languages" when I came in.

I don't know that I agree with every little part of it, but in general the book's content is good and the first couple of chapters about "real" love vs. "romantic" love and the fact that love is a choice...a rational decision...would do my WAW a world of good if she'll read them and really take them to heart. That, of course, remains to be seen. But I'm taking the fact that she found this book on her own and paid money to get it as a good sign.

[tigerleland]

Wow! That seems like a good sign. My wife said she thought we should divorce in our last MC session. What are your sessions like now that it is our there that your wife wants a D? Is it just for closure? I'm curious what our next session will be like (scheduled for Feb).

[OldFool]

Well, they're strange and, yes, my WAW is in it only for "closure" (at least that was her statement as to her intent after we'd had a couple sessions). You're not really working at fixing anything so it seems kind of pointless, but our counselor is trying to bring out issues she's seen in both of us to get the other one to see and understand.

I think her hope may be that in so doing...breaking down the walls, challenging incorrect understandings and assumptions, and giving each of us a different perspective...that at some point my WAW may decide that her decision was based, in part, on bad information and that perhaps she should reconsider (or at least slow down enough to investigate further before blowing it all apart).

Nothing may come of it, but I don't think it hurts me and, in a couple of cases, has helped (at least me...can't speak for the WAW).

Nevertheless, it is difficult to be patient when you feel like you're in limbo and the counseling sessions are difficult and painful.

[tigerleland]

Thanks. Are you seeing her at all outside of the MC?