Gosh, same thing here! I didnt think I had a problem either. I felt bad for blowing up at times, but I'm so much more sweet and patient now. In fact, a new co-worker told me this morning that I have a very sweet disposition. WTF?
I've been anti-meds too.. mostly because I'm not sure I understood that stress/problems, etc can make us depressed. Didnt understand the illness until my H had a major depressive episode. Then of course, I couldnt compare to the pit he was in. I don't recommend that people just go out and get meds to cope, but honestly, H, me, D12, and S6 are all taking ADs right now. H for D and OCD.. major improvement. D12 and S6 for the anxiety disorder they inherited from him. My kids don't act drugged.. very low doses, but the change in them is amazing too. They were also angry with the separation, scared, and not coping well. This isnt a long term solution for sure, but it was time to admit we needed some mental help with our family falling apart. That is a BIG deal.. yeah, divorces happen every day, but they still hurt.
I'm glad to see you sounding more positive today. I follow your sitch pretty closely...it's a lot like mine. I can DEFINITELY relate to how badly you need some physical reassurance. I felt like I was going to jump out of my skin on almost a daily basis.
Here's my current thread. The link to my original post is in my signature...it's not long at all.
Hi Aud, Just read your sitch. I'm sorry that you and your H are seperated, especially with 3 little ones.
I think the best thing to do is GAL. Do everything and anything to keep your mind off of your R (or lack of R), cause if you are like me I obsess about it 24/7. It doesn't really help the sitch and only causes me to become emotionally drained, angry and frustrated.
It also helps to stay positive for your kids sake, even though they are little they can pick up so much. Last year around this time when my H was heavily into OW I was very bitter and angry and cried ALOT when he didn't come home. My oldest D's grades suffered tremendously and my younger two became very insecure, especially the little one; he didn't even want me to leave him at preschool for fear that I wouldn't come back (like Daddy).
Hey mama...thanks for sharing the stuff from PM. It's one of the things I need to read but am so swamped with work and family stuff that when my W and I have some free time, we go off by ourselves and do something (which I figure is probably some of the best medicine).
Do that stuff! I want to hear about you being successful with it!
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. -- Inigo Montoya, 'The Princess Bride'
Thanks for checking in on me...I'm on the roller coaster of course, but I'm getting better at managing the highs and lows, and the GAL thing is progressing too.
It helps me a lot to read my exact feelings written by complete strangers...gives me a way to see things from other perspectives and helps me understand myself and this whole process much better. So though I haven't met you, I appreciate you!
D5 has become very weepy and insecure the last few weeks...is scared to go to her dance class, preschool, sunday school. I know it's because of the emotional ride we've been on for so long, and she's worried about her daddy.
I am determined that we will all be better off for all this...one way or another. No way am I leaving myself open to deal with it again! And I fully intend to come out of it a fabulous woman!
Mama, I wanted to answer a question you had on GH's thread, but wanted to do it here so I didn't hijack his.
Quote: I have really never been the initiator in our M except for maybe the first year. How do I express my desire for H without it looking like too little, too late or that I am being desparate and needy?
I am certainly no expert, and have typically fallen flat on my face when giving advice to women in particular, but here's something just to think about.
I think we tend to think in terms of how things have happened in the past too much, and think we know how our S will respond (just like they always have). But if we treat them differently than they've ever been treated, not even they know how they will feel about it or want to respond to it until it happens.
What I've found is that I'm way more likely to get what I want when I give it first without strings attached. What I realized I was doing wasn't creating a "you scratch my back, I'll scratch yours" situation so much as helping make our relationship just more loving in general.
So my take would be, if I want our relationship to be one in which we both do <insert action of your choice>, then I need to do it first with the assumption that one day she will be more comfortable and motivated.
It's never too little, too late if it comes from your heart, if it's motivated by goodness...and taking care of your spouse and your M is a good thing. Because when you do that, genuinely, it changes you for the better no matter what. And often it does end up affecting the people we want it to.
I think the way you keep from looking desperate and needy is to not be desperate or needy. My rule of thumb for a couple months now has been, if I'm doing this out of weakness (desperation, neediness, demanding something in return), then I'm not going to do it. However, if I can do it out of strength (aka, detachment), and understand that if someone rejects me when my motives are pure and clean and loving, then so be it. Yes, it hurts to be rebuffed, but that's why you have all the DB stuff.
It only becomes a bad thing if you're rebuffed and then take it hard in front of him, make a federal case out of it, etc.
So maybe instead of thinking of this in terms of making yourself available so that HE will do <insert what you want here>, you could think in terms of, "I'm going to go and do <insert whatever you know he would like> to/for H" and then see what happens. Maybe everything won't go the way you want it to this time, but maybe you're planting a seed that's going to grow and bear fruit later.
Sounds like initating would be a 180 on your part, and even though what you might want is for him to initite and be in control, maybe by being a little more aggressive than usual you will inspire him, so to speak.
I'm not saying go do it like this, so if it doesn't work out, please don't stick pins in my voodoo doll or anything ...I"m just saying that maybe it will help to look at it this way. If all else fails, remember the DB principle of experiment, see what works...no reason that can't apply in the bedroom as well.
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. -- Inigo Montoya, 'The Princess Bride'
I think a lot of my lack of initiating is based out of fear of rejection. In the back of my mind I keep thinking that OW is 10+ years younger than me and knowing my H he was probably really in love with her. That and the fact that he stayed out all night a lot in the beginning of the A makes me think they were "doing it" alot.
I do I compete with that? I fear that ML to me is stale and mechanical and H is doing it to appease me and can't wait to get it over with. It just hurts so much to feel that the man that I married, that was SO in love with me in the beginning has lost interest in me. It makes me feel so worthless.
I'm afraid that if I do the 180, dress the part, and try to seduce him that he will be thinking "WTH, why is she doing this now?" He won't see it as authentic but just a way to hang on to him.
I think a lot of my lack of initiating is based out of fear of rejection.
I understand this, really. Maybe it's easier for a guy because (most of us) are used to being rejected. When we were younger we inevitably asked people out, got turned down, etc. Now, that doesn't mean it's all that easy. Being rejected by your wife is devastating to a man, especially when she was giving it to someone else.
I just got tired of being afraid, tired of getting whipped by fear itself. That old "nothing to fear but fear itself" stuff is true. I figured if I was being genuine, not manipulative, and just putting it out there and getting rejected anyway, I did my best and that's all I could do. No matter how bad it hurts, I think we all have to get to that point...but in our own time. If you're not ready for that yet, well, that's only something you can know. Rushing things isn't necessarily good either. I think.
Quote: That and the fact that he stayed out all night a lot in the beginning of the A makes me think they were "doing it" alot.
No offense, but so what if they were? Why not just assume they were. I mean, at some point, we have to get to where we recognize they ran off and did it with someone else. It hurts, I know. Been there, am there. But to me whether they did it 1 time or 10 times or 1,000 times is irrelevant now. I think you're obsessing too much over the details and that's making you weak. God wants you strong because of who He is.
Quote: How do I compete with that?
You don't. This isn't a competition and never was, even though we feel competitive about it. If you want to keep score, you're going to always feel bad. However, he's home, he's with you.
Quote: I fear that ML to me is stale and mechanical and H is doing it to appease me and can't wait to get it over with.
Well, maybe the females can help you out more here. Of course you're not worthless, you just feel that way. You're letting your feelings dictate your attitude and behavior the same way he did when he cheated. It's still wrong even if you're doing it for the "right" reasons or think you're justified.
Quote: It just hurts so much to feel that the man that I married, that was SO in love with me in the beginning has lost interest in me. It makes me feel so worthless.
This is interesting because it just so happens that during the time my W and I have been rebuilding (since summer), our 14 year old got his first real "girlfriend" (or, as I like to call it, Fall Pukefest 2006). Now, they've already "broken up" twice, this latest time looks like for good, thank God. But I digress. I made a couple allusions early on (Sept) to my son and his GF while we were talking about the A. Not good DB'ing, I know, but I was weak, what can I say. One of the things that I think struck my wife, and which she won't comment on, was how eerily her and the OM's behavior parallels my the behavior of my son and his "girlfriend."
In fact, if you overlook the obvious differences (age, marital status, etc.) the maturity level of both couples is virtually identical in terms of their feelings, their behavior, their silliness. Now, I'm not saying there's no room for romance and a little silliness in a mature marriage, but very much of what we consider "being in love" is based on mutual weakness, on desperation, on being driven by feelings that aren't rational, and by chasing after illusions we project on other people. If that's what people want if they want to be "in love", then I don't want any part of that.
That stuff is fine when you're young. It's even fine in small doses when you're older and not breaking solemn commitments and vows, or destroying your character and someone else's to do it. But if a loving relationship isn't based on character, if feelings fill the space and make character, commitment, and responsibility irrelevant, then it isn't really a loving relationship. And our spouses who choose that at some point reveal a very deep and serious character flaw that they need to address, and very often addressing that gets in the way (and rightly so) of what our needs are during the reconciliation process. We have to find a constructive way to understand and deal with that, because while we need them to be loving and attentive, we also need them to become stronger in character, and that takes time.
Quote: I'm afraid that if I do the 180, dress the part, and try to seduce him that he will be thinking "WTH, why is she doing this now?" He won't see it as authentic but just a way to hang on to him.
Then don't dress the part. I'm not saying you have to make a big production out of it. There's few things that turns a healthy man on more than knowing his wife wants him sexually, that she has a healthy appetite too. It's a process, not an event...both the act itself and restoring this part of it to your marriage.
There's no such thing as magic...or, magic is what seems to happen after everyone's worked their butts off!
You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means. -- Inigo Montoya, 'The Princess Bride'
TL is right on Mama. We all know the hurt and fear of rejection. This situation pours bucketloads on us. But at some point we have to decide to step back out of the downpour and take control of anything in our power.
Quote: In the back of my mind I keep thinking that OW is 10+ years younger than me and knowing my H he was probably really in love with her.
I've been through these feelings a hundred times myself. One night when I was really struggling, my mom looked me in the eye and said, "Regardless of any of this, when it really comes down to it, YOU have much more power than OW. You are the mother of his children, the life-force of his home. She can never come close to that. He's not with her anymore, he's making efforts..."
She's right Mama. OW may be freakin' Angelina Jolie, but he's home with you. The sex may have been great (my H said it wasn't...I suspect he just didn't want to hurt my feelings more), but you can take charge and make it great for you and him.
Starting over is just that. A fresh start. If there were things about the past that you would like to change, now's the time. Sure, it's scary. But if you stay bound by fear, all you'll have is the same old relationship. And I know you're a strong girl. So find a way to reach out to him in your strength.
Quote: Regardless of any of this, when it really comes down to it, YOU have much more power than OW. You are the mother of his children, the life-force of his home. She can never come close to that. He's not with her anymore, he's making efforts..."
Needed to hear that, to repell the ghosts of the past that tug at me now and then
Be not afraid...I will repay you for the years the locusts have eaten Joel2
30something 2kids survivor of S, MLC, A, D I have peace in my heart, at last.
...I"m just saying that maybe it will help to look at it this way. If all else fails, remember the DB principle of experiment, see what works...no reason that can't apply in the bedroom as well.