I'm trying. I'm just so depressed w/the holidays coming up and no family around. And ADs are not working for me.
Question
Would it be pressuring if I asked W if we are going to do things together as a family, like having lunch or dinner, w/D5. A few months ago W enjoyed doing these things while we were separated. This time the second separation is so different. W is very cold, while during the first S we had fun times together. And it would be so good for D5.
It's kind of difficult to have fun if the few friends I have are w/their families. I still haven't figuered out what to do w/myself. In particular over Thanksgiving. And W will have the kids (and perhaps ??). And w/hardly any contact lately I can't let her see makings plans either. Sorry, not good PMA I guess.
Just called W b/c D5 had her first cavity and needed a filling. Thought she might want to know. I also had to schedule another appointment for another cavity for her. W was upset that I take care of this and wanted to be involved. I said ok, we can reschedule or you take her. W got more upset.
I asked her why she is so cold now. She said I was yelling at her too much (b/c of her continuing the A and flirting online w/someone else who lives here). And if she is nice I might ask questions that I don't want to hear the answer to. And then I would yell again. I believe she has second Om.
Perhaps I should let her file? I don't know anymore. And I don't know how to deal w/this pain. Seeing my C later, hope that helps.
I had a good session w/C last Friday. Went through some of the things I had done in our M to ruin it. I know, it is said a lot here on this BB that MLC is NOT caused by what LBS do.
There is still so much I have to learn. And now I have to do it the hard way. C agreed that a lot of my behavior would force most W into a WAW. So perhaps mine is just a WAW and is looking for her options left, no MLC. But then she is showing all these MLC signs. Very confusing for me right now.
Anyway, I just saw a post from Simon earlier this year and have a question about it: Hope for couples in crisis
Dobson states in this regarding giving the WAS freedom:
Slowly, unbelievably, the trapped spouse witnesses the cage door vibrate just a bit, and then start to rise. He can’t believe it. This person to whom he has felt bound hand and foot for years has now set him free! It isn’t necessary to fight off her advances — her grasping hands — any more.
“But there must be a catch,” he thinks. “It’s too good to be true. Talk is cheap. This is just another trick to win me back. In a week or two she’ll be crying on the phone again, begging me to come home. She’s really weak, you know, and she’ll crack under pressure.”
It is my strongest recommendation that you, the rejected person, prove your partner wrong in this expectation. Let him marvel at your self-control in coming weeks. Only the passage of time will convince him that you are serious — that he is actually free. He may even test you during this period by expressions of great hostility or insult, or by flirtation with others. But one thing is certain: He will be watching for signs of weakness or strength. The vestiges of respect hang in the balance.
So, I believe I was given this opportunity when WAW wanted to try again. But I have failed her tests (like flirting online, keeping contact w/Om...) miserably. And started arguing, yelling, pressuring again. Which was followed by 'I want you to move out again'.
Since I moved out the sitch started to get worse. She became colder and colder every day.
Is there any hope left? Has anybody recovered from ruining a second chance and was given a third?
Let em tell ya, as a DBer, I suck. so take this knowing that as a DBer, I suck.
I'm thinking even though it's getting colder, maybe this is just a progression through the process. I'd try to not focus on her any more than needed.
I know it's easier for me to type this than it is for you to do it, but try living like you're single. if you live by her reactions to things it's gunna drive you insane. try to do the mental "lalalalas" every time a thought of her comes into you mind.
Hi EM - I am sorry I have not posted in a while. I have been working some temp jobs and have been very busy lately.
Don't feel bad or guilty about meeting with and having fun with your friend the other day. I think it is great you were able to enjoy yourself, and it is obvious she had a good time being with you. That was a terrific validating experience. If there is anyone on these boards who deserves that it us you. If you were to develop an EA with AW I for one would not have any problems with that. However, I don't know if you need the complications of a PA at this point in time when you are going through a lot of turmoil. The fact that your W has someone else in her life plus her continued "off the wall behavior" leads me to believe that you no longer owe her anything in the way of personal fidelity, although I am sure you are still committed to your marriage as a point of honor as long as you are still married. Meanwhile, I am glad to hear that you and your W are moving closer relative to a financial settlement, and that she appears to be more reasonable along these lines. Take care.
I can only only say from my experience, and what I have observed.
I first received bomb # 1, “I feel numb”, “I just need some space”, “want to do my own thing” “Don’t love you as a wife should”. Then followed a year of Touch and Goes, her saying “she was trying to get that love back”. In that time, she said “everything was back to normal”.
This I now see as the denial stage.
A year later bomb # 2 – “ I want to separate”
This then started Replay with a vengence. This was when she would go out all the time, the constant spending on clothes and shoes, and the real coldness started. The communication turned to grunts, she could not share the same space (Cooties). And the hostility started.
What I realise now, is that whatever I would have said, done or changed, whilst she was in denial, would not have affected the outcome of this process.
I do not know if this helps, or where you think you are in this process, from a quick read of your thread, I think your wife was in the denial stage, with the touch and goes, therefore whatever you said or did would not have made a difference to the outcome.
Quote: So, I believe I was given this opportunity when WAW wanted to try again. But I have failed her tests (like flirting online, keeping contact w/Om...) miserably. And started arguing, yelling, pressuring again. Which was followed by 'I want you to move out again'.
This is not the stage to set boundries, it will just make them run faster and harder. And drive issues underground
Quote: I asked her why she is so cold now
I asked my wife why she could not speak to me like a human being – I was told “it is difficult”, WTF we have known each other 28 years!
I also approve the message by Ford
Quote: I'm thinking even though it's getting colder, maybe this is just a progression through the process.
It was told to me, and I have observed this on many threads, that the anger and hostility erupts as they pass from one stage into the next.
Quote: I'd try to not focus on her any more than needed
Absolutley, as Snodderly always says, let them twist in the wind.
Quote: try living like you're single. if you live by her reactions to things it's gunna drive you insane
We all over analyse our spouses reactions, and this only sucks us in, and exposes us to more hurt.
Quote: Is there any hope left? Has anybody recovered from ruining a second chance and was given a third?
There is always hope, but at this stage, let go and detatch.
