Impotence...about the OW

[ReDesigner]

I know, I know. I've seen some very generous and self-controlled people out there dealing with the OP who is trying to insinuate themselves into the family. javascript:void(0)
I just got the flash from my 14-year old daughter. She admits she's confused. The OW has been sending her gifts via her dad. She says she's so angry at the OW but likes the gifts. She says nobody else thinks to get her these "Goth" things. What makes her angry is her dad has told the OW so much about her that even the choice of gifts is accurate. She has never met the OW, but she worries that someday she'll have to meet her. What disturbs her is that if she reacts badly now and "hurts feelings" it will make things more difficult for her in future. She was angry that this OW doesn't even know her, has never met, but is giving her gifts. I suggested that this is attempting to "buy" her acceptance because if she can imagine - two people who have to try to get their kids to agree with what they're doing. (The OW has 4 kids, including two teenagers!) My D knows that her dad is doing this. She stunned me and her counsellor by saying - she realizes her D is trying to bribe her, but she says she also knows how bad he feels and how guilty he feels, so if buying things for her makes him feel "good" then, she's going to let him! That revelation really shocked me. That's when I realised that's what I'd done! I had put up with his infidelity twice before, always thinking that he was in pain and that I should try to do something to help him. I was hurt, devastated and all, but years of taking care of him and my D, must have twisted my sense of self-preservation. I just wasn't good at "teaching him how to treat me." That's why he's cheating again, except this time, he's throwing in the towel and we are awaiting the legalization of the separation documents. (Lawyers are taking forever!!)

I could only ask her what she wants to do about it. (Have been warned by the counsellor to not react and give her space to do it. javascript:void(0))
She just said - nothing. Poor kid is so torn. I'm so torn. I wanted to rant and rave and tell her to send it back. javascript:void(0)(The OW lives on the opposite coast to us and my H is flying out to see her next week! He was planning to go this weekend, but when my D found out, she flipped out, bawling him out for wanting to spend Halloween with someone else's family and not her!) I just pray that my D will have the courage and strength of character to tell both her dad and the OW what she really thinks of what they're doing by breaking up her family. She says she wishes she could get angry, but she can't. She is quite a thinker, her counsellor tells me and a very kind person. My D hasn't reached that very rebellious teenager stage yet. If she had, she might have more power to really give the unfaithful adults a slam.
Should I tell my daughter what I really think? Is she, by telling me about this and her confusion, asking for guidance?? I don't want to make things harder for her. She is in a fragile emotional state right now and her counsellor warned us - her parents that we need to talk to each other or she'll need to be medicated. I cannnot to him at all! I'm too angry and hurt.

[whatisis]

I'd say your job right now is to be the best listener you can be. Help your D sort through her feelings and the options that are available to her in this situation. You don't need to tell her what you think, that will influence her decision and probably end up biting you in the butt somehow!You know what you'll hear "You put her up to this, didn't you". Use empathy and help her sort through her feelings and options. Support her in whatever way she chooses to go. I know you'd love for her to tell H what an a@@hole he is being, but this is about her not you. Such a tough situation, isn't it. You see your child suffering and know why but feel pretty helpless in doing anything about it. It makes us parents nuts! Maybe by just being there for her, that will be the best you can do. My W's OP also sends little gifts home for my kids and a part of me would like to tell my W to take those gifts and stuff them up OP's butt! But, why would I do that? I believe in picking my battles and this isn't the one I want to fight right now. Let the OP try to win my kids acceptance, really, who cares cuz I'm Dad and always will be! I hope you're able to help your D through this painful period and I know it brings up alot of your own pain. Be strong,and keep being the good mom you seem to be!

[ReDesigner]

Thank you. You're right being silent is the hardest. I would really love to say and do a lot of things to this interfering OW. She's got four kids who could be as difficult for my H, so I figure he's got his work cut out for him, since their dad just hit the road a few months ago. I know he's doing the same. As I read on a post from a man who is a reformed cheater... I have to remember that my H and the OW have exactly the same issues. That's probably what drew them together in the first place.
Meanwhile, I will try to take your suggestion to talk a lot to her and ask her questions to help her clarify her feelings. I have to have some faith that she's a lot smarter than both those people who are "acting out." Thank you for your strength. I'm sure you're being the kind of dad your children need, if you can dispense balanced advice like you do.
How do you keep your anger at bay when the OM does things to intrude?

[whatisis]

Well, firstly, my W is in an A with another woman. This woman is seen by the kids as Mom's friend, they have no idea she's more than that. By making a big issue out of it I would be exposing the situation to the kids. They know mom and dad aren't getting along, but not the other part. So best to just let it go. As I said before, I choose to pick my own battles and this one isn't one I see as priority. How do I hold in my anger? I tell myself that this is a pathetic attempt to be a part of my kids lives. OW is no part of their lives, she never sees them so, in a way, it's utterly ridiculous for her to be sending little gifts home to them. I guess, I just keep in mind how sad and pathetic this person is. Let's face it, anyone who gets into an A with a married woman with two young children and a H who still loves his W, has to be a pretty sad case. I suppose it's meant to show my W how much she cares about our children. It's all part of the fantasy world my W is living in. Let her figure it out. So, I feel the anger and just move on. I don't let it control me. Best answer I can give you on that one.

[ReDesigner]

Oh, I'm so sorry to hear. You are exhibiting the most incredible self-control! It's funny, but after I posted, I got to thinking of a different way to re-frame the OW's feeble attempts to bribe my daughter. I guess it must be a really insecure person who resorts to buying their way into someone's acceptance. I had actually come around to thinking about it just the way you described. I'm not sure whether I'm going to generally comment on this to my D. She's got incredible radar for my ulterior motives! What I hope is that working with her counsellor, my D will see these cheap attempts to gain acceptance for what they are - pathetic bribery. I don't see any pure motives or altruism here. I just detest the way she's attempting to mess with my D's head.

Still, when I feel the anger, it lasts too long for my liking. I was thinking the most vicious, brutal and vengeful thoughts yesterday about what I'd do with that stupid woman's gifts and what I'd tell my H. I wonder if it gets any less intense after time passes? You sound like you have it under control. How long have you been able to do this? How long has your sitch been going on? For me, it's all too new and thank goodness as I read what others go through, I see a pathway and I start to see a roadmap of what I might expect. I'm trying my best to distance, but I do get thrown off guard once in a while. Thanks for your input!

[whatisis]

Well, last night OW sent Halloween candy home for the kids! She never misses a trick (or treat)
I have been in this sitch for a long while. Three years ago I heard "I don't know how I feel about you or the kids anymore", Two years ago I heard "I am not in love with you anymore" and 9 months ago I heard "I've started a new R". After "I don't love you anymore" I found DB and it was such a relief. There were all sorts of books telling you how to divorce nicely or get over divorce but nothing for people who wanted to save their M despite their S's betrayal. I started with GAL and that was a lifesaver. I won't list all the things I have changed in my life but I am a much fuller, better person for the efforts I have put in. After A was announced it became even tougher! But, one thing that is important to realize is that the OP is not the problem (they sure have problems, though!). Our M's collapsed because there were things missing and our S's went elsewhere. I try to key on working on those things versus obsessing over that poor, sad OW who sees this kind of pathetic betrayal as her only route to happiness. Wow, how sad is that. The OP is just a fantasy set up by two unhappy people and who will one day discover that this is nothing more than that. The real world will catch up with them. I hope I'm able to hang in there until it does! I hope this helps you.

[whatisis]

Well, last night OW sent Halloween candy home for the kids! She never misses a trick (or treat)
I have been in this sitch for a long while. Three years ago I heard "I don't know how I feel about you or the kids anymore", Two years ago I heard "I am not in love with you anymore" and 9 months ago I heard "I've started a new R". After "I don't love you anymore" I found DB and it was such a relief. There were all sorts of books telling you how to divorce nicely or get over divorce but nothing for people who wanted to save their M despite their S's betrayal. I started with GAL and that was a lifesaver. I won't list all the things I have changed in my life but I am a much fuller, better person for the efforts I have put in. After A was announced it became even tougher! But, one thing that is important to realize is that the OP is not the problem (they sure have problems, though!). Our M's collapsed because there were things missing and our S's went elsewhere. I try to key on working on those things versus obsessing over that poor, sad OW who sees this kind of pathetic betrayal as her only route to happiness. Wow, how sad is that. The OP is just a fantasy set up by two unhappy people and who will one day discover that this is nothing more than that. The real world will catch up with them. I hope I'm able to hang in there until it does! I hope this helps you.

[ReDesigner]

Yes, I guess the "witch" would try to do something like that... pander to the Halloween thing. It's pretty low and pathetic, to be sure. But I'm sure it is still annoying to have that intrusion.
I've been thinking a lot about what you've been saying on how to view the whole situation. You certainly have had a lot of time to do it, however, I don't think it gets that much easier. Thank goodness there are people on this board who can continue to remind me that it's "the cheaters'" issues and not mine. I do just feel so helpless sometimes, probably because I feel my family is under attack. Right now I feel I have to rant and rave and fantasize about what I'd say to that interfering OP who's trying to mess with my D's head. However, it does satisfy me to know that H has "four" kids to try to win - and that just makes me laugh at their whole situation at how ridiculous it is. The most pathetic part is that neither of them has any clue they're embarking on a useless exercise. I guess I won't have so much to worry about because kids have their own agendas, too. They might use the adults to get "stuff" but in the end, they're hearts are with their natural parents.
I'm not trying to "compete" but the reason I say it doesn't get any easier is that H has done this before, just not so much in the way the "addiction" is intensifying now. I've been dealing with his MLC for about 8 years now when he first had a couple of EA within months of each other. This time it's full-blown... with lots of kids and legal separation dragged into the mix. I hope this time it's possible for me to really GAL and determine whether it's worth my life to continue to DB. Have you set yourself any deadlines as to when "enough's enough?"

[whatisis]

That's the milliion dollar question, isn't it. When is enough enough! I can't advise you re where to draw the line when your S has had a number of these A's. It takes great courage to hang in there as you are. For me, the kids are an important issue. Do I tear their world apart, traumatize them because I've been betrayed? It keeps me going at times when I'm ready to throw in the towel. I go through those periods where I think I've had enough and then something pulls me out of it. I guess when I can't pull myself out of it anymore, that is the time to call it quits. We each have our own limit and nobody else can say yours is right or wrong.