Quote: My point was, these instances are going to occur. There is no avoiding them. Ive thought long and hard about it, and the aspects that make a man attractive initially are the same ones that will instigate this sort of thing.
Quote: There are times when the man just has to get over himself and emote feeling with his W, and being 'a man'
What if he busy dealing with his issues and doesnt have the resources for her problems too? Effectively what you are saying is ... I need you- get over yourself- and be here for me. I understand.
No, I am not saying that, not saying that at all. What I am talking about, however, does not take an all-day, deep, philosophical conversation, it does not require you giving up your needs in order to meet mine kind of thing.
It requires sensitivity and awareness on the man's part, the same as it does on a woman's part. I don't think that means a woman should become more like a man, or that a man should become more like a woman when showing empathy and compassion for the other... my point is.... ANYONE can show empathy and compassion for another being REGARDLESS of what is going on in their life. I think where it becomes difficult for people is when the person who wants/needs the comforting is seen by the OP as the source of their own pain.
Like I said, when things are happy and balanced, this is not difficult for people to do for one another. It is when the R is out of balance, tension and pain are in the air, and the woman (or man) is asking for something the other is just not able or willing to give.... basic lack of empathy and compassion... that starts pounding the final nails into the coffin. I think this occurs because somewhere along the way, the man and the woman have lost basic respect for their fellow being.
I know that is what happened with xH and I... I can certainly see it in UD's case, but I think her case is clearly different than most of ours... I can see it in your sitch, too.
I think it is far more... 'normal' and natural for a woman to show empathy and compassion. What is NOT normal for her is to lose this impulse. When that happens, you've got a devcon 5 alert, kwis?
OTOH, just because it isn't as natural for a man to show empathy and compassion, especially when he is dealing with his own stuff... does not mean he cannot dredge it from his being... IF he is operating with awareness. As many LD ladies on this board have learned... there are times when you just have to do what does not feel normal or natural for the sake of the R. Otherwise, I think what you are saying is a form of... "I don't feel like having sex and you do. Not my problem... deal with it."
It may not be your best effort, you can only do what you can do.... I can understand for a man how uncomfortable and difficult this can be, and in order to avoid, how further into his work he can bury himself, how more emotionally distant and absent he will become... how pissed at his wife he can get because she needs/wants something from him he just doesn't feel comfortable in giving...
But too bad. Sometimes 'alpha' and attraction, and R dynamics HAVE to go out the flippin window in order to maintain our basic regard for one another as fellow beings... to have a basic understanding that this 'whatever issue' is not about ME, and it is not about YOU, or winning, or giving in... it isn't about 'fixing' someone else's problem, or conceding your own in favor of someone else's... it is a basic recognition that another is in crisis, and that you can recognize and empathize with their pain, for you feel it, too.
I think when we lose that for one another, the R is GONE. When you lose the impulse to extend to your spouse the same basic regard you would immediately offer a stranger or one less fortunate than yourself (in the midst of all your same exact problems and issues)... you ARE better off chucking the whole thing. For at that point, basic respect is gone.
I'm sorry, I do not see that as a 'get of jail free' card for the alpha. It what separates boys from men and girls from women. It is a 'get the heck over myself, it isn't about ME' moment in the context of an R.
As an example. I think NOP came to this understanding with Mrs. NOP, and I'd consider him every bit as alpha as any alpha can be. There were things Mrs. NOP has been asking of him for YEARS, and she finally just gave up asking.
In his pursuit to get things back on track, he was able to recognize it. He saw things that were important to HER that may not be important to him... and he saw how disregarding those needs did as much damage to the R as anything he had accused her of. I am sure that that recognition on his part was every bit as painful for him as any recognition that Mrs. NOP had. But in recognizing it, and fixing it, it did not mean he became any less alpha, or became any less of a man, or that he put aside his own pain for hers. He simply restored his respect and acknowledgement for a fellow being... who happened to be his wife, btw. I hope they show up here and will perhaps discuss it a bit further, because I am not sure I am communicating what I mean as clearly as I can.
When you say that my xH was so alpha he made you look like the Taco Bell dog... honey... that is NOT alpha. That is narcassitc. That is an alpha gone bad. Any alpha worth his salt, in my mind, has a basic regard and respect for life, and his fellow beings. He won't be walked on, but he seeks first to do no harm. That, to me, is the integrity of the alpha.
And that does mean, sometimes, that in the midst of your own pain and confusion, you can also recognize and acknowledge the pain and confusion of another.
