Quote: Mama, if I had to encapsulate everything I read in your post (from his POV) it would be that everything continues to be about you and about how you feel. Frankly, I'd like to see you do more loving discussions than blind accusations that you retract a few moments later.
If you want lasting change, Mama, you're going to have to pony up and do the job first. I mean it. You can't go back to the old ways of doing things--he's already learned that he doesn't want that. That's why he's arguing with you more. So what are YOU going to do to change?
This is the vicious cycle I have been in for a long time now. The problem is; I DO NOT know what to do to chage, hence the reason I am here in Piecing asking for help.
Mama--I like Amy's concept. And I also think it's spot on.
Start with the big things. The fact that your H said something about you sounding like his Mommy might be a good place to start.
What are the behaviors *you* think that give him the perception that he's a little boy and you have the control? List 3-5 of them. Then under each negative behavior, write down what you feel you need to do to change.
Mama, I kept a journal of these things--a spiral bound notebook to force myself to stay committed to the cause. I also logged the reactions I got to my changes. It's what held me accountable to the promises I made to myself.
If you want to do it here too, that's great. Then people who post to you can point out how the results work for or against you.
Hope you have a fabulous Friday.
Betsey
"There are only 2 ways to live your life. One is as though nothing is a miracle. The other is as though everything is a miracle."
Betsey, thank you for giving me something to work on.
Quote: What are the behaviors *you* think that give him the perception that he's a little boy and you have the control?
This is going to really be hard. "Mothering" is something that I have learned from my own mother. While it works for her and my Dad, it definitely doesn't work for me and my H.
This is going to be easier said than done I'm afraid. I might have to use the cognitive approach and repeat it over and over in my head "I am not H's mother, he is my equal."
He works many hours and gets up around 3:30 a.m. for work so one of the things I do for him is make his lunch the night before. Is this too motherly or am I being a caring wife?
I know that I shouldn't question him on his whereabouts but in light of the sitch it is because I don't trust him.
Uggh.....I am going to really have to do some deep thinking on this one. Any other ideas always welcome.
Come on, dig deeper. Do you tell him what to do when he;s doing something not exatly the way you'd do it? Do you make most of the decisions in the house? Do you let him take care of something without "helpful hings"? even if you are uneasy of how it will turn out? I used to fret so much when H stayed w/d3, was anxious to know if he fed her, clothed her right, if he took her out enough, would call him to tell him what to do as if he had no brain. I now bite the bullet and I know even if she goes out w/ mistmach socks and eats McD that day she'll live and will be ok.
Be not afraid...I will repay you for the years the locusts have eaten Joel2
30something 2kids survivor of S, MLC, A, D I have peace in my heart, at last.
Quote: I know that I shouldn't question him on his whereabouts but in light of the sitch it is because I don't trust him.
1) Why shouldn't you ask him where he has been? He betrayed you, trust takes time to rebuild, it is perfectly reasonable to want to know where he has been. H is committed to rebuilding your M, which means rebuilding trust. I suggest you reread the chapter on infidelity in DR.
2) I expect it isn't that you ask where he has been, but HOW you ask that counts as mothering. You tend to try to catch him in the act, you quiz him, interrogate him. (Then, even more annoying--sorry, it is true -- after you get the info you were after you backpeddle and act like you didn't even care or need to know...) Anyway, try to treat him like an adult. This means that YOU need to act like an adult and do the hard stuff, like genuine communication. Trust me, I know it is much easier to catch and quiz than to engage in adult interaction. Adult interaction would look something like this: "H, I saw the cell phone bill. I feel betrayed and stupid because I found that you are still talking to OW. I would like you to tell me about the calls and I would like to know your intentions with respect to future communication with OW." Then, give him a chance to talk.
Direct communication = direct reports about yourself and direct questions to him
And, you need to figure out your boundaries and communicate them. Right now, you are talking out both sides of your mouth -- on the one hand you tell him it is fine if he talks to OW, on the other hand I'm sure that you are also letting him know that there will be hell to pay if you "catch" him again.
You are afraid to set a boundary, as a result, you are sabotaging your M.
There is NOTHING unreasonable about wanting to know where he is and wanting him not to communicate with OW.
P.S. The laundry and lunch COULD be mothering, depending on how you do it. Do you make his lunch because he is not "allowed" to eat out? Do you do his laundry because he is can't do it "right"?
P.P.S. Sorry, this may hurt. You are being very dismissive of H's feelings with respect to the checks from his parents. The whole scenario you described turns my stomach (truly). It is emasculating for him with respect to your actions and his actions. Rather like someone giving you money for a gift for one of your children because the child can't handle the cash. And, to pour salt in the wound, when he communicates this to you, you dismiss it like he is a small child having a temper tantrum who doesn't understand the real world.
But, this is not the case. There is nothing childish or stupid about wanting to be independent from one's parents. There is nothing childish about wanting the respect of one's wife when it comes to family matters. It is very inappropriate for you to accept cash gifts from his parents to simply live on when it hasn't been agreed upon as a couple. I strongly suggest that you refuse any future checks. His parents can write the checks to him, and he can decide whether or not to accept them. Hopefully, the two of you would discuss it, but your priority should be supporting your husband and respecting his need for independence. So, unless you are going to be out on the street, I really think it is time to stop getting the money from his parents.
This is a good place to work with H on setting a boundary with his Ps. Perhaps -- Except for birthday/Xmas gifts, we will not accept money for basic support except in extreme emergencies which we will define and let his parents know about to see if they are in a position to help.
I actually think it would mean ALOT to H for you to suggest working together on the family boundary here and communicating it to his Ps. You also might want to consider sincerely apologizing for accepting the last check from his parents and ask him whether or not HE thinks that you as a couple should return/repay it.
Give up cable, get a dial up internet connection, buy all your clothes on eBay, whatever. Work in the evenings on www.clicknwork.com. But, quit helping his parents repeatedly castrate their son by being in cahoots with the demeaning practice in which they have been engaged.
Whoa! I have been doing my errands, listening to Evanescense and feeling really bad about my childish, selfish, self-centered behaviour only to come back to this.
As always OT, you have hit the nail on the head. Everything you wrote to me is the gosh darn truth. How can I be SO stupid? Through no one's fault but our own we are buried in debt. I have cancelled cable, switched car insurance from full coverage to liablility, garbage pickup from 2 days to 1 and have started working a part-time job. Yet this money REALLY helped get us caught up. I am in no position to give it back but I will tell my husband that it was wrong of me to accept it. Reading what you wrote made be cry for all the hurtful things I have done to contribute to the demise of my M.
As far as the lunch, I think I do make his lunch so he doesn't go out and spend money that we don't have. Looking at it now I realize how wrong that is, not to mention controlling. I do the laundry, cause I do everyone's laundry - no control issues there (I don't think).
You must be reading my thread thinking this girl is an idiot and doesn't deserve her H and M.
I am a martyr, the poor-me victim, the I am right/you are wrong, selfish bitch. Right now I have to say I really can't blame my H. I really think therapy might be my only hope. I need to change and I don't know if I have the ability to do it on my own.
Betsey 