Moving Forward

[MonicaP]

Hi Stilltrying,

I hope your Thanksgiving is a happy one too.

My H informed me today that he will be out of town for Thanksgiving and in his email said something to the effect of "..I'll be out of town for Thanksgiving but I'm sure you don't want to know where I will be so I'll spare you that, but I won't be spending any money as I have none"...yada, yada, yada! My guess is that he is either going to her hometown out of state, or back down south like last year when he basically lied about where he was going and ended up in a motel spending what little money we had with Ow!! Well, no matter where he's going the bottomline is that he is choosing her over his S4. He could have had some quality (extra) time w/ S4 over the holiday weekend, but NO! Well, I wrote him back a response to his long-winded Thanskgiving email and said "I won't be in town for Thanksgiving...would have been enough information". He wrote back that he wasn't trying to be confrontational. WHATEVER!

Yes, it drives me crazy that H can come and go as he pleases, never has to wake up for middle of the night "mommy duty", rarely has to deal with S4's tantrums (although he has pulled a few w/ H recently which I'm glad about - he needs to see how hard S4 can be and how much he acts out).

I am exhausted.

Ciao ~

[MonicaP]

H called to say he is "stuck" wherever he is due to overbooked flight and won't be here tomorrow to visit S4. So, not only did he NOT see S4 for Thanksgiving - he is now lying to get out of the 1 day they might of had together to stay w/ Ow. I don't believe him for a second about being stuck, in fact, I told him I predicted he would be calling to say that. I absolutely expected it because that's what he's been doing for the last year. I told him "you either have the worst luck or you better come up with some better excuses." I also told him I predicted he would be using that excuse. He just responded with "whatever" and "to hell with you". Nice WTF! What does he expect. He is the boy who cried wolf and I'm sick of it. I also mentioned that he should be giving me (S4) the money he spent on his airline ticket and his response was that he didn't pay for it. He asked if I wanted to know who paid for it and I said no. I don't want to hear any of his drama!

Meanwhile S4 has been great through this 4-day weekend until tonight after hearing daddy won't be here. He acted out at bedtime a lot. It makes me so angry toward H for putting S4 through this - my son doesn't deserve this! And either do I.

H called yesterday night to say hi to S4. I always just hold the phone to S4's ear and then say goodbye when they're done. What struck me this time was a slightly "softer" tone in H's voice and a slight hesitation about hanging up. When he said "bye" he said it in his "old" (when we were together) voice. It stuck with me up until tonight when he called to bail out.

I wonder if he ever thinks about US, our FAMILY, the way things used to be.

Well, my Thanksgiving was very nice. S4 and I went up North to be with family. We got our Christmas tree next day and I've started to get into the holiday spirit. I pray I don't feel too depressed this year. Last year was a blurr.

See ya...

[S.T. _I Made It!]

Glad to see you got your tree already! I'm sure your s4 will be pleased with that.

I'm really sorry to hear about your H's excuses again.

Maybe instead of "expecting" his excuses, meaning, telling him you expected that and so forth, you should say, "awe, s4 was so looking forward to seeing you. why don't you tell him when you will see him next time." Or, "well that's too bad for you, guess we will just have the fun without you".

I need to finish this later.... like tomorrow...

[S.T. _I Made It!]

Partly why I say you need to not let him know your expecting his behavior is because it will be easier for him to continue this behavior if he knows you expect it.

I'm not a psychology major or anything by all means, but I do know that if you expect better from people, you will get "better", most of the time, and if you expect worse, then they will give you "worse". That is, if you give them actions or words that shows them your expecting these things from them.

Of course, your H is in another relm right now, so who knows what he will do, but still.

Maybe try to get some other male figures in your s4's life, because one, your son needs this anyways, and two, if your H knows he's spending more time with certain male relatives, or friends, maybe he will want to try to spend more time, or maybe he will realize he's "loosing" his son. Which in a way, he is.

Another thing that might be hurting you, is when you talk to your H about s4, are those mostly about how he acts out, or that he's a lot of work, and so on? I know that when you say these things you trying to get your H to see how much work you have to put into taking care of s4 and that your H isn't doing squat to help. However, this will also put a damper on how your H feels about s4 and if he's just hearing about the times he acts out, then it might make H feel more apprehensive about watching him, or make him feel like he's "babysitting" instead of being a father. I used to do this in the past, so I started trying not to talk about the bad stuff, and instead,I would talk about the good stuff that my H was missing out on.

What you really need to do right now is to try not to focus on all the times your H is going to "bail-out", but focus on your own R with your s4, and getting him involved with other respectable men, so that your s4 can see what a man should really be like. Cause right now, your H is NOT being a man. An whenever you talk to your husband about your s4 act excited about him and talk about all the things he's doing that H isn't getting to see. Make him sad that he isn't being a part of his sons life.

okay, gotta go again! good luck

[MonicaP]

Hi Stilltryin..IMI..

Thank you for your posts and for your insights.

I totally agree with what you said about having high vs low expectations of H. I think my H - in some way - wants me to have low expectations so he can feel off the hook. But I don't want to let him off the hook. I've thought of suggesting he only come on Sundays thinking that would be easier on him to show up, but then I say to myself - no way! He needs to be held accountable as a father. For me there's a balance. When he cancels at the last minute I get so angry, but I just try to keep my comments simple and to the point. This time I asked him to call S4 and explain and then tell him when he was going to visit next. Unfortunately, that next time was supposed to be tonight and instead I got an email at 1:30pm saying he was sick. My S4 was very disappointed and acted out a lot in the evening. It just gets so tiring being a yo-yo.

I am almost always very positive about S4 to H. I tell him about all the great things he does, the friends he has, and generally keep the "negative" stuff to myself. I mght tell him that S4 cries and misses him, but not very often.

Well, I am so tired. Lately I feel I never get enough sleep.

Btw, where is your thread?

[S.T. _I Made It!]

I have a couple threads actually. I would always end up getting discouraged that no one kept replying to mine that I would start a new one. Apparently I didn't hold peoples attention like you have! see below for all the threads, they're only like 1-3 pages long.



That's good that you never talk to your H about the negative stuff. I guess I would just say that maybe he's just afraid as failing as a father so it's just easier to not be one. I really don't know. It is so very sad. for both of them. There will be a day when your H looks back and dreads what he has done during this time. Beleive me, it will happen. Hopefully sooner than later.

I want to share a really good book from Dr. James Dobson. he is a christian author, and did use christianity in some parts of his book. I tell you this, so you'll understand his background. Anyways, I believe it's called Bringing up Boys. My brother in law gave it to me a year or two ago, and it is really really good. He mentions single moms a lot in the book because he's really concerned for their children. Our society of boys are so messed up now because of the tremendous D rate in these last 20 so years and it is because they don't have any one to teach them how to be a man. Yes, it is very important for us to mother them, and we can do some work in teaching them the basics of adulthood, but really, they need to learn from men, how it is to be one, and a good one at that.

So he talks about finding anyone (of course someone you trust) that can be a male role model for your child, and it doesn't matter how old or young, they will always be in need of this.

I'll give you an example from my life.
My oldest is 8 now, and his dad lived in another state (my H) for the first 5 years of his life. We also have a 2nd child who is 2 1/2 now, another boy.

I can really tell in my oldest that he was missing a male figure in his life. Sure, he saw his dad, we had been together the whole time, but he only came up every other weekend. So basically, he was like an out of town uncle. My s8 lived with me, my mom, and my sister. Can you imagine what his temperment would be!?!

Well, it's hard to explain, but I can just tell now that the lack of a male figure has really had an affect on him. I really hope that now my H is really back with us, that he will really get involved in s8 life, as well as our s2.


In regards to your H just bein an excuse box, I just don't know what to say except for what the DR book says about using action, and trying different things to see what will work.

Have you ever thought about just bringing s4 over to H whenever he makes up an excuse? That would be an action. I'm not very good at being creative. I would want to tell him "if you need to cancel, you will have to tell s4 yourself, because I will no longer be the bearer of bad news to him. So if you want to disspoint him, you will need to do that yourself."

Maybe you could come up with some penalty for him cancelling plans? I would also want to tell him, that it is not acceptable anymore for him to cancel plans with s4 unless it is days before. Of course, you've probably already done this and it's not working.

I wonder what would happen if YOU cancelled the plans on him. Maybe even do it a few times in a row. I'm really back and forth on this, because I agree with you that there needs to be a balance, but what kind of father is he being now anyways? All he does is give dissappointment to his son. Your s4 is going to learn that he cannot trust people, and that disspointment is a part of life, and there is no use in trying, it will also build a wall for him because he will be getting hurt so many times that he will need to put up a wall from his emotions so that he won't be dissapointed anymore.

Ugh. I need to quit being so negative don't I!



first thread

2nd thread

most recent thread

[S.T. _I Made It!]

Hey, just checking to see if you started a new thread or not. hope to hear from you soon.

[MonicaP]

Hi Stilltryin...IMI,

I haven't posted for a while for a few reasons - friend staying with me, too tired, etc.

Thank you for the info on that book - I think I've seen it in the library - I'll check it out. The male role models my S4 sees, other than H, is my step-dad, brother, uncle, male cousins, and some of my friend's H's. He doesn't really have a lot of time with any one of them, but combined I think he has a pretty good picture. A couple of weeks ago my friends' H took my S4 and their two S's on a hike - I was really happy about that.

I asked H last week if he'd like to go to one visit during the week and Sundays since he hasn't really been keeping up with the 2nd weekly visit, and he agreed. SOB. But, I just couldn't take the constant last minute excused and disappointment. I'd rather not go through that or have S4 go through that! But I did tell H that I don't want it that way - I want him to show up more frequently and consistently - but he's just not doing it. He claims he just can't afford the gas money. Ha!

This morning we got into a conversation that I wish I hadn't. I think it started because he asked if he could take S4 on some work assignment later in the evening and I said no. I told him that I have no way of knowing that he won't just leave S4 w/ Ow while he's doing some odd-job to make $60 which he says he'll give to me. I told him I'd rather he spend the time with his S! H got angry and belligerant and actually called me a loser. What a jerk! I told him I didn't deserve that and he should apologize. I wanted to say - Look in the mirror buddy!

Anyway, I just couldn't walk out the door without trying to resolve it, so I missed meeting my friends and talked to him. Once again I told him that I believe that - with help - our marriage could be saved. Once again he told me "we're not compatible." He still wants to blame me and our R for his woes. I told him I hoped he could some day remember the good times and he said he does remember them - but "things changed". He blames my parents for not caring about him enough (long story as to why he feels this way - but they did and do care about him). I told him he's looking to this Ow "to fix him" and to fullfill all his unmet needs. I'm sure I just pushed him closer to her.

The bottomline is, he's not coming back. I hope you're right about someday he might look back and regret all of this - but it will be too late.

So, where do I go from here? Where do I post on this board now? We're not divorced, but there really is no hope left.

So how are you?

I'll check out your thread soon.

[S.T. _I Made It!]

I'm really sorry to hear you feel the hope is gone. I really believe that until they marry someone else, it's not, but you have to decide for yourself if you want to wait long enough to find out.

I am glad to hear that your s4 has lots of male role models and that was awesome that he got to go on a hike with one of them!

It's too bad that your H is still using excuses for not seeing his s4, and calling you a loser didn't even make sense. He was just trying to make you feel bad so it wouldn't be about him.

It really wasn't a good idea to bring up that the M could work if he tried and to remember the good times. It's not exactly the DB thing to do, but I know it's hard sometimes when your in the middle of heated conversations. There were so many times I just wanted to scream at my H to try and get the message accross that he was missing so extremely bad, but it would have never worked. nothing I would have said would have worked. They have to figure it out on their own. Some will be slower than others.

I was just telling Nikkib on another post that I had asked my H about his feelings during his A. He had told me that he never really loved me, and it was love as a friend. Well he agreed with me that he believed that at that time, but he was in another frame of mind then or something, and that he did really love me back then, and agreed that our love for each other is better now than it was before.

My H never moved in with the OW, and she was in another state, so it was a distant R for them, and it lasted 6 months. So, my H came around within 4 months of me DBing, but he wasn't as far "gone" as yours is right now.

I think what you need to do, is maybe decide now, or set a future date for next year (since it's coming up) that you will decide to stop trying to make your M work.

But, in my opinion, just because you make that decision, doesn't mean your really stopping. You can continue becoming a better person, and GALing, and move on with your life. And possibly your H will slowly start coming around. Maybe at that time, you might have found someone else, but then again, maybe you haven't and you will have that oportunity to try it again. In a way, once you have DB'd, you will always use a lot of those principles in your life, or at least we all should.

Now in regards to the D. I don't know what that would do for you financially. You want to make sure you are taken care of. But I would let him make the D choice, unless you and your s4 would be better off financially filing for D yourself. I don't know how the tax thing would work, and then the child support thing too.

I really hope things turn around for you.

Whatever happens, let this experience make you a better person. learn from the experience that you are going thru. Don't let it bring you down. Overcome it and lean on God for strength.

Still praying for you,
Crissy

[princess_nic]

Monica,

I'm so sorry that your H is treating you and your S so badly.

I think you did the right thing re. taking him on the job. What's a 4 y/o going to do while his dad works? That's just ridiculous.

compatible." He still wants to blame me and our R for his woes. I told him I hoped he could some day remember the good times and he said he does remember them - but "things changed". He blames my parents for not caring about him enough (long story as to why he feels this way - but they did and do care about him). I told him he's looking to this Ow "to fix him" and to fullfill all his unmet needs. I'm sure I just pushed him closer to her.

The bottomline is, he's not coming back.

Monica, he is still so heavily under the influence of ow that there is no way he is ready to even consider returning to your M, RIGHT NOW. It could go on and on, to the point that you want nothing to do with him (understandable) or it could end two or three months from now. Your H is not thinking clearly. It's like trying to tell a heroin addict that the drug is just a quick fix. He is not in a place to hear you right now. Logic is not going to work right now.

Monica, I can see that you are getting more and more frustrated with your H's behaviour, and that you are tired. I really think that you need to take care of yourself. Assume he's not coming back. Personally, I think this A will end and he will realize that he's made a huge mistake. But I don't know how long that will take. It could be up to two years--that's how long the "in love" chemicals can last. In the meantime, you are exhausting yourself.

Like ST, I don't know the laws in CA, so don't know if it is better for you to be D'd. Can you get a Separation? This could help you with money. If you do it for visitation reasons, I don't think it will help. He will either ignore the court order, or take S4 when he has to and possibly leave him with ow.

Please think of yourself right now. You first, then S4. You can't take care of him unless you care for you.

I'm still praying for you,
Nicola