Wow, should I be so brazen (and humbled) to think that you mean my humor is in the same category as Hairdog's?? Or should I listen to that PITA voice inside my head that's saying "Heather, he thinks you're funny for totally different reasons that he thinks Hairdog is funny....he thinks you're funny because he thinks you're stupid...".
Don't answer that.
"Happiness is a butterfly, which, when pursued, is always just beyond your grasp, but which, if you will sit down quietly, may alight upon you."
Still ridiculously busy, no time to put together a cogent response to you or the others. But I will say your posts to me about sound, to someone (I think it was Cobra) about building people up not tearing down, and also about how to build up passion really struck a chord with me. I have been trying to incorporate all in with my "alpha male" interactions with the W. I am trying to be leading without coming across as judgemental (something my W has accused me of some recently). I'm also trying to find ways to incorporate all this into how I treat my W's relationship with her parents and how it affects us. Its difficult, and I have made some recent missteps, but I'm working on it. Thanks for your words. And I promise ... more later. I really do want to talk about this stuff in detail.
Chrome
"Recollect me darlin, raise me to your lips, two undernourished egos, four rotating hips"
Understood. We women get that loud and clear. This is NOT how women communicate, however.
reeeeeaaaaaaaally.
Guess you've never been in a woman's locker room after a game. No comment
(ahhh I couldnt help it. j/k )and not my point. You totally personalized my post, just like GEL is with her H. She can focus on the fact that she IS getting a compliment, or be 'bristly' about it being good enough. Or she can work with him on changing this aspect of being male. Im sure there is a compromise in there somewhere.
Quote: Shouldnt that just be ...like.... expected? NO.
Wow. OK. duly noted. A job well done is to be unexpected.
Women typically respond better to this type of thing when there is noticable space between the compliment, and 'let's see how we can improve' discussion.
I meant to answer your questions, but that last post got too long… No, I did not praise her this time for having sex. It was a quickie. But other times I have thanked her. Of course there is a correlation between being nice and having that niceness come back to me. I know this fully well. She is the one who has had trouble understanding this. I am trying to magnify that dynamic. She seems to be getting the idea now.
The real stumbling block that the C and I are seeing is that understanding this dynamic means W has to come to terms with the fact that she actually WANTS the love and caring she rants and rails about. In other words, when the C says W walks right up to the line then backs off, she means that W can exchange niceness for niceness, but moving further to admit that she wants me (or any other male) and a love relationship is where things get scary, uncomfortable, and a little too much for her to handle. So she backs off. In some respects, I see this a an exercise in acclimation.
I completely understand what you are saying, just trying to give Cobra the female perspective as well....since we do communicate so very differently.
Being told I did a good job isn't really such a big deal to me. I know I did a good job, I go out intending to do a good job when I do home improvements, generally that's enough for me. I would actually respond better if he said nothing at all. Rather than nit-picking....or if this was an ocassional approach. Instead these come out like you would receive a left-handed compliment where you go...."thanks, I think."
My H constantly looks to me for affirmations that he's done well, and I don't mind giving those (I get the daily rundown of EVERYTHING he's done around the house and at work so I can give him his daily pat on the back...he needs this, I accept that about him). It's just that lately it was beginning to wear on me that he couldn't just give me a pat on the back for a job well done, without pointing out the flaws. Normally, if this wasn't something that was occuring time and time again I'd easily accept that he was still giving me a pat on the back...after awhile though that does wear on me. It's as if everytime I do something (he's asked me to do, that is a favor for him) he points out what I did wrong in the process, even though we get the same results...with very similar effort...it just gets old...if feels nit-picky. After so much of that I start to feel like, "just let him do it, he's only going to tell me how I did it wrong anyway." Now, that's not to say that's what he's saying, but that's how his comments make me feel...and yes, it is personalizing...but hey, I'm human....my H would personalize this behavior too if I did this with him; I've experienced it. He does a lot of assuming that I know he thinks I did a good job on something.....but withholds the affirmation. I need those occasionally too, just as he does. I don't require them nearly as much as he does, but I still need them occasionally...and when they are withheld, the approach is magnified.
I can totally relate to the sports analogy....but my R with my H isn't a sport....sure there are tactical manuevers and I can analyze what I did right/wrong, but even during a game you still get a smack on the butt when you did something right. You still get that atta boy/girl for a good play during the game, you still get the crowd cheering for you. You don't analyze the game until it's over....when you step back and look at it objectively. I can take constructive criticism with no problem....but every now and then we all need to hear that we did something well....without the "but".
Ya know...if he hadn't been doing this to me for the last month or so, quite consistently, it wouldn't really bother me at all...it'd be water off a ducks back. I will point out though, something I should have said earlier, that once I made that comment to him...his attitude toward me changed and became much lighter with me. We did some more painting together and had a fun time doing it. Sometimes I have to say things like that to him before he realizes he's withholding.
That goes back to a conversation we had oh, well over a year ago...closer to two years really. My H would (and still does) brag about me to other people...I hear what he says about me to them, from others....yet he NEVER would say those things to my face. I had no real idea of how my own H viewed me, until some of my close friends told me (after my tubal pregnancy). He withheld his feelings from me...he withheld compliments....he withheld closeness, basically he kept me at arms-length. Now he does MUCH better, every now and then though....I have to let him know when he's withholding.
As for the arm (thanks for asking) it's back to normal, with just some limited stiffness in rotation, but I'm working on that...and I'm back in the saddle again! My Dr. was quite surprised how quickly my bones healed....guess I'm an over-achiever in that area LOL.
(ahhh I couldnt help it. j/k )and not my point. You totally personalized my post, just like GEL is with her H. She can focus on the fact that she IS getting a compliment, or be 'bristly' about it being good enough. Or she can work with him on changing this aspect of being male. Im sure there is a compromise in there somewhere.
No... really, I didn't personalize. I can understand both sides of the remarks. I don't think GEL is asking her H to be something he isn't, nor is any women when they are asking for encouragement or compliments.
I think men are very perplexed by this one aspect of communication, because, like you said... they really don't spend a great deal of time on 'what we did right...' probably would almost seem 'feminine' to do so, huh? Hmmmmm....<eye roll> Geee.... men jump to the... 'how do we get even better?' More masculine part of the equation... competitive... alpha... stay on top of the heap.... Hmmmm.... <eye roll> Gee....
I can and have spent a great deal of my time in the second part of the communication equation, BF. You've called me on it numerous times... you would even call that style of my communicating "competitive." Harsh. Hard. And a lot of the guys here don't like it when I do it, either.
So. I've gone back to the other side. I adore... adore... un-looked for compliments (but not too many). I will double my efforts for some genuine encouragement... IF they lack the 'but' portion of the convo.
Otherwise, I'm hopping back to the other side of the fence in my communication style because it really hurts A WOMAN to have a compliment or encouragement given, especially by the man she loves, and then have it snatched immediately away with a BUT.
The compliment/encouragement thing to a woman feels probably the same way an unsought caress from the W feels to a man. It indicates appreciation, love, respect... a "I'm on your side, babe." With no strings attached.
GEL: Not to threadjack, but do you think your H's compliment-then-criticize behavior might be his way of trying to regain his power/control of the R that he lost with your discovery of his internet activities? This just kind of popped into my head when I read your last post.
As for the arm (thanks for asking) it's back to normal, with just some limited stiffness in rotation, but I'm working on that.
I dont know if your insurance covers physical rehab, but if it does use it alllll. Shoulders are reallly tricky and finicky. Do the limbering exercises. Let me know if you would like to know a few. I took tai chi for a few months after my release so I wasnt bored to tears with getting limbered back up... Do not let it sit, or just wait for the stiffness to go away. you gotta work thru it....
I understand about you and H. I figured you probably got your compromise worked out allready. You got thrown in the Corri/BF crossfire. Thanks... once again my minion. LMAO...
Cobra... I have to say... I feel unheard and unacknowledged... <sniffle> We/I got your POV... Did you get ours, or is it dismissed for being crap...<sniff >
It is possible, but I don't think so. It appears to me to be more like him slipping back into a familiar behavior, as we all do from time-to-time.
Now, there have been other instances in our R where I would agree with what you said. Instances where he would oh...stand up to me, asserting himself...or testing the waters to see what I would do. Many of those occasions I conceeded, not to intentionally let him regain power in the R necessarily...but because he had very valid points.
Quote: The real stumbling block that the C and I are seeing is that understanding this dynamic means W has to come to terms with the fact that she actually WANTS the love and caring she rants and rails about. In other words, when the C says W walks right up to the line then backs off, she means that W can exchange niceness for niceness, but moving further to admit that she wants me (or any other male) and a love relationship is where things get scary, uncomfortable, and a little too much for her to handle. So she backs off. In some respects, I see this a an exercise in acclimation.
I'd really like to comment further on this, but unfortunately, I can't right now 'cuz of work <eye roll>. I'll get back to it... think this is a gem.
My Dr. was quite surprised how quickly my bones healed....guess I'm an over-achiever in that area LOL.
> 