I can't live on $350.00 dollars a month any better than $300.00
Especially not when I looked up roughly what he would be giving me and it ranged from $650.00 - 800.00 a month. So they'll be keeping OVER half of what I receive from him and giving me $50.00 for it. THAT's crap. That is directly from the PA CHILD SUPPORT WEBSITE. The lady there (my case worker no long works there either) so the lady I talked to told me I what I needed to bring. But she said I'd have to talk to the Welfare Office about the cash assistance thing. I called and my case worker there was unavailable. AREN'T THEY ALWAYS *rolls eyes* I'm thinking about trying to drop the case and taking that leap of faith with me H. What do you think? Would it be REALLY stupid?
Okay, I am still friggin STUNNED that that damn system actually works that way now. It's not necessarily like that here. Not as a rule anyway, I know that for sure from H paying CS for my SD. JESUS!!
I can't advise you, Emily.
I can only tell you that I wouldn't trust your husband for all the freakin tea in China.
Sorry but he has not proven himself to give one fat rats ass about what you and those babies live without while he's been running up and down the interstate.
Like I said, I'm sorry but I'm also pissed so maybe I will have a different opinion in a little while but I'm thinking the Second Coming is more likely to happen first.
I think the state assumes that you get X amount of support and anything over that (they take from him) would go back to reimbursing the state for subsidizing his support $.
You might have to take less money via the state to guarantee SOMETHING, rather than depend on him to step up of his own free will and give you more. It seems a little risky to depend on his sense of fatherhood and right/wrong to support his family. Nothing would stop him from giving you a little extra cashvin addition to what the state takes from him.
I know you are already taking steps to do this, but you need to figure out a way to support yourself and your girls. Don't beat yourself up that everything doesn't happen immediately, even though times are tough, look at the light at the end of the tunnel.
Quote: He wants to get together before the support hearing next week and put my name on HIS bankcount (I'll keep my seperate one NO MATTER what). He wants us to start over.
Hi Emily. I'm glad to see you are not jumping to take any action without thinking things out. You sure have grown a lot.
Think of the child support situation as a business deal: If someone owed you money and you had to go to court to get paid, would you accept their 'promise' of 'access' to their accounts if you would just 'drop the case'? No, you'd tell them to pay you SOME amount to show good faith, then you'd drop it (or put it on hold) if they promise to pay on a schedule you both agree to, right?
So, tell him you don't need your name on his account (he could keep it empty now couldn't he?) You need a CHECK. You will even HOLD a check till he has money since he seems to be unable to keep his phone bill under control. But you will not hold it past the hearing date. It has to clear before then. And you have to KNOW it cleared before you move forward.
Yeah, he'll whine about it, tell you he loves you and you don't need to do this, and you should trust him.
Your answer is simple. Calmly say: "I want to trust you and this is the first step. If you truly do love me and want to work on our relationship then it will take small steps to heal the hurt and rebuild the trust. For both of us."
Emily, this is the DB way. It's not an accusation, and you say it with respect and love, no anger.
This is not an unreasonable request to make of him. I know I would do it for my W if she needed it to rebuild trust. If he gets angry then what message does that tell you? And if he DOES get angry then gently remind him that you both have a history of changing your minds about what you want, and this is the way you'll be able to stabilize your situation - small steps to build trust with each other.
Quote: I said something about everything that DBing says and he replies, "So why is it that now when I'm ready to come back . . . when I want to be with you MORE than the day I married you. . . are you ready to quit."
You didn't say you were quitting - you are taking the 'reconciling' SLOWLY so you can rebuild trust. He KNOWS you both need to do that. If he can NOT accept that trust building is needed then HE is NOT ready. He is still in his self centered fog.
Emily, YOU need to speak with calm. Use short statements, ALWAYS pause and think about what you want to accomplish (to learn to trust him again) and how what he says helps or hurts that goal BEFORE you respond to anything he says. Your conversation should have a lot of pauses in it while YOU compose yourself, instead of reacting emotionally.
Quote: He asked me to just trust him until next Monday when we started to mesh everything back together. Is this some crazy ploy . . . is this the last straw on the camel back cracking or could it be the divorce busting . . . .
You can build trust by seeing if he will do what I have suggested. There is no reason for him NOT to give you a check that is post dated, and to back off and let you SEE that he has changed. At least not if he REALLY wants to make it work.
Quote: I feel so bad for him . . . this poor confused man . . that just wants me to try to trust him again. He's trying to make up his mind . . . can't I make it a little easy on him?
Keep the contact unless it becomes obvious to you that it isn't working. Stick with the 'rebuilding trust' theme in your conversations. You ARE making it a 'little easier' by alowing him to demonstrate his intentions are true.
You both need to re-learn the trust. This has to happen BEFORE jumping into each others arms and professing undying love to each other. If it doesn't then you and he haven't learned anything, except how to lie to yourselves and run from problem to problem while never actually solving them.
You can do this. Keep yourself grounded in the reality that it will take TIME for him to earn your trust back and you can give him ways to do that without being too vulnerable.
If he really DOES love you he will understand. He will. Watch for that understanding.
I always like to make a short list of goals before a 'negotiation'. Here are your goals:
1) I will be calm in the conversation. If he is emotional I will wait until he is done with his outburst, then calmly respond.
2) We are rebuilding trust. To do that he must offer to give me support money directly. Only then will I be able to trust that he means what he says.
3) Even if he wants to run home to me and throw himself at my mercy I will not allow it. Rebuilding trust takes small steps and I MUST have that trust before I can allow my heart to be open again.
4) If he is sincere in his intentions, he will do these things.
Quote: I'm thinking about trying to drop the case and taking that leap of faith with me H. What do you think? Would it be REALLY stupid?
Keep it in the process for now. You need it as LEVERAGE. Do NOT tell him what you told us. It would give HIM leverage to manipulate you if that is his intention.
Follow through with the plan I outlined, act 'as if' the case is proceeding as planned. You need to keep your options open. Think of it as a poker game, you need to call his bluff BEFORE you fold your cards.
Remember, it is possible he will agree to everything we outlined and you will actually be able to begin the trust rebuilding.
Also remember that he may not be ready yet and you will have to follow through with the support case to get anything at all.
So, keep your options open. You still do not know his intentions. You only know what he SAYS and that is not something you can trust right now.
Be strong. Nothing has to be decided or changed TODAY.
Emily - I suspect the state will go after him for the back child support regardless of what you do. Remember, the state has been paying for your kids when he SHOULD have been paying - they will want to get him to pay them back what he should have been contributing all along. Check with your caseworker - i don't know how it all works if there wasn't a legal order for support before.
If the support order is for, say, $800 - you say you would only be receiving $350. But that's not entirely true, is it, because you receive housing and food stamps and Medicare too, right? Believe me, all that stuff costs a lot more than $800.
Pursue the support order. It is his OBLIGATION to pay this money. If you get a job and can survive on the support money and your income, then great, you can go off of assistance. If you reconcile, then he can move home and prove himself and you can come off of assistance then.
Quote: You can build trust by seeing if he will do what I have suggested. There is no reason for him NOT to give you a check that is post dated, and to back off and let you SEE that he has changed. At least not if he REALLY wants to make it work.
AWESOME PLAN FRANK! TRULY BRILLIANT!
I will do this tonight. He has plenty of money (over $1000.00) in his account. The problem with his phone I guess was that since he has crap for credit they only allowed him X amount of minutes/dollars a month and then it gets shut off until he pays up. Well he wasn't aware he was going over . . . as soon as he figure out he could do a payment automaticly it corrected the problem. I'm NOT sure I 100% believe this story. It was late and I was half asleep so I may have gotten it slightly wrong . . who knows.
OK . . . If I am going to do this. I don't know how much money to ask for?!?!? I mean if I tell him I want a check to prove he'll step up and give me something . . . how much do I tell him it should be for? OR BETTER YET . . . do I let HIM come up with the amount . . . and see what he does?!?! OH I like that idea!
Quote: Emily - I suspect the state will go after him for the back child support regardless of what you do. Remember, the state has been paying for your kids when he SHOULD have been paying - they will want to get him to pay them back what he should have been contributing all along. Check with your caseworker - i don't know how it all works if there wasn't a legal order for support before. I called Cumberland County and talked directly to the people handling the case. They said if we decide to reconcile it's fine. As soon as he moves back in and the cash assistance ends . . I can choose to drop the case. I just have to go through the welfare office before I can go through the domectic relations office. So it's a long process . . we'll see if he's willing to work at it. She said we have to keep out conference next week . . . but that we should explain the sitch.
If the support order is for, say, $800 - you say you would only be receiving $350. But that's not entirely true, is it, because you receive housing and food stamps and Medicare too, right? Believe me, all that stuff costs a lot more than $800. I know it. THE POINT IS THAT I WOULDN'T BE MOOCHING OFF THE STATE. I COULD SAY THAT SOME OF MY MONEY WAS COMING FROM MY H. I HATE BEING ON TOTAL STATE ASSISTANCE The other point was that I HAVE been looking for a job. I get penalized for NOT having one. . . . when I honest to God can't find one. I even got on CareerLink and CareerBuilder . . . and found SQUAT!!!! I also understand that it costs more and that the state deserves to be paid back BUT couldn't they take a hundred dollars a time OR SOMETHING and allow me to have the rest to support my children?? IF I HAD TO STAY ON THE ASSISTANCE . . which I don't understand how they could make me!
Pursue the support order. It is his OBLIGATION to pay this money. If you get a job and can survive on the support money and your income, then great, you can go off of assistance. If you reconcile, then he can move home and prove himself and you can come off of assistance then I don't mind RECEIVING HELP! I.E. Food stamps and medical . . . but being on the cash assistance makes me feel like scum!! Honestly . . I just want to be able to cancel my cash and support myself some other way. I know a job would be great for that but read what I just wrote above about my job hunt!
Quote: If the support order is for, say, $800 - you say you would only be receiving $350. But that's not entirely true, is it, because you receive housing and food stamps and Medicare too, right? Believe me, all that stuff costs a lot more than $800. I know it. THE POINT IS THAT I WOULDN'T BE MOOCHING OFF THE STATE. I COULD SAY THAT SOME OF MY MONEY WAS COMING FROM MY H. I HATE BEING ON TOTAL STATE ASSISTANCE The other point was that I HAVE been looking for a job. I get penalized for NOT having one. . . . when I honest to God can't find one. I even got on CareerLink and CareerBuilder . . . and found SQUAT!!!! I also understand that it costs more and that the state deserves to be paid back BUT couldn't they take a hundred dollars a time OR SOMETHING and allow me to have the rest to support my children?? IF I HAD TO STAY ON THE ASSISTANCE . . which I don't understand how they could make me!
Emily - I don't think you're understanding the financial issues here. Scenario one: you drop the support order, he pays you the $800, but you no longer qualify for medicare or food stamps or free housing because as far as the state is concerned, you are now "with" your H and his income looks like yours. You would be way worse off financially, right?
Scenario Two - you stay on assistance, H pays his $800 to the state (plus whatever they want to ding him for back support) you receive $350 but also free rent, Medicare, food stamps, access to other programs - all adding up to way more than $800
Scenario Three - H actually comes home, supports you and the kids. It would be nice, but I would believe it when you see it. So far you have only had words from him, words that do not match his actions, even if he's trying to come home he's not there yet and it's pretty suspicious that this is all happening right before the support hearing.
GET THE SUPPORT ORDER, you can always drop it if you truly reconcile, but you need to have that now.
Quote: GET THE SUPPORT ORDER, you can always drop it if you truly reconcile, but you need to have that now.
Ellie
If Ellie is correct on how the financials would work with regards to 'assistance' from the state, then tell him to give you a check that YOU can give the state, or, if in Ellies exeprience that is a bad idea, then tell him to PAY the state right now.
Do whatever is financially prudent. Get more advice on that before you act. Either way he has to make the first move to show he is serious.
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