No real news...have had a quiet couple days. W has been sick. MIL still in town so W has to behave. We have plans together all weekend which should turn out to be very fun.
I would say everything is actually very good except I do not think I can live with the arrangement of her still being friends with OM. She is still very secretive about him...I see she texted him a dozen times yesterday. I am sure IM/emails him often but has been very careful about covering her tracks...makes me suspicious. I just don't know that I can live with her having a double life and her basically "single" nights out on the town. I feel more and more like she wants to stay married (have been a lot of positive signs...and we have been getting along very well when I am in a positive mood) and work on us but she also does not want to give up her new found freedom to do as she pleases a night or two a week.
I have a lot of thinking to do...I feel like I want to make some demands or at least make my feelings known that I do not find the current situation acceptable for the longterm. I so want to go back into PI mode to find out what she is really doing...I still feel like I am being played and I do not like it. Oh well have plans for next week to get away for awhile...I need time alone to think about what I can accept and cannot accept and my future.
Also want to pick up the Divorce Remedy book...is it much different than DB...worth a seperate read?
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
it seems you are recognizing that your W is still in an EA. She is putting her emotional energy into the OM, not you. She may think that if the PA is ended that the EA is OK. I think you do need to tell her that this arrangement is not OK for the long term. She is not committed to working on your R if her emotional needs are being met elsewhere. That, of course, does not mean you have to be her everything or her only outlet but you need to be up there on the priority list! Again, I can't fathom how they somehow don't see the downside to this? I guess it's still that old infatuation working its magic. The other option is to just keep on dbing and wait for it to burn itself out, and if it doesn't and turns back to a PA then do what you have to. It's a tough call. I know some on this board have forced an end to contact but I'm not convinced that this is the best strategy in the long run BUT, as always, you can only deal with what you can deal with. Each of us has our limits and only you can know when you've reached yours! No shame in that. Re: DB some like it better than DB, it's somewhat expanded but the crux of it is in DB.
Quote: The other option is to just keep on dbing and wait for it to burn itself out, and if it doesn't and turns back to a PA then do what you have to. It's a tough call.
Yep...these are the choices I am struggling with...do I turn my back on it and just work on myself and our relationship and hope it ends a natural death...or do I kill it. Not sure what to do...I know I WANT to end it...but that will set her and our R back in the short term...and may cause more long term resentment. Not sure which way I am leaning. She has been warmer the last week or so and has told me she is having feelings for me sometimes...I probably should just continue down the path of rebuilding our foundation before thinking about tearing down anything but it is difficult.
It really breaks my heart that she knows it tortures me each time she leaves yet she does not care...but then when she comes home she wants everything with me to be normal. What she really wants is the A to be a big secret again...she wants to have her cake and eat it too...the problem is the secret is out and it can never be the same. She is really in denial if she thinks this can work long term...and unfortunately I kind of bought into it initially because she was so distraught and actually some how managed to guilt me into giving in...
There have been positive signs...like her acknowledging she needs to see less of OM...and OM supposedly going out on a date with someone else. But she still is resolute that she wants to be friends with OM...and it is not like she is just seeing him in a group of her friends...she goes to his house and then they go out together...much too much like a couple for my liking.
Oh well...another day...just had a positive chat with her...still working on positives...
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
Things took a big shift last night. I decided I could not sit idly by and let my wife continue the PA with OM. We had just had a nice couple of days because basically she was forced to be home cause her MIL was in town. I do not feel like I am strong enough to sit back and let this all happen and try to win her back slowly.
So basically I put it all on the line last night and said she needs to make some choices. She either needs to end her relationship with OM or lets just move towards separation. We had some very heated discussions and at the end of the night we had decided to separate. This kind of devastated me but I planned to help her as much as possible. I guess I was accepting of our impending separation by the end of the night. She obviously wants to be with OM more than me.
This morning when we woke up she changed her mind and said she would end it with OM...she wants to give MC a try and see if we get anywhere. This was good news but came as a real shock to me.
I did not want to force this to happen because I knew there would be repercussions...right now she hates me...I disgust her...she is VERY angry. MC is going to be very tough...I have my doubts whether we can break through this. I have my doubts whether she can really end the A. I am really ready to work on the marriage but I know it is going to be very hard.
I did what I felt I had to do...time to see how it plays out.
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
We all do what we've got to do. Watch for more flip flops but when you come to the point where you are OK either way, that's Heaven (to me, anyway!). Keep us posted.
Flip flopping a few times a day at this point but I feel more comfortable in this situation. I want it to go one way or the other. I want decisions to be made and I am sticking to my guns.
I refuse to live in the situation as is...I can't deal with it. I think if I could just get her to withdraw from him for awhile and get us both into counseling we can get past this.
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
SRT, as long as you believe in the path you've chosen, you can weather the outcome. If she chooses to end it then be as caring and fair as you can be. Your actions now will help to set the table for any reconciliation in future. Don't shut any doors and remember if she decides to stay she is making a great sacrifice (in her mind, and that is what is important). She is giving up that fantasy world that she looked to as a reason to carry on. She is giving up an infatuation that felt really goooooood! She will grieve it. Be understanding and help her through it. Good luck with this. Keep us all posted. those are my ramblings for you for today.
All weekend we flipped and flopped...she is in a ton of pain. I hate seeing it. But I do want us to come to some sort of conclusion. It is very hard...one minute she is telling me she thinks she can do it and we should do this and that...I get my hopes up but then literally 10 minutes later she is crying saying she can't do it. She is still in a lot of denial about what is happenning but I do not dare voice that. I am just being supportive and if she asks I state my feelings on the matter but ultimately she is the one with decisions to make. I can't make them for her.
My only demand on her is she 100% end the relationship with OM. If she does that I am willing to agree to almost anything else. If she is not willing to end the relationship with him one of us has to move out. When she leans towards moving out she has agreed to leave S3 with me and while I would not be happy about her leaving, I am joyous of the prospects of having my son with me.
Even if she moves out she says she wants to date me and reconnect which is a good sign...I guess...she said likely she would like to come back permanently after a year of being away...I told her if it comes to that I would try but I refuse to make any promises to her if she leaves. If she does move out I feel like she is abandoning us and if she does move out she is going to date other men and I do not approve of that...I acknowledge I will have no control of that if she leaves. I am afraid if she leaves I may just want her out of my life and may move on...as much as I love her I feel like I have to protect myself.
I think Thursday night is going to be decision day...I checked into a hotel last night to give each of us some space. We are still going to meet for dinner a couple times. It was just counter productive with us around each other 100% of the time...almost constant relationship talk and I really want her to think about things without me there for a few days...I need the time for myself too. I have to consider exactly what I am willing to do.
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
Did make love for the first time in 5 weeks...which was nice. We are still affectionate and still get along well most all of the time. It is just the combination of the OM and her feeling like she wants to be alone and not answer to anything or anyone. She denies her true feelings for the OM but I do know different...she does let it slip sometimes...and I know she is still in a PA (which she denies).
While I don't talk about this kind of stuff with her...because it upsets her but it just astounds me all that she is willing to give up to keep her R with OM. She now seems willing to give up her child...her family...my family...financial freedom...willing to isolate herself...me...basically everything...I don't understand aliens. I do understand that internally this must be the hardest thing in the world for her and the R with OM is so valuable to her. Still what she really wants is to keep her A going and live with me...I just refuse to be #2 or #1A...
Closest thing I have found to understand:
Romantic Infidelity
Surely the craziest and most destructive form of infidelity is the temporary insanity of falling in love. You do this, not when you meet somebody wonderful (wonderful people don't screw around with married people) but when you are going through a crisis in your own life, can't continuing living your life, and aren't quite ready for suicide yet. An affair with someone grossly inappropriate - someone decades younger or older, someone dependent or dominating, someone with problems even bigger than your own - is so crazily stimulating that it's like a drug that can lift you out of your depression and enable you to feel things again. Of course, between moments of ecstasy, you are more depressed, increasingly alone and alienated in your life, and increasingly hooked on the affair partner. Ideal romance partners are damsels or "dumsels" in distress, people without a life but with a lot of problems, people with bad reality testing and little concern with understanding reality better.
Romantic affairs lead to a great many divorces, suicides, homicides, heart attacks, and strokes, but not to very many successful remarriages. No matter how many sacrifices you make to keep the love alive, no matter how many sacrifices your family and children make for this crazy relationship, it will gradually burn itself out when there is nothing more to sacrifice to it. Then you must face not only the wreckage of several lives, but the original depression from which the affair was an insane flight into escape.
People are most likely to get into these romantic affairs at the turning points of life: when their parents die or their children grow up; when they suffer health crises or are under pressure to give up an addiction; when they achieve an unexpected level of job success or job failure; or when their first child is born - any situation in which they must face a lot of reality and grow up. The better the marriage, the saner and more sensible the spouse, the more alienated the romantic is likely to feel. Romantic affairs happen in good marriages even more often than in bad ones.
"Friendship is like peeing your pants: everyone can see it, but only you can feel the true warmth."
Isn't that the frustrating thing. She'll make love and get along well with you but that makes no dif? I think your thoughts on infidelity are right on! It's so damn easy to have someone on the side whose whole existence is to please you! No bills, no sick kids, no mortgage, no big decisions...just the two of you locked in a love grip! But how do you fight that nonsense? You've chosen to call her on it and my heart is with you cuz part of me wants to cut the BS and do it too! Oh well, for now I'll just live vicariously through you. Keep us posted.
