To Greeneyed lass and experimenting

[Greeneyedlass]

Chrome,

Yep...still banging my head against the wall....but only because CeMar is doling out advice he refuses to take himself.

GEL

[CeMar]

GEL:

I am not doling out advice that i will not take myself. If my wife implemented the Dr. Laura strategy, I would be more then willing to take it. The whole process, if implemented exactly the way she describes, will usually lead to increased desire, the real goal. Her strategy is no different then any of the other expert relationship guides out there. Are you going to have desireless sex to start, of course. But by the end of 2 months this likely will have changed. But here is where she differ from other books, the man basically has no real input. This will work only for women that love their husbands, and are truly commited to changing themselves. Us guys are NOT welcome in the whole process, our advice is NOT welcome. This is a highly personal process that us men will destroy if we try to help. Remember, us guys try to make suggestions on how to fix things, and women usually don't want that from us, it just pisses them off. So as she says, the most us guys can do in the process is to buy the book and give it to them and then get the heck out of the way.

And by the way, "His Needs/Her Needs" also employs the same strategy. He recommends that the couples have sex every day for a long time, and he puts the women in charge of finding what is the EASIEST way for her to enjoy sex. Sheer repetion trying to find the EASIEST way to her desire is the way to success. Again, only works if the women is truly committed to change.

An this is why so many of us are stuck, we have wives that are truly NOT committed to change. They look at those first two months and see no way of achieving that, and well, that makes us stuck.

[chromosphere]

CeMar,

One problem I see with this philosophy is something that BF enlightened me about and I have seen a LOT of evidence for. Many wives will follow (or "mirror" as BF calls it) their husbands. So a strong, leading, masculine H will engender a confident, but feminine W (hence the word mirror, same thing just a different angle). While an overly-detached, or placating, or overly demanding H will create a sense of confusion in the W often leading to unconscious withdrawal. I may be screwing up some of the details, but the main picture is clear. Anyway, I have seen that in action MANY times.

I think it is true that the H has to let the W figure things out on her own, but that doesn't mean he just sits back and does nothing. I'm still unclear about how much leading is too much and how much is too little, but doing no leading will not help at all.

IMHO

Chrome

[Sandy_wants_to_try]

This is interesting.
I am another woman who was LD when younger on and is HD now.
Believe you me. Threre are plenty of women aceepting a less than perfect sex-life because their H's desires are lower than theirs.

IMHO - it's a communication problem. I bet both partners would like more sex.
I'm taking what's happening to me now as a sure sign that a woman's libido is directly linked to emotions. I have not even pleased myself since my H walked away. I'm a pretty sexual person - but that is just gone, right now. No desire AT ALL. Kind of worrying actually - I miss it.

sorry - just had to butt in. That made me alittle feisty too.

[CeMar]

Chromosphere:

All us guys can do is make ourselves attractive inside and out, Make ourselvs confident, and try to remove barriors to desire. Beyond that, it is ALL up to the women. There are dozens of reasons to be LD, most of them have NOTHING to do with their partner, and I would bet that my wife has at least half of the problems.

[Greeneyedlass]

True CeMar....but WHAT are YOU doing to make yourself attractive inside/out?

YOU NEVER TELL US. So that leads me to believe that you sit back waiting for your W to do something FIRST, ain't gonna happen pal.

GEL

[CeMar]

GEL:

Us guys try changes all the time! I have tried begin the worlds best husband, I have tried being a great dad, gift giving, date nights, cleaning the house, working on her honey do lists, etc.. This board has talked about it many, many times. All the change in the world by the man will mean NOTHING until the women commits to change. As Dr. Laura's book makes clear, MEN's ability to cause change in a relationship is FAR lower then the women ability to cause change. Literally, we are chemically addicted to women, but women are not chemically addicted to men (except for HD women).

And by the way, I have a question: Are needs in marriage to be met conditionally or unconditionally?

[chromosphere]

CeMar

You are right that there are many other LD reasons other than R dynamics ... for both women AND men. Maybe women have more possibilities for physical problems, but that is really irrelevant.

The question is, what IS the problem. I think your response was very revealing when you said "I would bet." If you have to BET that means you don't KNOW. What are the real reasons your W is "LD?" It doesn't matter AT ALL if there are 100s of reasons for women to be LD. It only matters what your W's reasons are. Now I am willing to grant the possibility that you do want to know your W's problems/needs/etc. and she is just refusing to talk. I know all about that. Have you tried to talk peacefully with her about it? What is her response?

Chrome

[cinemanymph]

Ce,
I believe you have the werewithal and the intellect to read and understand Passionate Marriage. Get thee to the nearest library and check out a copy. Better yet, purchase one. It starts with you. If you take the advice in the book and take action, your W (and any female within physical range, as well as the ones on this BB) will see a new man. I'm rootin' for ya.

[chromosphere]

CeMar

" have tried being a great dad, gift giving, date nights, cleaning the house, working on her honey do lists, etc.."

All of those things are great if you want your W to LOVE you. But what are you doing to make her ATTRACTED to you? You know, think back however many years. You are in a club and you spy a hot chick that you are interested in. Do you go over and offer to clean up her house or work on her honey-do lists? No, you do the masculine thing. What are you doing to give off those masculine pheremones CeMar?

The point is, a woman may LOVE a man who does everything for her, but will she be ATTRACTED TO and thus DESIRE that man?

Chrome