Quote: I like your letter. Did you actually give that to your W? I hope so.
Um, that wasn't a letter, just me telling you/my W what I wanted/felt, etc. I have told her those things in the past and if I HAD written a letter, I would not have given it to her. In the past, I have posted a bit about the fact that my W doesn't like when I give her letters/notes. She recently told me why, after years of scoffing when she got them. She said because I am a good writer, she feels like I craft my words too much and because of that, she isn't really getting my open, direct feelings. She prefers me to just talk to her without the benefit of editing. I guess I can understand that.
Quote: She has no right to both reside in your home and not willingly be an open book to you. She must make herself be aware that anything she does out of your sight causes you anxiety, and that equals lack of respect towards you, and quite possibly for herself.
Well, with all due respect, she HAS the RIGHT to live in OUR home and do as she pleases within reason, just as I have the right to set boundaries as to what behavior I will accept and what I will not. At this point, transparency is semi-there but there is still that barrier of her defensiveness when I confront her about things that SEEM out of the ordinary.
... as an aside, one of the things I thought of is that my W seems to always think the last time the A came up, or the issue of trust, would be the LAST time it comes up. She acts like each time I bring something up, I am digging things up again and holding onto the affair, much like you suggested your H does. I don't see it that way. To me, there is a difference between forgiving the affair, which I have done, and rebuilding trust, something that unfortunately will relate to the affair for some time. So, for her, there seems to be a counter reset every time I bring up a trust/affair related issue. I don't think she gets that the timer for me hasn't even started yet and won't until I can trust her again... who knows when that will be.
So, while I agree that there is a respect factor at work here, there are also a lot more issues so that one is not the deal breaker. Hell, if I can look at the affair and not consider it a total slap-in-the-face lack of respect, which I can, then I can take her being somewhat defensive when it comes to certain things. Not forever, but for now, yes.
Quote: I know the cell phone thing well. I work at a desk so H can always call here, and he does, several times a day, or I call him. When not at work and if I forget my cell phone when I go into a store and he calls and I don't answer I'm sure he freaks out and has a mild heart attack. He handles it well though most of the time. And the first thing I always say is I’m sorry I forgot the phone. Sometimes he forgets that I have gone somewhere that I can't have a phone.
Ok, I get all that, but do you ever get upset when HE can't be reached? I know my W does and that's what bothers me the most. She'll go for hours without answering her phone but if I don't answer for 10 minutes, she gets in a mood. Double standard for sure. Just make sure you are not doing this, and as for those times you "can't" answer, I guess I would make sure those aren't the same times you used to be with OM the most.
Quote: What you W is doing to you is kind of mean.
Maybe, but I choose not to see it that way. I am not being "done to" so much as I am choosing to be in a situation where my W is not acting in a way I like all the time. I don't think that's to spite me, I just think it's where she's at right now. I think she WANTS to be "nice" but circumstances make it somewhat difficult.
Quote: You are both hyper sensitive right now, in polar opposite directions, so you're bound to misinterpret each-other as we do.
Yep. That's for sure. Working on that.
Quote: However, her actions may be an indication that OM is not out of the picture. Do you know he is for sure?
No, I don't know it for sure. I am 98% sure with the remaining two percent just left because I don't know if I will ever be SURE he's gone. I can say I don't "feel" him around anymore but that doesn't mean she's not in contact with him. Actually I don't believe there is NO contact. I believe they still talk occasionally on the phone. I don't think they meet, but I'm not sure. In any event, I am 100% committed to working on me and what I can control, which is my behavior in the marriage. Hers, I can't do much about other than decide how I am going to react to it, if at all.
Quote: Why is 11 - 1 the prime time?
It's when they used to see each other the most. That said, she did also used to see him 2-3 times a week at night too. That stopped long ago. Now, if they see each other, it's most likely during those hours when she would normally be at the gym.
Quote: Does she look you in the eye when she talks to you?
Yes and no. Actually I have only recently realized that I had a problem with that myself. I found out that I RARELY look people in the eye when I talk to them. I don't really know why, but now that I am aware of it, I notice that my W looks away sometimes, but for the most part, she does manage to meet my gaze.
Quote: It's possible she hasn't told you everything yet.
Very. Actually, I suspect that she still needs to fully confess that they had sex, something she still denies although admitting kissing/making out. I am 50/50 in terms of whether I believe her on this. If she does ML with me without confessing this, I think I would be more like 90/10 in terms of believing her. She is a bad liar (yea, I get the irony, but she really is, which is why she confessed the affair in the first place, it was becoming obvious) and sex with me without telling me all there was to tell would be a huge form of lying to her.
Quote: You can't really demand answers from her, but you can demand respect, and you can tell her that too. Ask her if she thinks she is respecting you by leaving you guessing all the time. Ask her what she's getting out of it by not trying to avoid situation that might cause you grief.
GREAT points. I will be SURE to remember this next time it's time to talk. That is a great way to not attack her, but really get her to think about what/why she's doing.
Quote: I sometimes feel trapped underwater, like we'll never surface, the times that H chooses to relate a fun time to my A. That is his choice, and all choices have reactions whether he means to or not.
Maybe it's his/my choice but I think you are mistaken to think of it like that. You still think we KNOW these things we say to you will hurt you and still do it anyway. You still seem to think we are punishing you or ourselves when we spoil a good time with affair talk. I assure you, at least speaking for myself, this is not true. It's usually just that I feel something, or see something that she didn't see/feel in a given situation, i.e. let's say we enjoy a family day out and it happens to be at a place where we used to go on dates. I may get emotional and start thinking about how things may never be good again, then start thinking of the A. I may decide that I don't want to keep that in and since you are in an ok mood, I will just say something to you, thinking you will just reassure me that things will be ok and it's safe to just be happy. Of course, your reaction might be "Damn, here he goes again. He just can't let me have ONE good freaking day. Why does he keep doing this to me? Can't he just let it go and enjoy what we have?" Then you may say to him "What the hell? I was having a good day and now this. I understand you may still be hurt and all that, but I want to move forward with our lives. Why can't you do that?"
My point is that it MIGHT be that he simply needs you to understand where he is at and NOT jump on him for it. I THINK that may go a long way in smoothing things over. I know it would in my case but my W's pride gets in the way. She even admits that.
Quote: Ok I have a dumb question, and I can't seem to PM you so everyone will have to get a good laugh, but how do you post quotes and how do you post multiple quotes in a response?
You just hit the "Quote" link and it should drop the front and back end of the quote script (quote] [/quote) and you then just past the text you want to quote between those two things so it looks like (quote] This text will be quoted [/quote)
