Thanks. I expected this too, even if I hoped for different. I wonder how much worse it is for the outlook when a S is in an EA for months and then seals the deal and intensifies it and moves on with it. I guess this is not really knowable, and it's not worth thinking about.
I'll be doing better soon, I'm not too down now. I have to acknowledge these feelings of loss now, because if I don't I'm sure there will be trouble down the line. I guess I just realize more and more how far from being in a good relationship with me she is now. She has to make a huge change in herself and her perspective in order for things to work, and the current situation just feeds into the problems. I don't know what I can do to change this. I just know that I need to move forward with my life, continue to make good choices for myself, and not try and force an outcome or make choices about this situation just to reach an end or outcome. All of this is a process, and I am grounded in what I want and where I want to be. I just don't know if I'll get it, and I'm not sure that it's possible. I often feel like I'm fighting a losing battle, but the alternative is to abandon my W, my family, and all of my responsibility and commitment. I can't do this.
My W asked me last night how much longer I would let her walk all over me like she is. I told her that I didn't think she was walking all over me, because what she is doing isn't about me, she's doing it despite me, not to me. She seemed a little taken back by this, but I think it rang true to her. I think she's back to wanting me to get so fed up with the situation that I decide to walk away. She even told me that she's back to hoping that something will happen to me. Really nice. And this is the person I want to be married to!
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
Quote: My W asked me last night how much longer I would let her walk all over me like she is. I told her that I didn't think she was walking all over me, because what she is doing isn't about me, she's doing it despite me, not to me. She seemed a little taken back by this, but I think it rang true to her. I think she's back to wanting me to get so fed up with the situation that I decide to walk away. She even told me that she's back to hoping that something will happen to me. Really nice. And this is the person I want to be married to!
Muddle,
If my W took this approach with me, I don't think I would do nearly as well as you. I would probably have said something to the effect of "If you want this to end, pick up the phone, call your lawyer and then there's the door. I will NOT end this for you. I will NOT do your dirty work. I won't get angry at you and give you an excuse to leave. You have all the reasons in the world to leave so do it now. Don't wait for me to do it for you."
But then again, I am not you, and maybe I'm not even me in that I probably would not have said that, but that's what I thought when I read this.
That sucks to say the least. You are doing REALLY well to have handled that like you did.
Yeah, well I did quite a few times tell her that if she wanted to leave, I wouldn't stop her, and I told her to leave if she wanted to. She then fell back on the whole "I have no resources" thing. I know her parents won't help her out. They want her to try and work things out. This fact that she can't just up and leave easily makes it very easy for her to look at external things as reasons for her actions rather than her choices being the reasons. She takes no responsibility for her actions, choices or where she is in her life. It's frustrating, and in fact it makes me angry that she should cause me so much trouble because of this all. A nasty little consequence of her choices and actions, not her intentions, I know. I choose to be here, and I start to doubt my sanity because of it, especially with her telling me how crazy I sound, etc.
I know that this is my unconditional love put into action by staying the course. I know that if nothing else, I know the strength of my love. Maybe she's not in a place to see it for what it is, or maybe she's not the person to recognize it. I am getting something out of this, out of being here. Tremendous growing pains, but there's something significant to be gained.
I just can't help thinking that she sees me as more and more pathetic. This is a huge paradox, and I know I've written about it before. Staying isn't easy, in fact it's one of the most difficult things I've done, but it doesn't seem to come across that way to her. She even went so far as to question my motivation, my level of understanding of my feelings for her. She thinks that my sticking this out is more because I don't want to lose a possession. I told her that if I viewed her as such I would do all I could in my power to destroy the A, but that I rather put all the emphasis on her choice, her will, because I don't want to be in a relationship with her because there's no other option, but because she chooses to be here.
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
Oh, Muddle, I am so sorry for your pain. Sadly, all of us here have too much empathy to the depth of your hurt.
I have zero wisdom for you, honey, as you see how my sitch has fallen down the hole. But I wanted to virtually hold your hand as you've been holding mine over the weekend. (((((Muddle)))))
Forget the former things; do not dwell on the past. See, I am doing a new thing! Is 43:18-19
If it seems slow in coming, wait. It's on its way. It will come right on time. Hab 2:3
Thanks BI, I really appreciate the support. I wish I didn't feel so stuck in it - because outside of this, my life is really great. I have so much to be thankful for, and even this sitch is something to be grateful for because it has given me the opportunity to learn something new about myself and I think mankind in general.
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
Just talked to W, she called me about an email I sent her about our credit card APR and S4. She made it VERY clear that she is very unhappy to be home. I try to be as pleasant as possible, but I just can't take this whole victim attitude she has. She's just begging to be rescued. She doesn't eat and then acts like it's my fault. She's depressed and somehow I'm at fault because I don't do anything to push her. Frankly, I'm really getting sick of it. I want to push her, but I want to be motivated by love, not anger. I am tired of her decisions making her unhappy and somehow being tied into them. I told her last night that I saw that she was very unhappy with the results of a lot of her decisions. She turned this around by telling me that they were OUR decisions. She decided what she wanted in her life at that time. I didn't see a problem with it for me, or our family so I didn't object. Because I didn't second guess her decisions for her own life, I'm the bad guy? Does that make sense to someone objective here? Or is this truly blameshifting on the part of a cheating spouse?
It drives me nuts that she's hell bent on being miserable in her life. Living miserably justifies her feelings, moreso, it justifies her wants. Here I am, in the midst of the most difficult, painful thing in my life, living happily, being happy. Can't she make the same choices? If she's so in love, wouldn't the world be brighter, wouldn't she be encouraged? Happy to be alive?
She's always asking me about my plans, so she can plan around them. It makes me feel sick, like I'm being watched all the time. Like I'm a parent whose kid is trying to get over on them. And it's totally out in the open. What is the need for this secrecy?
I know I'm in it for the long haul, and this discomfort is necessary, to some degree or another. I just feel there's so much to be resolved at this point to even interact as friends and equals, with dignity and respect, much less as spouses. That part of our relationship is so far gone now. I made the mistake before she left of trying to interact that way again, of thinking she cared about how I felt, who I was. To some degree she did, but in the end, I'm sure it did no good. I just need to cope with this period in my life however I can. Maybe she'll come through, maybe she'll leave. I feel so bad for her through all of this. So bad. I think she has it worse than I do, because my path is clear and honorable. Even though my pain may be greater and different, she still is not in a position to be envied.
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
Well, it was an interesting evening. I went home from work and W looked horrible. She had been crying, and she was really stressed out. She told me as much too. I saw my son, and my heart exploded with joy and I asked him if he wanted to go to the playground. I gave my W some attention before I left and listened to whatever she wanted to tell me, and made it clear that I wanted to be available to her. S4 and I went out to the playground and had a great time. When we got back I made dinner - W didn't want to sit at the table with us - and I ran around and watered the plants. I then prepared to go to my second job. W told me that S4 was different since she was back, and I got the sense that this made her feel bad about herself. In truth, I think that this was somewhat a motivation for me in the things I did while she was gone. S4 (turned 4 in the end of June) has not been potty trained. I always attributed this to a lack of discipline on my W's part. We got close a few times and then things would backslide. Most recently (the past 8 months or so) I attributed this to the fact that she is so fixated on the A and all the drama that surrounds it that she hasn't cared or made this a priority. Well, when she left I potty trained him. He wore underpants the day she left and nothing else. 1 accident the first night and since then he's been perfect. This has to make her feel bad. I don't want her to feel bad about it, but I do want to show her that it can be done, all you have to do is try. I haven't nagged or bugged her about it, I really haven't, but it has been an issue for me. Anyway, I think that contributed to her feeling like she has let him down and has let herself down too.
So I run in the car to go to my second job. I'm about halfway there and I get a call from her on the cell. She's having chest pains. It's not an emergency, she says, but she wants me to come home. I do, and I made her some tea and rubbed her back and told her that if she wanted to talk I would listen and I wouldn't be judgemental. She did want to talk a bit. She told me that she knew what she wanted, she just couldn't figure out how to get it. She wanted to make decisions and act now, and she can't. She doesn't know how she can walk away from our family, but she wants to. She told me about how great she felt about herself being out in the world and doing things she wouldn't do here. She got comfortable riding mass transit, and talking to people. I told her that I thought all of that was great. I was very encouraging - the way I usually think I am with her (despite the fact that she thinks I want her to be locked in a cage and that I don't encourage her to grow and/or be a better person). She said that she got home and she felt that all of her options and choices just disappeared. She is so confined by her world that that person she was can't exist here. She told me she had looked for a job yesterday, but because of x, y, or z factors she kept giving up and thinking that it was pointless. I tried my best to encourage her, but she kept finding reasons that prevented her from doing what she wanted to. Later on, she told me that she didn't expect me to treat her the way I did the night before when she came home. She expected me to be totally fuming and have a quiet anger about me. It was clear to me that my actions did impact her. I told her that I had every reason to be angry and jealous, and that I did have those feelings but chose not to act on them. I told her that I have been making a point of identifying and processing my emotions, but not dwelling on them. We started talking about our M, and how this has brought to light so many faults in our understanding of M, and the way we constructed ours. We saw eye to eye on a lot of the issues, and we even saw eye to eye about what we each want from M in the future, be it this one or another. Imagine that, she wants the same thing out of her marriage as her husband does. Hmm. She went on to say that if and when we do go our separate ways, we should do it right for our son's sake. We should always see eye to eye on how we raise him, and just do it right. I said that no matter what we do, we should do it right. I'm not sure she got what I meant, but she agreed. I told her I thought we should start that right away.
All in all it was a good talk, and it did have its promising moments. She has been really stressed - of her own doing, yes - but I do have a lot of sympathy for her. There's no easy answer. She just called me to chat, and we had a nice little conversation. It's such a strange, strange situation. I feel like I should really distance myself further, but I also see where I am as being effective too. I wish I had a more clear answer about what to do regarding the sitch, even though I'm really clear about where I am mentally now.
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
Just a quick update. Last night I went down to work my second job. Whenever I do this, W always asks me to call when I am coming home. Since the A started, that is. I always felt like it was to sound the alarm to warn her that I'm coming home so she can finish whatever it is that she's doing before I get there. Last night I decided that I wouldn't call. Why should I act like we're in a M relationship if she clearly doesn't want one? Especially since she has made comments recently about wanting to "stop pretending". This is yet another example to me of wanting all the benefits of being M without any of the responsibilites.
So I get home without calling. She's furious. Absolutely furious. "Why didn't you call? You always call?" I told her I didn't call because I didn't have anything to tell her nor did I have any questions of her I wanted answered. She wouldn't stop going on and on about it. Absolutely furious. She turned it into me not caring about her feelings, and me not knowing her, and I'm the one who wants to make this M work and I go and act this way, as if it was a malicious act on my part. And she gets her stuff together and goes to sleep downstairs while continuing to fume like this. I wasn't fazed, in fact I was totally calm and collected. She told me that I didn't care, and that I ignored her feelings. This has been a resounding issue between us, about how I don't jump to try and make her feel better. Part of my decision not to call (and I knew it would have an impact) was based on the fact that I have tried to appease her for so long, and it hasn't worked. I have always tried to give/get her whatever she wanted because I thought it would keep her happy. I realize that this has built resentment in me because I have felt that I gave her everything I could, and she just continued to distance herself and never returned the favor. So now, I don't want to just blindly do this anymore. I want to act as a result of my convictions. I want there to be rational thought behind my actions that is meaningful. Not sure if any of this makes sense.
So she comes back upstairs and yells at me that I didn't even ask about how her evening was or S4s evening was (even though I did ask her how she was doing when I got home, but I guess she didn't hear it in her state). This is apparently proof that I'm a real a$$hole. I keep seeing things like this as progress because it's change. It is breaking us away from the old methods of interaction (even though she continues to try to use the old way to control me) and I know there's a need to create MORE distance between us so that a clear decision can be made to reconcile. Does this sound completely foolish?
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
My point exactly. It is her method of controlling me, and I'm trying to break that cycle. I'm not sure if my method is doing damage to the big picture, or just some static in the short run that will set the stage for a better and healthier long term relationship.
“No problem can be solved from the same level of consciousness that created it. ” – Albert Einstein
