More BS! Grrr. Today, I needed to go by my W's house to pick up an outfit for my S to drop him off at daycare. I had this feeling of dread about turning the corner and seeing OM's care out in front of her house. He was not there. My W was still there and told me that she needed to get in the shower. She left her cell phone on the dresser in the garage. She NEVER leaves her cell phone in my presence unattended. Did today though. After yesterday and seeing my W on MySpace.com with OM's page up, I am suspicious of her telling me anything at all truthfully. I grabbed her cell and perused her text msgs and found what look to be like text msgs to OM, complete with swearing and a "come over" msg. Now I could just paranoid and distrustful after her cheating R and all of her yahoo personals, match.com, eHarmony.com, MySpace.com, etc., but my feelings are inching me closer to where I need to be.
One more story from my W. She tells me that she has a funny story to tell me privately. When she tells me the story it's about our former co-worker who pisses her off and she tells him don't ever call me again. I tell my wife, I am going to tell you something and I hope it pisses you off. Yes, I did tell her that I hope it DOES piss her off. My W had previously told me that she thought that former co-worker (FCW) is a nice guy. I told my W that NO, in fact he is a piece of shi*t, is only interested in looking out for himself, is a liar, and knows NOTHING about his job but acts like he knows EVERYTHING. I told her he's personable yes, but nice NO.
My wife was looking at me waiting for the statement that I hoped would piss her off and I said: "Oh, he is so nice. I really like him. I like working with him." She didn't get pissed, she only said that she saw a different side of him today. I responded by saying that I am an incredibly good judge of character, usually within less than a minute and if I have two minutes, I will be dead on. She said she knows. Same conversation I had with my MIL about the same person less than a week ago. And I am asked to keep my mouth shut because I cause problems, no matter how right I end up being in the end. I hate that b/c they always come back and ask me why didn't you tell me? and say next time make sure I know. Riiiiiggggghhhhhhttttt! I am surrounded by nutcases, I tell you.
Anyhoooooo, I am finding my legs in this fight. I am pretty darn confident I am going to outlast my W and win the good fight! She's gonna get tired, that hedge of thorns is gonna work wonders, Jesus is gonna talk to her with His Voice of Truth, and I will have a lifetime to tend to the DB/DR fruits of my labor
Those text msgs are, in fact, msgs to OM again. My poor wife is so confused, so lost, and her self esteem is so low. She's running back to OM because they have so much of a solid foundation after 3 1/2 months of duplicity in their R. Oh well, I can't make her see the value in her that I do. THAT is her job to solidify her feelings of self worth. I will just pray a hedge of thorns around her to keep her safe and keep the wolves at bay. I know the Lord is able to perform miracles, and WILL to keep the enemy at bay since my W is still hypnotized the him and his minion, OM.
I was relating this story to my good friend and told him that I know my W isn't stupid and believe that she is purposely leaving out info re: her actions to hurt me. He countered, NO, she just thinks you are stupid. THAT is entirely true, despite the fact the SIL told her awhile back that I am much smarter than she thinks I am, I know much more than she thinks I do, and that she shoud NEVER underestimate me. My SIL knows that if I am backed into a corner, I come out swinging, so look out. I love my SIL, she knows me better than my d*mn W does.
I then steered my W towards the conversation of suaring up the expenses for my son's and D's birthdays. W had previously said that I owed her for D's bday expenses and I told W that she still owed me for son't bday expenses and overall that left her owing me $10. I also gave her $40 cash tonight at the state fair and told her that before it came back to her as a nightmare memory, to just think of the $40 as a gift and that I didn't expect it back. She thanked me.
Next, I spoke with my W about child support. Recently my W has begun working for her mother more and now makes more than me plus she does her loan signings. Anyway, I was figuring out child support payments online and I got a figure that I need to be paying $163/mo. NOT the $1000/mo I have been paying since May 1. I recalculated the figures using NET income and re-adjusting the % of time with each parent to 55%W and 45%me and the new figure was calculated at W owes me $193/mo. I could hear my wife pick her jaw up off the floor because according to her she is $800 in the hole now. I told my W that I would NEVER take child support payments from her because that would go against everything I believe about being a man. I then asked my W to put her checkbook aside and tell me what she thinks she needs right now because my child support payments are for MY children. She asks me if I would be OK paying for 1/2 of my son's daycare expense and I said yes. This is what she previously told me she would want, so no big deal to me. When I was talking with SIL the other day, SIL told W that the $1000/mo I was paying her was ripping me off and was wrong. Again, I love my SIL. She speaks truth bluntly.
I also told my W that I wanted our agreement in writing because I am fearful that she will have a change of heart and change her mind. She insists that she will not and tries to get me to believe that I can trust her, but I don't trust much of what she says these days. She has proven to be a terrific, prolific liar. I also told her that I would state in the same document that I would NEVER take child support payments from her because she said she was somewhat afraid that the child support calculator said that she owes my $193/mo.
I told her, look, I am not out to screw you over, pull a fast one, take advantage of you...those are my children and I will always do right by them. I asked my wife if she needed to transition into me paying $440/mo instead of $1000/mo over time to get used to it. She said no, she'll make it work. When I asked how, she said she'd borrow $$$ from MIL. She asked me if I would give her the check tomorrow, and I agreed.
My W seemed very afraid of the prospect of more separation of our lives with these changes in child support. Remember, I started my sitch out giving her my ENTIRE paycheck from mid-Feb thru the end of April, and have been paying $1000/mo since then. I have been getting counsel from a gentleman vendor familiar with my sitch and he has been advising me to get my child support payments closer to where they should be and to get the changes in writing so that if and when we end up in court, I will have the supporing documentation. He also said that I need to think of my child support payments simply as a bill; no more, no less, otherwise I'll screw myself for 18 years.
My good friend tells me to pay what is required and no more. That way I will be able to buy myself my own place and ALWAYS be in control of where I am going to be living. He said by paying what is the correct amount for child support, I will get from where I am to where I want/need to be that much faster. I can't argue w/ that logic. I have such good friends saving me from myself.
So, to recap, my W is trying to rekindle her R with OM who has been two-timing her since their R began. My W thinks I am stupid. My child support payments just went down by $560/mo. My wife is scared right now that financially she won't be able to make it on her own and maintain the same lifestyle to which she has grown accustomed. I feel bad about her sitch. I feel bad that she feels that my A is forcing her to make the choices she is making. She won't look at her options, only getting a D and chasing two-timing OM. Sad, I feel. Very sad.
Quote: I recalculated the figures using NET income and re-adjusting the % of time with each parent to 55%W and 45%me and the new figure was calculated at W owes me $193/mo. I could hear my wife pick her jaw up off the floor because according to her she is $800 in the hole now. I told my W that I would NEVER take child support payments from her because that would go against everything I believe about being a man.
How does accepting money from her to basically be GIVEN to your kids have anything to do with YOU being a man? The money is not for YOU, it's for the KIDS. At least by taking it from her you are SURE it will be used for kids clothes, allowances, whatever. She NEEDS to pay. It's part of HER lesson. Don't deny her this.
Quote: She asks me if I would be OK paying for 1/2 of my son's daycare expense and I said yes. This is what she previously told me she would want, so no big deal to me.
I agree, paying for things that are beneficial for BOTH of you is fair. I assume child care helps you too?
Quote: I told her, look, I am not out to screw you over, pull a fast one, take advantage of you...those are my children and I will always do right by them. I asked my wife if she needed to transition into me paying $440/mo instead of $1000/mo over time to get used to it. She said no, she'll make it work. When I asked how, she said she'd borrow $$$ from MIL. She asked me if I would give her the check tomorrow, and I agreed.
You handled this well. She does need to pay child support though. I would just not bring it up until / unless the D moves forward.
Quote: My W seemed very afraid of the prospect of more separation of our lives with these changes in child support.
This is the key. Reality is catching up. The feight train is getting closer to crashing....What will she DO without you to take care of the details of her life while she plays?
Quote: My good friend tells me to pay what is required and no more. That way I will be able to buy myself my own place and ALWAYS be in control of where I am going to be living. He said by paying what is the correct amount for child support, I will get from where I am to where I want/need to be that much faster. I can't argue w/ that logic. I have such good friends saving me from myself.
He's a good friend. You should take his advice.
Quote: So, to recap, my W is trying to rekindle her R with OM who has been two-timing her since their R began. My W thinks I am stupid. My child support payments just went down by $560/mo. My wife is scared right now that financially she won't be able to make it on her own and maintain the same lifestyle to which she has grown accustomed.
Well, we al lknow how much of a loser OM is so the fact she see him as any kind of 'solution' is a reflection on her own self image. Which is a poor one at best.
Quote: I feel bad about her sitch. I feel bad that she feels that my A is forcing her to make the choices she is making. She won't look at her options, only getting a D and chasing two-timing OM. Sad, I feel. Very sad.
It is sad. Rememeber that she is USING your A as an EXCUSE to do what she is doing. It has nothing to do with you. I suspect that this would have happened eventually, she would have found something else to justify it then. My W was on the edge for 4-5 years till a 'wonderful guy' showed up and told her all she wanted to hear. It allowed her to continue avoiding her own internal struggles by running away from them.
Quote: I recalculated the figures using NET income and re-adjusting the % of time with each parent to 55%W and 45%me and the new figure was calculated at W owes me $193/mo. I could hear my wife pick her jaw up off the floor because according to her she is $800 in the hole now. I told my W that I would NEVER take child support payments from her because that would go against everything I believe about being a man.
How does accepting money from her to basically be GIVEN to your kids have anything to do with YOU being a man? The money is not for YOU, it's for the KIDS. At least by taking it from her you are SURE it will be used for kids clothes, allowances, whatever. She NEEDS to pay. It's part of HER lesson. Don't deny her this.
I get it. I won't. She needs to reap what she sows, so she will.
Quote:
Quote: She asks me if I would be OK paying for 1/2 of my son's daycare expense and I said yes. This is what she previously told me she would want, so no big deal to me.
I agree, paying for things that are beneficial for BOTH of you is fair. I assume child care helps you too?
Thanks for the affirmation. Yes, it does help me too.
Quote:
Quote: I told her, look, I am not out to screw you over, pull a fast one, take advantage of you...those are my children and I will always do right by them. I asked my wife if she needed to transition into me paying $440/mo instead of $1000/mo over time to get used to it. She said no, she'll make it work. When I asked how, she said she'd borrow $$$ from MIL. She asked me if I would give her the check tomorrow, and I agreed.
You handled this well. She does need to pay child support though. I would just not bring it up until / unless the D moves forward.
I won't. It is on the back burner only to be addressed if/when she turns up the heat.
Quote:
Quote: My W seemed very afraid of the prospect of more separation of our lives with these changes in child support.
This is the key. Reality is catching up. The feight train is getting closer to crashing....What will she DO without you to take care of the details of her life while she plays?
She seems to be running out of steam, then gathers herself and picks up a new head of steam. It's remarkable to watch, but extremely sad.
Last night I was over her house wrapping presents for our D and I asked her if I could come over and wake our D on her Bday this morning. My W hesitated and I asked her, why can't you just be up front and honest with me. I told her you think I am stupid. I told her I am neither stupid, nor blind. I know exactly what is going on; always have. She said she knows that. I told her I wish you placed more value on yourself and as I was leaving I stopped and looked back at her and she said sadly, I heard you. I gently shook my head and said no you didn't and left.
She is making my detaching easier for me. I realize that I can't go valuing her more than she values herself and I can't go on loving her more than she loves herself. Only she can decide what she is worth, and if this is what she believes she is worth I am sad for her. Each day I grow stronger, and each day she runs harder. I do know that I will not end up exhausted and collapse from growing stronger. I know she is going to collapse from running; it's only a matter of time.
My fear is that she is going to run the patience, understanding and love out of me. I have said all along since my sitch developed, everyone I know has asked me why I am continuing to hold out hope for reconciliation when my W is saying what she is saying and behaving the way she is behaving. I tell them that I believe in miracles. I believe that she is playing her hand the way that she believes is best for her. I also tell them that she is my wife and I owe her 5 things: 1. Patience 2. Love 3. Kindness 4. Honesty 5. Respect
So.... Interesting story. My ex-coworker sat next to me where my W now sits. My W cleaned out his desk and only left up one piece of paper. Guess what it is. It's those 5 items that I told my ex-CW that I owe to my W when he was contstantly telling me to give up and asking me why I am holding on. I printed them out for him b/c I told him I believe every husband should treat his W this way and those are my driving tenets when interacting with my W.
Quote:
Quote: My good friend tells me to pay what is required and no more. That way I will be able to buy myself my own place and ALWAYS be in control of where I am going to be living. He said by paying what is the correct amount for child support, I will get from where I am to where I want/need to be that much faster. I can't argue w/ that logic. I have such good friends saving me from myself.
He's a good friend. You should take his advice.
Yes, he is. The amazing happenings in my life since my sitch blew up in my face are that I always believed that I had lots of acquaintances and NO friends. The truth is that I do have lots of acquaintances and LOTS of friends whom I have reached out to and they have responded by allowing me to lean on them and holding me up.
Quote:
Quote: So, to recap, my W is trying to rekindle her R with OM who has been two-timing her since their R began. My W thinks I am stupid. My child support payments just went down by $560/mo. My wife is scared right now that financially she won't be able to make it on her own and maintain the same lifestyle to which she has grown accustomed.
Well, we all know how much of a loser OM is so the fact she see him as any kind of 'solution' is a reflection on her own self image. Which is a poor one at best.
Quote: I feel bad about her sitch. I feel bad that she feels that my A is forcing her to make the choices she is making. She won't look at her options, only getting a D and chasing two-timing OM. Sad, I feel. Very sad.
It is sad. Rememeber that she is USING your A as an EXCUSE to do what she is doing. It has nothing to do with you. I suspect that this would have happened eventually, she would have found something else to justify it then. My W was on the edge for 4-5 years till a 'wonderful guy' showed up and told her all she wanted to hear. It allowed her to continue avoiding her own internal struggles by running away from them.
Thank you for sharing your experience. I am seeing that my W is not as unique in her behavior as I thought she was. It is a pattern. She will grow tired of running from her own internal struggles. My W has been running for 5+ years as well. It's easier to point at someone else as the problem than to look in the mirror.
Quote: You're doing great, as usual.
I wish I felt great. I miss living with my family. I miss my W being my W.
Sad story today, although not unexpected. I was talking with a CW and she was telling me about a work sitch. I told her that is my W's property. She said, "You said wife?" She looked surprised. I know that she is somewhat aware of my M to W, but it is obvious that W continues to refer to me as her EX-husband. Saying that must make her feel better.
I simply looked at my CW and said, yes, I said W because that's who she is. I help up my left hand and thumbed my wedding ring with my left thumb and walked away with a smile. CW said I don't want to be involved. I left smiling. Ahhhhh, the tangles web of lies W weaves.
And I am asked to keep my mouth shut because I cause problems, no matter how right I end up being in the end. I hate that b/c they always come back and ask me why didn't you tell me? and say next time make sure I know. Riiiiiggggghhhhhhttttt! I am surrounded by nutcases, I tell you. 
She's gonna get tired, that hedge of thorns is gonna work wonders, Jesus is gonna talk to her with His Voice of Truth, and I will have a lifetime to tend to the DB/DR fruits of my labor 
Saying that must make her feel better.