Today was a nice, but hectic day with our children. No phone calls from my W asking me to extend my time with our children. I called on my way there and dropped the off on time. I put their stuff away and told my W that all of the clothes I brought back for them were clean and most everything was put away. She asked if their clothers were put away and I told her no, the clothes are in the black back on D's floor. I kissed our children goodbye and left right away, telling them all that I would see them again tomorrow night. THAT was my shortest stay there EVER. I am truly working to emotionally separate from my W. I know the direction she has us headed and doing more of the sameis simply slowly choking the remaining breath out of my M. I have nothing to lose by changing the status quo. If I continue on with the same MO, my M is gone. My pair will not allow that to happen without turning over EVERY stone to find what I can do that will help turn this runaway D train around. I am clear on this, though. I have not prayed nearly enough for myself, for my W, for our M, and for our children. My plan now is to be in near-constant intercession (prayer: learned a new word in today's sermon )
Today the pastor said that prayer is conversation with God. He also said prayer is about miracles. We need to pray for miracles because if we pray for the easy stuff, no glory goes to God. Praying for that which cannot be accomplished w/o God assures glory will be attributed to Him. For me, THAT DID PREACH! The pastor also told us that he prays with a pen and paper to help keep him focused. He suggested that we get a prayer journal. I have one now. I often find my prayers rambling and unfocused, then I am not happy with my praying. How troubled am I? I certainly don't need to feel that way after praying. The pastor also offered some quotes along the lines of Psalm 143 10Teach me to do Your will, for You are my God; may Your good spirit lead me on level ground. Here are the quotes. Some of them may not be as accurate as is would like.
Oswald Chambers- Prayer does not fit us for the greater work. Prayer is the greater work.
Oswald Chambers- Never make the blunder of trying to forecast the way God is going to answer your prayers.
Unknown- The purpose of prayer is not to inform God of your needs, but to invite Him to rule our lives.
Unknown- The real tragedy of our prayers is not that God doesn't answer our prayers, but that we are praying for the wrong things and that when God does answer what we were truly asking for, we don't recognize it. *The pastor also said that the Holy Spirit translates our misguided prayers for God so that our true prayers will be heard. I don't know if anyone else believes that, but it made sense to me and I do.
James Hudson Taylor- I used to ask God to help me. Then I asked if I might help Him. I ended up asking Him to do His work through me.
Unknown- Before we can pray, "Thy Kindgom come..." we must be willing to pray, "My kingdom go..." *That one hit me hard. I am so controlling when it comes to my life. I am expert and mucking it up. I gotta give up the reins.
As I said, I tried to make my notes as accurate as possible, but I am going to get an audio copy today's sermon. I missed one quote today.
I am not as sad today as I anticipated in standing firm in what I believe is correct with my W. I understand standing firm does not mean being unfeeling or being and A-hole. I will constantly check my heart with my thinking and my thinking with my heart to find the proper balance to be the man that God always intended for me to be.
My M may end despite my DB/DR efforts, but I want to come to that day being able to look at myself in the mirror in the knowledge that I did everything within my power to redeem myself through repentance, to restore my M with proper, loving, respectful behavior towards my W, to reconcile my M by setting and respecting my own boundaries and being respectful of my W's boundaries.
I pray for the miracle of the restoration and reconciliation of my M, because I understand that the necessary healing will only come from God.
I'm sorry I kind of lost track of you for a few days. I had your previous thread in my favorites and I didn't realize it had locked. Found you now!
I think you are doing great! It IS all about YOU finding your 'alpha male' and 'spanking' her as often as possible when she tries to manipulate you.
A couple thoughts. When she asks you if you are dating just say 'no, I take my marriage vows seriously and we are still married' and of course she will probably say something like 'Well you didn't whgen you were having your affair!' in which case you simply reply 'yes, and that was terribly wrong of me to do THEN just as it would be wrong for me to do it NOW'.
Now she has to apply that to her OWN life.
When she's 'flirting' with you I don't know if you are being 'firm' when you say 'I do not want to go to lunch with you' or other things. You know what I mean? End the conversation immediatly with "NO, I don't want to xxxx". Firm and decisive. Take all the wind out of her sails.
You're right about being consistent and predictable. That is the key to any relationship.
Keep it up!
p.s. send ma an e-mail and I'll send you some stuff to read.
Quote: I'm sorry I kind of lost track of you for a few days. I had your previous thread in my favorites and I didn't realize it had locked. Found you now!
NP, my friend. Thank you for putting for the effort to find me.
Quote: I think you are doing great! It IS all about YOU finding your 'alpha male' and 'spanking' her as often as possible when she tries to manipulate you.
Thank you, my friend, but I struggle mightily to step out of my more of the same BS that I have re-inforced so strongly in my behavior with my W. One thing that is in my favor is that, at this point, I am less afraid than ever to step forward and be the man that I know that God always intended for me to be. If that means I lose my W and my M, then I will lose by putting up a fight for what is right; a fight for my M, and not sitting there passively and meekly while the enemy destroys what I hold dear. I can live with a negative outcome, knowing that I left no stone unturned in trying to restore and reconcile my M.
Quote: A couple thoughts. When she asks you if you are dating just say 'no, I take my marriage vows seriously and we are still married' and of course she will probably say something like 'Well you didn't whgen you were having your affair!' in which case you simply reply 'yes, and that was terribly wrong of me to do THEN just as it would be wrong for me to do it NOW'.
Oooooh, I like that. Thank you. THAT I will use. Firm, direct, and respectful to both of us.
Quote: Now she has to apply that to her OWN life.
I pray she does. I have become crystal clear that I cannot make her discoveries for her. I cannot have epiphanies for her. I cannot work on her issues for her. I can only work on me and show her my powerful example of changing me with effort, diligence and determination.
Quote: When she's 'flirting' with you I don't know if you are being 'firm' when you say 'I do not want to go to lunch with you' or other things. You know what I mean? End the conversation immediatly with "NO, I don't want to xxxx". Firm and decisive. Take all the wind out of her sails.
I do see. I have so far to go in practicing DB/DR guidelines. I often feel like I have screwed up most of my M being on autopilot and I struggle to take back control rather than doing my usual more of the same sh*t.
Quote: You're right about being consistent and predictable. That is the key to any relationship.
Thank you for validating me. I will work to keep that tenet in the forefront of my mind at ALL times. More me work to do on me in laying the groundwork for the restoration and reconciliation of my M.
Quote: Keep it up!
I certainly will. I cannot think of anything better than me to be working on than me because I know that I will receive my own lifelong gift from myself by molding a better me and that better me will be the right person to build a better M with my W when she decides she does want her M and H back; both being stronger, healthier, whole and much better.
Quote: I have become crystal clear that I cannot make her discoveries for her. I cannot have epiphanies for her. I cannot work on her issues for her. I can only work on me and show her my powerful example of changing me with effort, diligence and determination.
Half the battle is coming to that realization. You're already there.
Quote: I have so far to go in practicing DB/DR guidelines. I often feel like I have screwed up most of my M being on autopilot and I struggle to take back control rather than doing my usual more of the same sh*t.
Yeah, remember that 'taking back control' doesn't men to become 'controlling'. It means to reclaim what control over YOU that you have given up.
Quote: I have become crystal clear that I cannot make her discoveries for her. I cannot have epiphanies for her. I cannot work on her issues for her. I can only work on me and show her my powerful example of changing me with effort, diligence and determination.
Half the battle is coming to that realization. You're already there.
Thank you, Frank. I don't feel like I am already anywhere except lost and embroiled in a marital sh*tstorm.
This morning I went to drop off my children at the babysitter's house which is across from my W's house and who's car do I see sitting out front and my W is NOT there. She's already at work and leaves OM there. And so I detach further, while still loving her from an even further distance. Makes me so sad. But, I have lots of ME work to do to keep me busy and I have two beautiful, perfect, innocent children to focus on, care for and love.
Quote:
Quote: I have so far to go in practicing DB/DR guidelines. I often feel like I have screwed up most of my M being on autopilot and I struggle to take back control rather than doing my usual more of the same sh*t.
Yeah, remember that 'taking back control' doesn't men to become 'controlling'. It means to reclaim what control over YOU that you have given up.
Sir, yes sir! I understand. I do not need to react to her words or actions. I need to weigh what happens and respond appropriately (or don't respond at all). I feel that she is lost and I am only working to regain the control that I gave up to her in our M. That control over me is MINE and I intend to finish taking it back and keeping it for myself.
You're doing great!
Thank you for saying so. I wish I felt like I was.
Tonight I try reaching our D to tell her goodnight (our nightly ritual). I was unable to reach her so I left a message at the housse. My D calls me back at 9:00 PM and she is clearly upset. I tell her that I can tell that she is upset and ask her what is wrong? She tells me (still upset) that she needs to bathe and she will call me back when she is done. At 9:45 PM I try to reach her to say goodnight and find out what was upsetting her. No answer. I try several more times because I was worried and fianlly my W answers the phone and asks me why I am calling. Rhetorical question. She knows why.
I tell her I was calling D to say goodnight and find out why she was so upset earlier. My W says she has already gone to sleep and my W will see me in the morning. I ask my W, why D was she so upset earlier and W tells me she (W) forgot. I tell her that I am concerned about our D and would really like to know. My W tells me that it was so stupid that she can't even remember what the upset was about and W will see me tomorrow. I just say good night.
I am hurt and pissed off about my W's apparent lack of caring about our D, me or both of us. My W is so stuck in her selfish mode that it seems that no one has the ability to penetrate W's emotional barrier.
I will focus on caring for our children, but W is in the mode to make that difficult with her behavior e=when tour children are in her care and W won't share with me what is causing an upset in our children's lives and W tells me that she can't remember when I question her about an upset.
I feel like I am swimming upstream in dealing with my W and the current is growing stronger against me.
Quote: I will focus on caring for our children, but W is in the mode to make that difficult with her behavior e=when tour children are in her care and W won't share with me what is causing an upset in our children's lives and W tells me that she can't remember when I question her about an upset.
I feel like I am swimming upstream in dealing with my W and the current is growing stronger against me.
HH,
Your W is suffering from a severe case of A-HOLE.
Regarding OM at her house, many people I have seen who are sep / divorced have an order forbidding ADULT NON FAMILY MEMBERS from staying overnite at the house where the KIDS are.
Quote: I will focus on caring for our children, but W is in the mode to make that difficult with her behavior e=when tour children are in her care and W won't share with me what is causing an upset in our children's lives and W tells me that she can't remember when I question her about an upset.
I feel like I am swimming upstream in dealing with my W and the current is growing stronger against me.
HH,
Your W is suffering from a severe case of A-HOLE.
Yes, sir, she is. I understand where this is coming from though. She is hurt, angry, feels embarassed and betrayed and is also feeling the need to "save face" because all of the "stuff" she has heaped upon me to friends and acquaintances in the wake of my mistake. I am sure she does not want to look weak or bad after all of that. But, as my MIL has told me, I made a mistake and have worked very hard to atone for my A and to make amends to my W. My MIL says I have paid enough and I need to stand up for myself and stop being my W's doormat and/or whipping post. I agree with my MIL, although at this point I don't agree with a lot that MIL has to say, at this point.
Quote: Regarding OM at her house, many people I have seen who are sep / divorced have an order forbidding ADULT NON FAMILY MEMBERS from staying overnite at the house where the KIDS are.
Just a thought.
We are still short of reaching the court order point. I was served with papers from the mediator by my wife in mid-June. I still have not signed the papers and returned them to the mediator. In the paperwork, the documents said I had 20 days to return them to the mediator.
On or about the 20 day from the date of the documents, I called the mediators office and asked about the 20 day deadline and was informed by the secretary who drafted the docs that she put he 20 day deadline to encourage people to return their docs to move the "process" along, but that the 20 day deadline meant nothing.
In mid-July, my W asked me about the docs, and I told her that I had not returned them, but I would. She then sent an e-mail to our mediator that read as follows:
Quote: H just informed me that he has not signed his portion of the divorce papers. What happens becuase of that? Is the filing date still the same? I have also had a title company drawn up an inter-spousal deed for him to sign and I am not sure he is going to sign it at this point. What are my options here? Also, to change my name back to my maiden name, can I just have that done now? I also wanted to set up our final meeting with you so that we could get everything settled and in writing about our children and spousal support. Please advise. Thank you. (cut and pasted body of my cc copy of her e-mail)
I have not heard anything back, but since he is OUR mediator I am not sure if she has heard anything, and I am not in the mood to ask her. I believe since he is working for both of us, dealing with only one of us would be unethical.
BTW, I have never told W that I will not quitclaim the house to her. I also find it interesting/disturbing that she already wants her maiden name back. It has been my experience that most woment who have children are NOT in a huge hurry to change their last name and have a different last name from their children, unless they ARE getting re-M shortly. Who knows what's on her mind except anger for me? I suppose this can all be chalked up to her present state of mind.
Quote: Regarding OM at her house, many people I have seen who are sep / divorced have an order forbidding ADULT NON FAMILY MEMBERS from staying overnite at the house where the KIDS are.
I neglected to finish my thought on this point. When we reach the point of obtaining a court order, this WILL be addressed, as will my child support that I have been willingly paying (too much, by my calculations).
Time will sort all of this out. And yet I remain hopeful that we will restore, rebuild and reconcile our M. We'll see. I'll work on me and pray.
Quote: I understand where this is coming from though. She is hurt, angry, feels embarassed and betrayed and is also feeling the need to "save face" because all of the "stuff" she has heaped upon me to friends and acquaintances in the wake of my mistake. I am sure she does not want to look weak or bad after all of that. But, as my MIL has told me, I made a mistake and have worked very hard to atone for my A and to make amends to my W. My MIL says I have paid enough and I need to stand up for myself and stop being my W's doormat and/or whipping post.
None of these reasons are permission for her to be an A-HOLE. She's doing it because she CAN. Sounds to me like she has a BIG EGO and your MIL is right - Stop putting up with it. Look HH, she's doing what she's doing because she WANTS to. Nobody is making her do it. IF, as your MIL says, you have 'atoned' enough then I say your W is a total jerk who is selfish and immature.
Quote: I have not heard anything back, but since he is OUR mediator I am not sure if she has heard anything, and I am not in the mood to ask her. I believe since he is working for both of us, dealing with only one of us would be unethical.
And possibly illegal. Read your contract with him. Call him and ASK what the answers to her questions are.
Quote: BTW, I have never told W that I will not quitclaim the house to her. I also find it interesting/disturbing that she already wants her maiden name back. It has been my experience that most woment who have children are NOT in a huge hurry to change their last name and have a different last name from their children, unless they ARE getting re-M shortly. Who knows what's on her mind except anger for me? I suppose this can all be chalked up to her present state of mind.
I think you should tell her you aren't just going to quitclaim on the house. IN her present state she will be furious because she is not getting her way BUT she will also see that YOU are not a doormat and YOU are not rolling over for her. It may have an effect on her.
As far as changing her name to 'get married' that's lame. I don't believe it. She's still married to you so I think it's really designed just to hurt YOU. And you don't have to have your 'maiden name' to get married to someone. I wouldn't give it much creedence.
Overall HH I think you need to spank her more. It's one of the few instances where you MIL is right. Be firm but caring. SHe is way messed up and to be honest I think this is her TRUE nature.
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