In my situation, there is no room for tit for tat. Major acceptance is required and not looking back is part of the clean slate. It's about really forgiving and unconditionally loving in order to begin again.
I don't know your sit, Lisa, but I wish you well. Andy is real good at getting you to focus on the important stuff.
Lisa-My H does not seem to expect me to do cartwheels over every little change. On the contrary-he thinks it's me that needs to change the most. I have changed in so many ways that I don't even think he's noticed but I would'nt because he is not the type to say anything about it. It's more of what he doesn't say-But I think he's in a position after being in an A that he thinks he does not really have the right to do alot of complaining. Of course in C. we discissed pre A issues and how he felt and how this whole thing could have happened. He did take responsibility saying no matter what,it should never have happened and that he wished he could turn back time. We don't fight much anymore but when we do he seems to act like I have not changed at all-probably kindof like I feel that it reminds me of how he was acting during the A and makes me wonder if its still going on, but when he's acting very loving I don't feel that way-just when he gets distant or mody I slip up and think, he must still be talking or seeing her. Here's my dilema of the day. H. has seemed to have lost interest in sex. AS I have stated before, he has always been very sexual. and it would take just a look or a touch or just seeing me to turn him on. Now its like he can see me get out of the shower and...nothing. He used to come up tp me and start playing feely meely, and now that does not happen either. He just gives me a peck on the cheek,and goes on his merry way. In bed at night and in the am....just being close to me he would have been turned on. Now he avoids touching me in private areas unless we are actually going to have sex, which I ususally initiate. I've tried to initiate a couple of times this week but he wasn't biting. It's like I just don't turn him on anymore. He denies this, but the proof is in the pudding so tp speak. I told him how I felt about this last night in the hot tub-another place he always used to try and attack me sexually. We used the mirroring technique-I tell him something and he mirrors it back to me and then asks if there's more. So I brought up the sexual issue and told him that since he does not seem to want me sexually much anymore it really makles me wonder and makes me insecure about the OW. He just mirrored-he did not have to offer any explanations, and he didn't. Is this really normal? I mean this guy who couldn't get enough and complained all the time because I never wanted sex now does not seem interested! Taht was one of his main excuses fro the affair-that he did not feel wanted or desired. I could see how he would mistrust it for a time after we first got back together, but its been 5 months and I'm still the same-my new anti depressant does not lessen my libido the way the others did-he knows this. What am I suppose to make of that? T-bone said try not initiating sex for a week, but hen he recided because of how myH and I were getting along. That was last week. Over the weekend we had sex 3 times but it was my initiation because we were getting along really good and the weekends we have more time-although when he first came home we were at it almost every night and morning. Now-it's just not there for him and I'm wondering what is going on-why this change? One cannot help but think it has something to do with the OW although last night was the first time I voiced my concern about that. What should I do? Leave him alone? I have not been acting moppy about it, I just back off when I see he's not interested and the last few nights I don't even try.He will just hold me and I leave him alone. He will sniggle with me but does not get turned on. I don't know what to think about all this, and don't know what to do. HAve any of you women experienced this and how long does it last? What did you do? Andy I posted this on yours because I now you have this problem with your W except she did not have an affair, just a low libido. That has never been the case for my H. I know...everyone says he feels so guilty, blah, blah , blah. I don't know if I buy that one since this is something that has just come on the last 3 weeks or so. I really can't help but wonder if he's talkig to her or seeing her and THAT is what he feels guilty about, because he swears he's not and if he's lying then he would most assuredly feel guilty and not want to be with both of us. That was something I asked him when I found out about the A. How could you? How could you be with both of us at the same time? Now I'm wondering....Rachael M.
What I’m gonna say applies to both of you, and from what I’ve seen and experienced, seems to be pretty universal.
When a man and a woman fall in love, and start having sex, it’s magical. It’s a bonding experience. Their souls become one. They transcend into another world.
But sooner or later, you have to go back to the real world. Life catches up with you, and for any number of reasons, someone (usually seems to be the woman) doesn’t feel it any more. Life gets in the way. Stress, fatigue, hormones… It doesn’t matter what the reason is, it just happens.
When this happens, the other still wants to go back to that wonderful place. It’s a slap in the face of epic proportions that the spouse doesn’t feel the same way. The sense of rejection is intense (see my post on Low Sexual Desire (Page 1))
The sexual experience becomes a stressor in the R instead of the bonding experience that it once was.
I have no personal experience on either side of an A, but it appears that in a lot of cases, it’s a desperate attempt to get back to “the place.”
Well, the success rate of getting there via an A is abysmal. Certainly in both of your cases, your Hs didn’t succeed or they wouldn’t be with you now.
But “the place” has been fowled by all of this.
I don’t believe your perspective Hs are in that place with someone else right now. If it can be cleaned up, they’d love to go there with you. But, they don’t see how to clean it up. (men are lousy at house cleaning, you should both know that.)
Andy-SO, if they don't know how to clean it up what do WE do? I won't say anything else to him about it in order to take the pressure off-although he was extra sweet to me this morning and when talking on the phone told me ILY ith more meanig than ususal. I think the sex he had with th OW was just that- SEX. HE obviously was still attractd to me in that it never stopped with us either. I did not know about the A, and could feel tht he was distant but he still wanted to be with me. I think it was a case of feeling guilty of being with both if us. DAH! I'm sure he told her he was not with me because I'm SURE as the world she asked. SO he was lying to her also.I let her know different in the one time I called her-she was not home, so I left her a nice little voice mail that I'm sure she did NOT appreciate and I'm sure she told my H about it although he never said anything about it. Ahhhh. Since coming back home H has been differnt in intiamcy in that he talks now during sex. He asks for what he wants, and asks me what I want. I tell him but I'm sure she was lewd about it and used dirty language which he has never done with me and he knows I won't with him. I don't mind the talking and asking-I think that is fine, I just wish he hadn't gotten it from her. But...if I can use it to my advantage, I see no problem with it. And if it brings him more pleasure that is fine too. He has never done anything sexually to offend me-except the A of course. He is very giving and loving. SO....do I keep initiating? I asked him if he wanted me to and he said yes, but his body is telling me something different. I could get him interested if I really wanted to but I don't want to force the issue, and make it look like I'm using it as a tool. He made that comment before-that I used sex as a tool. Well, it is a good way to make up. I think they see everything through affair colored glasses for awhile after the A is over. They are so confused about what they feel and what they don't feel and what they want, and what they dont want. Thus..the moving target syndrome. Does his not wanting sex make me insecure about the R-you bettcha. Because its out of character for him. Maybe not with what he's going through, but how do I know WHY he does not want it? It could be for so many different reasons. I think it bothers him and he has hurt his back and I think he wants me to beleive that's why he is not interested right now. I'm not stupid. This was happenening before he hurt his back, and besides that NEVER stopped him before! He knows it hurts my feelings-I told him-He knows it makes me wonder what is going on- I told him that too. I don't know why in the world I wouldn't. Its like the elephant in the living room for pity sake. Not talking about it isn't going to make it go away. I think it matters a great deal HOW you talk about it. I did it lovingly and like I was concerned because I am! Maybe it will make him think about it whereas before he would have shoved it aside. WE'll see-its been 5 days-that's a LONG time for him. He will have to be the one to initiate though this weekend. I tried enough this week-subtly, but I tried and I don't like getting turned down much. Rachael M.
andy, my h used sex against me as a way to distance us when he started the first affair. he pushed me constantly for sex. then he complained he didn't get it enough. so i called his bluff and we had sex everyday. then he said i only did it to make him happy. so whatever, he wanted it to be a problem to justify his bad behavior. the last affair he felt so guilty he left after cheating one time and we didn't have sex until we got back together about 3 weeks after he broke it off with scuzzy. i do not have the same problem rachael is having in that our sex is better than ever. he is so apreciative to be back with me he nver pressures me any more and just tells me when he'd like to make love to me in very complementary ways. the ow was not attractive physically or personality wise. my h calls me every mans fantasy. so i have no complaints. h says it is so much better with me there is no comparison. so the only advice i could offer would be for rachael to take care of herself for now and be playful and sexual without too much pressure. i can say i drove my h nuts by putting things on the calender. he always was very interested in what i was up to despite not living here or wanting to be married. i think i will post to her now what i mean.lisa
The sexual stuff is getting better again. Its just like everything else with all this-you have to ride the waves. They come and go and everytime they come back in they stay longer-most of the time. I'm choosing to beleive my H about the bed. He told me last night that he would always be faithful to me. Of course it was inthe heat of intiamcy but I beleive he means it. Now, am know I will still have days when he is distant that I will question it all,but then I see howhe is acting and it is so much different than when he was in the A. HE was always so angry at me. Now he will reassure me whenver I need it adn I'm needing it less-I know I sound horrid on here,but my H does not see that side of me. If I ever ask hom anyting its ina very calm way and I think it our first and do the thing Michelle says to ask yourself, Will it bring me closer....ITs all in how you say things, and I know I can;t say as much as I'd like. I am very careful not to overdo. I wanted to bring the bed thing up again yesterday but I knew it was nott he thing to do. IT made me mad that that's how it has to be but nobody wants to be drilled about something over and over so I dropped it. We had a lovely evening out to dionner with our neighbors and he was ready fro me when he came in last night from helping our neighbor fix his tail light on his motorcycle. It was GREAT!!!!! You were right Andy-it will get better-it already is! A good sign huh? Rachael M.
Andy-I posted this to lily and wanted your take on it too. My SIL e-mailed me and told me that she just did not think things seemed right between Adrian and I. SHe was with us on Sunday at our house. I don't know why, but this really upset me. I e-mailed her back and said that we were both working on mkaing things better anf tht thesethigs take time. She did write me backand said that I was right, and that she probably shouldn't have siad that. It just had me feeling like sheis seeing something maybe I should be seeing. I mean I know we are not the happy couple of the year yet, but we have come along way since he had moved out and now has been back for almost 5 months. I know things aren;t as right as I'g like them to be either. He is not as effectionate as I'd like him to be,especially around other people, but he never really was.I've come to know that's just how he isn't. He is very close to his sister and she has always taken care of him. She and I get along ok, but that really bothered me. It's like oh my gosh are we really getting anywhere, REALLY, or are we just together and peoeple can tell it's just not right. I've had other people-well-one friend say that she thinks Adrian seems happier that he has in a long time, and she knows him very well. It just really upset me. What do you think?? Why would that upset me so much? It brought back the anxiety and insecurities as soon as I read it! Rachael M.
Your post from Tuesday was so positive. Then you let your SIL’s perception drag you down.
You have to remember that as in-tune as your SIL may be to your H’s moods, she isn’t a barometer of his happiness. Everything’s relative. She’s picking up on vibes. Like you said, you’re not the happy couple of the year yet. She’s simply picking up on that vibe and comparing it to the time when you were such an happy couple.
The important thing isn’t to compare your R to “the happy times.” The important thing is you’re on the road to new happy times. Look at how things were – even a month ago – and pat yourself (and your H) on the back for becoming such an happy couple (in comparison to then), and for your continued progress towards marital bilss.
