Am I Creating a SSM Part V

[heatherg]

Just wanted to show my support for you in a small way.

Thanks Lou. I read your thread as well.

Well there is no solution in there, nor is it helpful in any way shape or form. Have you considered using a DB coach heather?

I know. I've talked to a coach once. I actually paid for three sessions and have two left. But I'd have to pick just one thing to discuss because our situation is so multi faceted that even with going to counseling once a week, I still have new stuff to talk about every single time, lol. Knowing my situation, what would you say are the most critical issues in my R?
I know what my C said wasn't very positive or solution oriented. She was just giving me her opinion and she made that clear. She said that my H shows an unmeasured amount of self control (for instance with his drinking) and probably gets most of his sexual needs met with his pornography habit, so he will probably be able to apply the same amount of self control to shutting me out as long as it is still comfortable for him to do so (i.e. I'm still here, the kids are still here). At some point, you have to go with the odds, ya know? My H has displayed many of the same characteristics during our entire R and he shows no intention to change or even acknowledgement that anything needs to change. So then....where were we? Positive solution oriented, yes. Problem is, I just don't see it.

To me, his actions show the someone who was so hurt, he wants to prevent it from happening again.

Possibly. Either way I read it, I don't think a mistake on my judgment here will lead to a critical error on my part. Whatever his reasons are for acting the way he's acting, doesn't change the effect it has on me and the R.

I wonder what his perspective of who started the cycle and then he becomes evil is. Im sure it goes way back before the A. If he wanted a D dont you think he would file? If he didnt want to be married, why doesnt he kick you out? or move on? why does he plan vacations with you as a family, etc etc etc.

He says I hated him for years...because of his drinking. On a level, he is right, I did have hateful feelings toward him much of the time. And you know how hindsight is 20/20? I still think I should have left him then. I don't look back and say 'gosh I was so mean for no reason at all'. He was a very unmotivated guy who drank way too much, didn't help with much around the house at ALL, stayed up way too late, slept in way too late and played video games way too much. I worked, went to school (honor student the whole time, never received lower than a B-), was in a sorority, took care of the house chores, and made time for my friends and family. He was just in some other plane, always.

He doesn't leave me because he knows he won't get to see his kids every day. Our kids define him. He is a Dad. Beyond that, I don't think H knows what to do with himself and as long as he is totally enmeshed with the kids, S5 in particular, he doesn't have to figure it out. AND he gets to act self righteous about it at the same time because he's such a great Dad.

He probably plans vacations with me because I pay for them, lol. No really, I know he values the family unit if only for the sake of the kids. He values my input to the family.

Oh, and he already tried to kick me out once. I came back.

no one here thinks you should seek nothing in return.

I guess that comment came from my guilt over not being able to love H without the expectation that he should love me back. Is that proof that I am selfish? Do some people really live their lives loving someone who doesn't appear to love them back? My H hasn't told me he loves me in two years and the few times he's been asked, he says he doesn't know. I can't tell if I'm supposed to live up to higher standards and hold myself to some greater purpose or if I have a right to expect to be loved back.....it's in my selfish nature to expect I should be loved back without too long of an intermission.

Also, Corri's comments to me way back about dropping the sense of entitlement and losing my expectations. I don't seem to be able to do that. If I stay and try, I expect to see that my M is working. Every night I go to sleep on the couch is a huge jab in the ribs that tells me it *isn't* working.

Im not even gonna bother touching the porn issue.

It really helps me get to a mental place where I feel better about leaving. It hurts me that much....I'll never, ever forget him telling me that he likes to look at beautiful women. I can't remember the last time my H told me I was beautiful. Several of the sites I found, you choose 'models'. You pick the girls. It takes my breath away to know this. I just wanted to know how much....how big of a habit is it? Also, I was concerned about things like, how young does he go? I need to know some of this stuff. I know it sucks the love bank dry. I want it to.

Im really really hyper critical of self. no this in not a revelation, but I never thought of it as being detrimental, to myself or to my SO.

I think when we are too critical of ourselves, we assume that everyone else is just as critical of us. We create pressure on ourselves, but perceive it as coming from others.

I would be prouder of myself if I had just gone and filed, rather then whipping her, every time she tried to make contact, with my P/A tactics.

I would have had more respect for H as well if he had done this. I also think that I would have more respect for myself if I do it rather than stay on the fence because I can't tolerate the way he treats me but can't tolerate leaving either. I can't change the way he treats me, but I can sure as hell leave. That makes me feel like I should empower myself where I can and it is hard to respect anything less.

Your not doing what it takes, (committing) and not willing to end it either.

You're right. I won't do what it will take.....the things that H is claiming is proof of my lack of commitment is crap. He tries to make me accountable for things I can't even control....for example, he has the password to my email account. But how does he know I don't have others? I can't go to dinner or a movie with a friend because how does he know that's where I am? I give him permission to follow me and he tells me he doesn't want to be that kind of person. He makes me feel like an idiot for even suggesting that he get the kids together and follow me. Well, where does that leave us then?? I'm not willing to say that I'll always limit my freedom like that....I'm not willing to agree that refusing to limit my freedom like that proves my lack of commitment. If he can't see my commitment, what good is it?

Cobra, even if I leave, I will probably still harbor some anger somewhere inside because things didn't have to be like this. If he would just work with me instead of against me, we could make this M a beautiful thing. His refusal to work with me while at the same time blaming me for 'doing this to the kids' will probably always, at the very least, give me long pause.

Because I've been with H since I was 17, he practically is my FOO. I'm not one to keep grudges....when a behavior goes away, I don't see myself as the kind of person that keeps bringing it up, etc. I am forgiving and empathetic by nature. I believe in people, I trust people. I almost always give the benefit of the doubt. I know I had a lonely childhood, but what bothers me the most is how I acted during my teenage years. I was looking for intimacy from males, but didn't know how to connect. One night stands are a big part of my teenage history. Then I met H. He swung in the complete opposite direction of a one night stand, wanting a say in every single thing I did. If a one night stand wasn't love (and I knew it wasn't), then the R with my H must be it right?
I don't deny that I have regrets about my childhood, but they are just regrets. I'm not angry about it. My sister is and I can easily recognize it in her, but her and my older brother had an even more difficult childhood than I did by far. I have trouble understanding her anger....she is 42 years old....I've had trouble relating to how she feels.
H and I simply got together when we were far too young and I was not a healthy individual nor was he.
I don't think my parents have a whole lot to do with this. I fully expect that while I would be so very, very sad at the implications of a separation, my anger would resolve itself. UNLESS H played power trips regarding the kids. That could definitely affect my ability to process my anger toward him.

You have been posting on this board for a long time, but now that I think about it, I’m not really sure what you two have done to move forward since you stopped seeing the MC.

Well, we had our Memorial Day weekend trip. It was awesome, we had a great time. I asked for what I wanted and he complied (slept in the same bed as me), we had great sex. Then when we got home H brought us back to the same issues by refusing my request to allow me to sleep in our bed. He said he wasn't ready, he used all the things I've 'done' as proof of my lack of commitment, etc. As long as he relates everything I do that he doesn't like as a reason that I shouldn't be allowed to sleep in my bed, he'll always be able to justify it. He insists that I'm not sorry and not committed and in my heart I know that I *am* sorry and that I have tried very hard to commit (although I also admit I frustrate easily...but I've kept trying). So, I know what he says isn't true and if he hasn't seen that in me, then I know the likelihood of him ever 'seeing' it is probably slim. UNLESS I can tell myself I'll do whatever he wants (because that IS what it would take) in order to save our M....and I won't tell myself that. I am a grown woman....I don't want to go back to where I was at 17, feeling too scared to do the wrong thing, say the wrong thing, wear the wrong thing or else H will be upset with me or not want to be with me anymore (not physically but emotionally, I know he won't leave physically b/c of the kids). I refuse to go back in time like that.

Either you or he will pull yourself up and make the decision to grow or one of you will get so sick of the situation that you will bolt. I’d go for the first choice.

I think a decision to leave could be a decision to grow.
Not the direction I planned to grow in when I got married, but growth in the manner of accepting my circumstances and respecting myself enough to stop subjecting myself to treatment that makes me feel like I'm not good enough, like if I just did or said the right thing I could make everything better even though I know I've tried to do and say everything I could think of that describes how I feel and who I am. Leaving would be giving myself permission to believe that I deserve to be loved in spite of my mistake. Finding love is not on my agenda, but living without someone who purposely withholds it from me *is* on my agenda.
Leaving is not what I want, but neither is the situation I have and I'm just not buying that I can change it all around if I do or say the right things....H has got to meet me in the middle and it seems like if he really wanted this M, he would be doing just that.
At some point, you have to give yourself permission to stop the madness don't you?