Muddle's Muddy Waters

[MuddleThrough]

That what she SAYS she wants RIGHT NOW.

Yeah, so how do I validate this without being condescending? I know feelings can and do change - they're not facts, but are relative to circumstances and actions. I think this is the only reason that we're all still here - the idea that feelings can and do change. What makes it so difficult for me is the idea that we are waiting for our WASs to realize this, and recognize that it's worth trying to do the right thing in an attempt to reclaim those feelings we once had, or to accept new, different feelings as right.

To me this is all about the fact that she still feels a certain amount of codependency towards you and by you still clinging to hope, it somehow obligates her to at least run a little slower, take a look back every now and then. Like you said, she will see what she wants to see.

Agreed - and she's not making much progress in attempting to rid her life of her dependancy. It's interesting to look at it now because if she's leaving me, then this needs to happen, but now that I'm in a different place, I'd rather not settle into a new relationship where my W is burdening me with her dependancy. It's almost like I'm looking for her to get her act together and get almost through the door and then decide to stay.

Again, same issues with my W though I don't really see how pulling back from "taking care" of her considering the sitch is treating her like a child. I see the opposite as true. Letting her be her own woman, and letting go enough so she feels 100% of the responsibility for her life is treating her like an adult.

Convoluted, I know, but it makes sense in some way. By her viewing my enabling/supporting her codependancy as me, the more whole person caring for a less whole person rather than as me, the whole person, choosing do do what was requested by another whole, complete person, she sees me as treating her like a child, or views me as her father (more accurate to me). So, by showing her that I have the power to stop assisting her, rather than she deciding that she doesn't want or need my care anymore, would be confirming that I have some power over her.

The bottom line is that your "treatment" of her should no longer be the issue if she is truly out of the R, right? Why should she care how you "treat" her or what you "allow" in terms of her life and decisions? If she is truly "detaching" from YOU, then why so much concern from her?

My point is that as long as she continues to give you credit/blame for things in her life, she is still IN your life. Someday she'll figure out that you no more control her, nor WANT to, than she controls you. THEN you can make some real progress.

This is my hope too - although it's such a huge leap of faith to think that my W will WANT to work through anything. I guess that's why we HAVE to invest in this for ourselves only, because we will be better people for having stuck this out and learned deeply about ourselves. In the end, that's what any relationship is about, self exploration.

I know my W is still invested in this R, I know she's fighting a really painful, difficult battle withing herself. It's interesting to see that although it seems like detachment is a common goal between us, she seems to be trying to utilize anger and resentment to justify breaking those bonds - which in some way reinforces them because there's still passion involved.

Interesting - I spoke with W a few minutes ago, asked her if she could investigate borrowing her mom's car to pick up our son from camp in the middle of July because I am going to a meeting out of town. Her reaction was "what if I'm away then?" meaning, what if I'm in Europe screwing your cousin then? - oh yeah, and then she said "See, your plans are always more important!".