Anyway, for what it's worth, here's my thoughts on the lack of ML in your M. First, under no circumstances should you "grope" your W's breasts during a massage (and before you get defensive, I'm not staying you're still using this tactic.) My H and I have always had a very good sex life but I always hated it when he'd give me a massage and then go for the goods. It made me feel like he was an over-sexed teenage boy and DID NOT put me in the mood.
Yes. This is exactly how my W feels. She's told me so. That's why the back rubs are NOT a window to sex anymore.
Quote: Much more successful was when he gave me full body massages and gently worked his way down my back towards . . . ahem, other areas. I would highly recommend getting some books on erotic massage. Then you can try out some of what you learn on your W. And tell her you've learned some new tricks.
I have done this too but here's the problem. Even before all this happened, my W KNEW the signs from me. If I had candles lit, or massage oils out, she knew I was going to "massage" her and it would end up in sex so if she didn't want sex, she'd just shut me down before even starting. She still does that, just long before the candles even come out. She "senses" what I am after and lets me know that the answer is no. Actually, I have some journaling to do and somehting to report that kinda goes along with all this.
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On the romance front, you need to take a really hard look at what your W appreciates most. Would she love to find out you've scrubbed (and I mean really scrubbed) the bathroom. Maybe she would love to wake up to a champagne breakfast in bed. Perhaps you could take a dance class or cooking class together. Or maybe you can leave her prizes that she can only win by learning something new about you, sharing something about herself or giving you a kiss (and the location of the kiss can change daily.)
Maybe I am just being dramatic, but it seems like my W doesn't appreciate much of anything these days that I do. I have done it all, and all without much "appreciation" from her. Now, I suppose the real issue may be in how she shows appreciation, which, if she does show it at all, is a way I don't understand.
Quote: Study your W to see what makes her tick and if you can't figure it out ASK her. It seems like you and your W are having the same problems as in the famous pina colada song where they go on a blind date and realize it's their spouse and say they never knew the other "liked pina coladas . . . and getting caught in the rain . . ."
I have studied my W more in the past few months than I have in the previous 10 years. I know more now, and less if that's possible.
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You should ask yourself (and ask your W) why it is you want to ML to her so badly. I could be wrong, but it isn't about sex at all. It's about being close to each other and being able to look into each others' eyes and knowing there is something special between the two of you that, regardless of an A, no one else will ever share and no one can ever take away.
I think you are spot on with this. I KNOW that's what I want.
Quote: At some point, not only do you need to tell your W that you've forgiven her and understand the role you played in her A, but you need to tell her it's OK for her to forgive herself. And don't forget that how your W feels about herself will weigh heavily in how she feels towards you.
Yes, and I know she has felt badly about herself for a long time...and still does. I have told her I forgive her and as for her forgiving herself, well, we haven't really gotten into that.
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That said, you are way too accessible to your W right now and she is able to take you for granted and get a little too comfortable. I don't envy the fine line you must walk between leaving a little distance and supporting her through her DUI. Maybe I've missed something, but do you ever go out and do things just for yourself that aren't work or family related?
Well, no, I do not do much that isn't family or work related but what I do that is work related is a LOT of time away from home and me being gone a lot was a BIG part of our issues before this. I have discussed many times before how GAL in the sense that I go out a lot would be a BIG more of the same for me and I don't want to do that.
Quote: I know you're frustrated, but I think it perhaps may be time for you to mix things up a little and be a little mysterious.
Maybe. I think mystery is not a strong suit of mine. I need to work on that.
I have more to post but not much time. Will check in later.
