John, Having been divorced over a year now, I know how bad you would like to get an apology or admission of guilt. I guess my question is ..What would that really solve? Yes, perhaps you would feel better and maybe vindicated. Kids would know that adults could admit there mistakes.
From the wifes point of view its not possible right now. Admit to your kids your wrong? What do they know? Sadly more then your wife gives them credit for. I hate to say this but perhaps you need to let wife and D work things out themselves and stop protecting them. Your D has some things to get off her chest with mom and holding it in for the better of all might just cause her to overload. Not only that if you keep stepping in the way, your wife will think you created this mess and now your trying to clean it up. I think you should tell your wife in the nicest possible way that your D has her own mind and she is mad at her and SHE needs to straighten out things with her. To leave you out of it. And for your D's sake, her anger is not misplaced and she needs an outlet. She also needs to know that in order to forgive her mother she should also forgive you for not seeing that mom was unhappy and steps should have been taken awhile ago to perhaps prevent all this from happening. Then maybe D will see that no one here is at fault. Your wife made a choice she has to live with and you are making one also to stay with her. Alot of patience, understanding and healing are in store here. My ex says she is still healing, a year later. Rondo.
Your points are well taken, Ron. I think that my daughter is expecting an admission of guilt or at least some signs that W and I are on a stable road to normalcy. My need for admission, on the other hand, is not as great and could certainly wait until all of our other issues are resolved. By that time it probably won’t make much difference.
I tried to explain to W that her D is angry and that they should sit and talk. I tried bringing them together but my D just clammed up. I’m trying to fix everything now and maybe I should just relax a little. Part of the problem is that W doesn’t think that my D is capable of understanding what happened and what emotions are involved. My D is very capable of understanding, and part of her anger, I think, is over the fact that mom isn’t giving her credit for understanding.
I have no problem taking my share of the blame for the state of affairs, but D is not angry with me.
Thanks again Ron, you are helping me to see my situation from a different perspective.
The latest curve ball was thrown at me this morning. When we woke up this morning, W informed me that she still doesn't love me and wants to move out into our upstairs apartment. This way she says that she will be close to the kids. She says there is no more OM and that she is just not comfortable living this way.
John, I think you need to just let W move upstairs and continue to give her space. I wouldn't question this move with her, just be agreeable. If you argue she is going to see this as control. Just be really nice to her when she is around(Concerned but not mushy)and eventually I think things will work themselves out on their own.
I think Ron is right. You probably need to let D and W work things out between them from now on out. I would step in if anything really hostile transpires, but otherwise I would let well enough alone.
Your D is at an age when they are very protective of their Daddies.
I think things will work themselves out. Now would be a good time for you to take up a hobby or find something else to do, to get your mind off things. You've been DBing pretty intensely for quite a while.
Well I fell off the wagon today and let loose with both barrels. She told me that she would try to work on the R when she came back. We have done nothing toward that end since.
I'm just really angry that all of the hairbrain decisions that she has been making over the past couple of months have had negative effects on everyone around her. I told her to calm down, deal with her depression and then make her decisions. She's just trying to make herself feel better at everyone else's expense. Enough is enough. It's time she see how she is hurting everyone else.
Well John, you had a backslide. Believe me I know how hard it is to be patient and its easy to give you advice now when I was the king of bugging my ex to realize what she was doing to me and the boys.
Try and put it behind you for now. Its sooo hard to do but you must take the idea that she is an adult and if you question what she is doing she will feel very put off. It took awhile after my ex moved out to get that attitude and I ended up divorced anyway but she is slowly coming towards me and I am very nervous about that. My goal has been to be interested somewhat in what she is doing. Not question anything that has to do with her life unless it directly affects the kids. Remember John. All the decisions she makes right now she has to deal with the rest of her life. If that means the kids dislike her or she lose's you forever, she has to live with that, not you. Just do the best thing you can for you and your kids. Also make consequences. If she wants to move into a seperate apt on the property, let her know that means your utility bills get bigger and you will expect her to pay you rent. Or if you can do it tell her you would rather she move back in with om. State it would be better for the kids and yourself. Only state yourself with no concern for her and wish her happiness. Open the cage door and let her fly. Why should you live with someone who does not love you? The problem I see right now is she knows that you love her and would bend over backwards for her. Stop, let her suffer even though it will hurt you to see it. My ex's life has gotten no better. She has put on pds and acts happy when I see her. As a matter of fact my ex LF told me after we broke up That I seemed to be handling it just fine. In some ways I was, in some I was not but the key here is to not let it show. Especiually with your wife. The more you show, the more she will run. Pursuit and distance. Somebody, I think it was Lucky posted a story about a gerbil. The more the guy chased it and paid attention to it, the more it ran. When he had practically forgot about it through very intense trying to it came to him. Be the best actor you can be. "whatever" is your buzz word. You have a chance I never had if you can forgive her infidelity.
Otherwise John. Call it quits. I hate to say that but trusting and healing after infidelity is very tough. Most people can't and no one would call you a failure if you couldn't. It may take a couple of years of becoming friends again for that to happen. Regards Ron
I knew all that! It’s just having the self-discipline to do it, that is the tough part.
When she came in tonight talking about evicting the tenant so that she could move in, I stopped her in her tracks and told her that I was not going to throw out my tenant. This is business. She offered to give me money for her car and health insurance since December and I still haven’t seen dime one. How could I trust her. I told her she could move out, but not in our house. (just short of telling her to go back to OM) How could I expect her to pay me rent. Besides, this is the core of our problem right now. She felt pressured, so instead of saying “John, I’m feeling pressured. Lay off a little.”, she said “John, I’m feeling pressured. I’m moving.” If she had asked me to lay off, I would have laid off. Just set the boundaries and TALK to me before your anger escalates into drastic actions.
I told her that before she makes any more life altering decisions, that she should try communicating with me. It might just work.. I said that I understand that she is depressed and has no feeling for me. I asked her to give her counseling a chance. My speech was met with silence, instead of an argument. That’s a good sign.
I asked her to wake me when she gets home from work tonight and we can talk about it a little more. I think that it worked, but I’ve been wrong before. I’m not ready to give up just yet.
John, I didn't realise that you had a tennant. That alters my advice. Of course you wouldn't ask them to move just so W could move upstairs.
As to getting angry with W, we have all been there. You wouldn't be human if you could suck it up all the time and not say anything. That would be pretty artificial anyway.
Are you sure you want an OR talk tonight? Good luck! rayanne
John: After a 3 month separation my H came home last month. Said he broke up with OW he was living with. I thught my prayers were answered. My situation was nearly identical to yours, just substitute H for W & S for D. H told me & kids he loved us & wanted to reconcile - I helped him move stuff from apt - he told me he felt nothing for any of it. Was withdrawn a bit & sad over breakup. Agreed to work it out in counselling. Was very loving with me, but paid little attention to kids. Did nothing to resolve bad feelings with S (19) who he had hurt badly (tried to take out RO on him with no good reason). I tried to get him to admit a few things, but he was not ready. He did not last a week - ran back to apt & OW 3 days before Christmas - we were crushed! I did nothing to cause this, nor could I stop him! You can't either. Try to be understanding & kind, but set boundaries. Seeing them flee again after thinking you had them back is extremely painful for the whole family, but my kids (like yours) feel we are better off without him for now - he is too depressed & it is stressful for kids. Don't know if that helps, but that is what happened here. Barb
I think that there are some similarities between our stories. I wasn’t too happy when W moved out of apartment w/ OM and back home because I knew that she hadn’t broken up w/ OM at the time. In other words, she really didn’t want to be home, a lawyer advised her that she would have custody issues if she didn’t move back. I was thrilled, however, when she came to us a couple of weeks later and said that she broke up w/ OM and wanted to try as a family again.
If she stays away from OM, continues with therapy, and I can muster up the strength for some more Dbing, there may be a chance for us. If she lets me know what my limits are, I will honor them. I was just so excited that she was back that I just tried too hard to make her feel welcomed. I am so anxious to resolve our issues even though I know in my heart that it is going to take time.
Her relationship w/ 12 yr old D is very strained and W is trying to blame me for turning the kids against her. I have stopped arguing with her over this issue. They were great friends before the abduction. I hope that they can fix their friendship.
When W told me this morning that she wanted to leave again, my stomach knotted. I think that I have it under control now.
Rayanne,
I don’t think that it will be an OR talk. I just want her to establish the boundaries so I know what the limits are. She did give me a kiss when she left for work tonight. Not a bad thing.
