Just poking my head in to say hi. I'm feeling really good, and the anticipated reversal has not occured. I sometimes feel like Chicken Little, thinking the sky is falling, but it's not. It's still up there.
W has been a sweet heart. Affection is increasing slowly ... I think she's testing the waters. I'm not sure how to respond, I guess Slowleee is the best medicine. I just hope she doesn't think I'm not interested in more than just affection, but I don't want to take more than she's willing to give. Just trying to learn the balance.
I'm not really looking for advice or help, just wanted to say hi and let you know I'm good.
Zebra, there is a reply from me to my "He keeps putting me in my place" that you were kind enough to reply to. Let me know what you think. take care, Lisa
The more I read your story, the more I felt as if I could have written it, save that you are still married. Methinks that they could have put themselves in a corner where they are afraid to really let go. Could they worry that if they let go of others in their lives that we may not really want them?
quote:Originally posted by inmyplace: Could they worry that if they let go of others in their lives that we may not really want them?
Hmmm. Interesting, as is the opposite... Maybe the impass they are struggling with resolving is partly what you say, the other side of the coin being that they are finally beginning to consider if the others in their in their lives will be as supportive and invigorating if they let go of us?
On of my W's formerly cute quotes was "I want it ALL". After the "bomb" is was more likely simply pathetic. Now it's becoming humorous again because she sees the irony of it. But I do see signs of her contemplating whether she will be as eagerly accepted by them after she ends it with me as she is while she merely threatens to end it with me... I see evidence of this by her backing way off from the SSW (she actually avoids them now). I see it particularly in a recent statement in Therapy that she's been advised by her friends to do everything she can to work out the marriage. That leads me to believe that she may think if she doesn't follow that advice, those friends will loose some respect for her.
Interestingly, I asked who those friends were, and she refused to answer. She said I would probably read into the list that any who weren't on it were against me and hold it against me. It still makes me wonder who all knows about our problems....
Still, I see it all as positive, it all shows that at least she's thinking, no longer just rushing headlong, pell mell into the abyss.
I'm feeling a little shakey today, maybe it's just the weather.
W is being a bit distant again. Kind of like what I used to call an "om hangover" when she had spent time with him and would come home being weird and distant. I don't know what's up this time.
She and her mother went away to a tennis camp for Mothers' Day weekend, along with a bunch of W's other women friends. I don't believe OM went since Mom was there, but who knows. Since they returned, she's been distant, as I said, like an "OM hangover". How she acts specifically is that she avoids being alone with me, won't talk to me unless it's in a group (like with D), goes to bed early and is "asleep" when I come to bed, not approachable at all. It's like living with a stranger who s cordial socially, but cold and closed to me personally. But, this can change in a second. I'm just feeling down about it now...
So, the feeling I get is that she's hiding something, or many things, if only feelings. She's always so very closed. Even the latest revelations about "recommitting to the marriage" were not made to me directly, but to the counselor. I've only vaguely referred to it once since (asking about who of her friends had counselled her to give it her best effort), and her response was that she didn't want to talk about it at all. I think I'm going to start trying to pull more out, by approaching her with a request to let me understand what she means by recommitting, and what she and I will be doing when that happens...
I guess the real issue I'm wrestling with is I see so many closed issues, so many secrets she has. It seems it used to be she'd just lie about everything, now she just doesn't talk about things. Secrets. Are secrets of this kind truly private issues, or are they lies by ommission? She used to lie all the time both by commision and by ommission which I knew from snooping. Since I don't snoop any more, I don't know if either is the case, so by labeling this as "secrets" am I just kidding myself? Are they still lies of ommission? Is the step from active lying to keeping secrets a positive or negative one? I suppose not knowing exactly what these secrets are is a big part of it... I suppose I need to make it safer for her to share them. I suppose that is where true intimacy begins. I just don't know how to start. Any ideas?
I think I am catching up with you. After confronting WAW about everything I know she has gotten very "closed" as well. I plan to back off big time now and let her take it all in. I noticed that "OM hangover" as well in the past. The sequence went something like this:
Asking me (telling me) if she could go out Getting upset if I wasn't excited about it Going and being very excited about it Coming home and being very close to me Followed by "but I am not comfortable with sex now" I would ask her questions I knew answers to She would be upset The guilt brought her to me in less than 3 hours and we would have several really good days.
Pure craziness isn't it.
How do you give them a safe haven? Don't know either. Have they earned a safe haven? I think that is the question. I am done approaching this as a husband (i.e. caring too much, expecting courtesy.) I am approaching this as the OM. Try to fill her time with great joint outings. Concerts, trips, dinners (maybe with other couples), parties, etc. A friend told me "She wants to go out? Take her out". Even when you are home: watch movies together, play a board game (maybe with other couples), etc. Sulking and depression aren't helping them or us. And if they insist on being depressed get the hell away from them. You go out and party up and tell her you had a good time but it could have been even better if you were there. I plan on keeping a full summer schedule with or without her. I used to be a tremendous flirt and that is harmless enough and great for PMA.
You have given me some great advice (I got it too late to use some of it), I hope this might help you.
Yep. I know exactly what you mean. Many times, what the former Mrs does is of wonder to me. Sometimes she says what she is doing; other times, no. She seems to be hiding stuff from me. The difference is that she isn't working under the guise of "fixing the marriage."
One thing is for sure. You are giving your best effort here. We can't control others. At the end of the day, all we can do is look ourselves in the mirror and know that we were true to ourselves.
Ah, you found me. And you are really catching on. I really like this idea, become the other man... I've heard that so many times, and truly, you say it with such confidence, that I believe you will!!! it is a goal to shoot toward.
Indeed, it does help me. We all have gotten so close to our own situations from time to time that we can't see the simplest things, even those things we suggest to others. Thank you for the wake up.
Become the OM... works for me. good idea there TBone.. (steakman) If smarmy sales guy thing works... go out buy a few new sales type shirts and wow her!! Or at least make her wonder.
My h still has his moments... not hangovers but certainly times when he distances. The key is not to walk on eggshells around it, but to do what you want to enjoy and live your life and let her figure out her own issues. If she can't ... well it's really not your issue is it??
More than a year later and we are still at it. No fat lady singing at either of our respective abodes. so far...
birthday this weekend. remember last year's blow out? Was gonna do same again but different year and with my mom gone,.. I will wait a bit...
caught up with you again for the short term - age wise that is!
Thought it time to post something. My ego wants my thread visible when I bring up the page...
I did a very scary thing last night. For me at least. I've been looking for ways to tell W how sorry I am for violating her trust by snooping, as a means to trying to rebuild trust and emotional intimacy. My snooping had mostly been by "stealing" passwords and hacking into email and Hotmail. The other was to monitor her cellphone records to see who she calls (OM). I did this by having access to her online cellphone invoice, which she didn't know. I got that by setting up the account for her in the first place. Cell phone was a Christmas gift from me. Later, at her insistance I converted it to her name, and she has the statements mailed to her office. I still had online access, tho.
I haven't snooped in any way for months. No surveillance since January, no internet stuff since February. In some ways, it makes me nuts not knowing, in many more it's peaceful. I only have to deal with my paranoia about OM contact, not face cold hard evidence. It's easier to keep a PMA that way, easier to not feel like a doormat. Anyway, I've been itching to look at her cellphone records. And then, I've been thinking I should just ask her to change the password. YIKES, that would require telling her I had access!!! I was terrified to do that.
Well, yesterday was the day the new cellphone invoices are posted on the web. I was twitchy all evening. I was making me nuts. She had gone to bed, and I was on the computer. Then she came downstairs. We talked a bit, and she noticed I was twitchy, and asked what was wrong, what I was up to.... and I came clean and told her of access and asked her to change it. I told her I had not checked up on her in anyway for months, and I didn't what to start again. No big deal one way or the other. It was calm, and I apologized for misleading her, and I said I had not snooped, and didn't want to and felt weak. I apologized for ever violating her trust, and told her I wanted to do everything I could to rebuild it.
We went to bed, and as I lay there I said "Good Night", and then the dreaded "I Love You". She doesn't respond to that, ever, but this time, she reached over, grabbed my hand on my chest, and held it till I went to sleep.
This morning she disabled the web access to her account. And we are fine. I'm shakey and nervous, but I feel good.
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