That sounds like pretty good news. I would really try to refrain from talking any more about your changes, even if she asks.
As for where things go from here, again, I hate to say this, but just like we can't believe them when they say there is NO WAY the marriage will ever work and the only solution is D, we can't just believe them when they say the A is over and they want to work on us.
The most important thing for you now is to make sure, absolutely sure, that you DO NOT just fall back into your old marriage habits again. Your old marriage did not work and is over. This new R with your W should look and feel much different, if only because YOU have grown in the meantime to understand what YOU need to do differently. Please, don't make the same mistake many others have made of thinking that just because she says she may be willing to work on things it's time for you to change what you are doing. It's not.
It's time for you to kick DB into high gear, making sure that you do NOT put any pressure on her and that you do NOT form any expectations from what you heard this morning. Expect nothing except from yourself. Let her have the time and space she needs to process this. She may indeed break things off with him, or she may not, but the seed is planted and it WILL grow if you give it time and most of all, nurture it with YOUR own growth and understanding of the process.
This IS a process. It is a process of discovering that in you that will make you the best man you can be and then WANTING to be that man enough to do it in front of your W. For your W, she is now just starting to see something positive and needs time to believe that it is real and not just something you are doing to win her back, which is why it's SO important for you to keep on your track and not fall back into codependent behaviours because she's "back" now.
I think you did really well and from the sound of it, I think you have good reason to be happy today. This COULD be a major turn, just make sure you LET it happen and don't try to pull her the rest of the way towards you.
first of grasshopper i want to thank you for all your advice, if your not a counsler you should be. in one day you taught me more than a lot of high paying counslers have. i know your right about not falling back into the old me, i wont because it didnt work for us. i am reluctant on the news she told me today. i hope its real and she does what she says she is going to do. i will focus on me and let her focus on herself, hopefully that will make a differnce. she did open up to me last she told me that she didnt think she would be good enough for me anymore, i told her i have to make that decision not her. she also said she was afraid that if she came back i would change my mind and end it with her. i told her she has a right for that fear, that i understand why she fears that, but in my heart if we both put 100% effort into it that i would not change my mind. its soo hard, but im up to the chalenge. thanks again
You're welcome, and thank you so much for the compliments. I am glad I can help.
No, I am not a counselor but I did play one in college for a little while. I studied psychology for a couple years before deciding that being a photographer was more my idea of a good career and haven't looked back since. As you may have seen on the other thread where I am somewhat debating with another poster on what the best course of action is for someone, I only post what I believe to work for ME and hope it works for someone else. I have read a lot, true, and I can communicate pretty well, but I am still just another person going through this stuff, just like you. I have just been doing it for a bit longer is all.
This is NOT false modesty and please don't make the mistake of thinking my advice in any way is a substitute for seeing a real C, live and in living color. My own C was instrumental in my process, even though I had GREAT people here posting to me daily.
Now, on to you...
Quote: i am reluctant on the news she told me today. i hope its real and she does what she says she is going to do. i will focus on me and let her focus on herself, hopefully that will make a differnce.
Good. You are right to suspect that this "opening up" may be tainted but in the end, as you state later, she DID open up to you somewhat and that is a VERY good thing because as much as it's hard for us to trust the WAS, the WAS has an equally hard time trusting US. She has different reasons for mis-trusting you, which you also post later, but they are just as powerful as yours are for not trusting her. So when she opens up to you, understand that no matter what she says, it's a good thing because she is trusting you to validate her and not make her feel bad for her FEELINGS. Her actions are another story.
Quote: she did open up to me last she told me that she didnt think she would be good enough for me anymore, i told her i have to make that decision not her.
Not bad. She will eventually need to forgiver herself as much as you need to forgive her. I would maybe make sure that you let her know that she IS good enough for you, that she just made some bad decisions and now there are just things, in addition to the pre-existing issues in your M, that you will need to work on. I don't suggest you actually SAY that much to her, but I don't really think YOU think she is not good enough for you so make sure she knows that next time you get the chance to talk..DO NOT INITIATE a conversation to tell her that though. Leave it for now, I think you did fine.
Quote: she also said she was afraid that if she came back i would change my mind and end it with her. i told her she has a right for that fear, that i understand why she fears that, but in my heart if we both put 100% effort into it that i would not change my mind.
This is pretty standard WAS stuff. I LOVE that you validated her fear and didn't argue with her. The only SLIGHT modification I may have made in what you said was to leave her "effort" out of it. You could have just said that you were not going to change your mind but you could not control what she did. That is REALLY splitting hairs and I think you did a REALLY good job handling that.
Quote: its soo hard, but im up to the chalenge.
My hope is that someday you will get to where I, and many others here have gotten, which is to that moment where you realize that as hard as this is, as uncertain as things will still be with your marriage, you wouldn't take all the pain and turmoil back because at that point, you'll realize that it is all for a reason, and that reason is to make YOUR life MUCH better than it was before, and with any luck at all, your MARRIAGE much better too.
well how long does it take to end it with om. w says she did that last night, but it took over 4 hrs to do. i hope she did but wonder why so it took so long? any thoughts?
How long would it take her to end things with you? She's been trying right? How long has it been?
My point is that no matter how bad it hurts you to think this way, she may have/may still love him, and him her. Breaking such things off is NEVER easy, nor is it particularly clean. I highly doubt that this is the true end of things but it IS a good thing and I think you need to recognize it as such.
just you saying that it might not have been a clean break still hurts me. because i know your probably right. she told me it was hard for her because he was such a good friend. YEA RIGHT! but she knew it started for the wrong reasons. she didnt talk much last night, was very depressed. but she did tell me it was over with him, i somewhat believe her because how depressed she sounded on the phone. but the bottom line she is still working at the same place they met, so i know its not a clean break, never seeing each other again. she insists that he was more of a friend then any thing else. again how do i know for sure. i should be happy about this, but im still messed up, gut still hurts, not hungry at all, and still can not sleep. every time i start to think this nightmare is comming to an end my mind messes me up again. but im going to continue what i have been doing because that does make me feel better. just showing my depression in here not too her.
how do i get over this dead space between us? i should be happy about the steps w has taken, but i still feel sick inside. i told myself if she would just try i would wait for ever how long it takes for her to come home. last night i mowed her yard and took her out to her favorite resturant. had a good time. she then called me later and wanted to walk. we took a long walk and had good conversation. but i still want more. she is still stand offish, not much at all. i guess if she was a little loving i would feel better. is this the first steps to recovery and i just have to live with that? is this what everyone has to go thru?
This is NO time to get greedy. We ALL want more. I have been doing this a lot longer, in a similar state of "limbo" and I am still here. It DOES suck but you HAVE to realize that this will take time, often at least one more minute, hour, day, week, than you think you can handle, but I am here to tell you that you CAN and WILL handle it.
Quote: how do i get over this dead space between us?
You don't "get over it", you accept it as the situation at hand and deal with it. It will NOT be forever. You will either grow closer again, or farther apart but this period of limbo is NOT permanent.
Quote: i told myself if she would just try i would wait for ever how long it takes for her to come home.
She IS trying but her trying and your idea of what she should look like if she was trying are two different things. Her ACTIONS, namely having anything to do with you in a "dating" context show she IS trying. You just want her to TELL you she's trying and DO more to SHOW you she is. Frankly, you just WANT more from her and are failing to recognize the significance of what she is already doing and how hard it probably is for her.
I don't really like this idea but my W has said to me on a couple occasions when I expressed similar impatience with her/the process "You know, a couple months ago I was already out the door, sure that our marriage was over. I was gone and now I am here, isn't that good enough for you right now? I need time to get back to "more" than that, plese understand that."
Your W KNOWS what you want, and I submit that there may be issues (I know I have intimacy issues to address) you may need to address to "spark" things, but for now, please accept the unspoken truth that she IS trying and likely needs more time.
Quote: last night i mowed her yard and took her out to her favorite resturant. had a good time.
GREAT. I wish my W would do more of this with me. You are lucky. It's the small, daily life things, that I believe make the most difference. Give it time. More of this, light hearted, "fun" stuff you do with her, the more trusting she may become that your R will not be consumed by R talks and fretting over the past.
Quote: she then called me later and wanted to walk. we took a long walk and had good conversation. but i still want more.
Too damn bad. She IS ENJOYING your company right now. That is HUGE! Please, don't rush this. She took a long time to leave, and she'll take more time to come back. Please recognize what is making her comfortable right now and don't push for more. You'll know when the time is right for that.
Quote: she is still stand offish, not much at all. i guess if she was a little loving i would feel better. is this the first steps to recovery and i just have to live with that? is this what everyone has to go thru?
As Scotty would say "She's giving you all she's got". She probably doesn't have any "loving", beyond the simple effort of being there with you, to give right now. Many WAS's claim to feel empty and unable to "give" when they return to the R with their LBS. They just need time to adjust to having gone where they did and now come back to a VERY uncertain place, fraught with peril in their mind, i.e. will he leave ME, will I not "feel the spark" again, will OM call, I am not worthy of him, he is not worthy of ME, etc, etc, etc.
The more "safe" you make her feel by not pushing and continuing your DB efforts, I think the better off you'll be.
And, yes, we ALL have to go through this. It's just the next step. It's called limbo for a reason and when I first got here (I'm still in limbo), I said it was the worst part yet because so much was SO close but yet still just out of reach. Before, you couldn't even see the "love" let alone feel it. Now you can remember what it's like and you even think you feel it sometimes when you're with her but in an instant, she takes it away.
I submit that she doesn't take anything away, YOU just fell victim to your own expectations.
As I have been told many times, have a beginners mind, i.e. don't pretend to KNOW anything, and have NO expectations.
Enjoy what she is willing to give and accept that you WILL have to wait for more.
you know, i understand what you are saying, and by reading other threads i do feel lucky that my r is where it is at. but i cant help be feel like i do. its starting to build up resentment towards her. i feel im getting more angry now then when i found out about her a. because it does seem like we so close and i can touch it but cant take it. i feel like a kid in a candy store without any money. i can look but thats it. thats pretty hard to swallow. its makes me more and more angry that i have no more say so in this r other then if i want to end it.(which i still dont at this time) i feel like she done the most damage to the r and im the only one willing to undo that. i guess i feel like she should be doing more to save this. how can you save something when i feel she is only going at it half **S. i know im just venting and probably pissing you off with my attitude, but man i am angry!!!
No, you are NOT pissing me off at all. You are doing a GREAT job of venting HERE and not THERE, which is a good thing.
Look, your feelings are NORMAL. We all feel that resentment when things start to get better. Its natural. You have TIME to think about other things now and that includes what YOU want.
Just understand that your feelings of "not knowing" what you want are likely as temporary as hers are. Just give this stuff time, please.
