I think a lot of my comments are slipping through your fingers….
More than that though, I think that the R H and I had when we first got together is why I would be so independent now. I feel like I was taken advantage of by somebody who was supposed to care about me.
Did your H have a relationship with your sister? Did he somehow manage to affect her too so that you both have this “fiercely competitive and independent” spirit? That seems unlikely, so I think the common link probably predates your H.
I know what we had wasn't love and it only makes me doubt everything we've ever had. The fact that H can't acknowledge this only solidifies my fear that he would go straight back to that kind of R if only I would let it happen.
I can understand this fear, but what does it have to do with your H? The only way you can go back to “that kind of R” is if you let it. If you fear this happening, then you fear yourself. And this is not dependent on whether he acknowledges anything. Can you see how your statement sidesteps your responsibility?
I can't trust his motives.....I don't think H and share the same views about what a healthy R is.
This may be true at this point in time, but your idea of what a healthy R should be is not the same as what it was a month ago. Why can’t your H change his ideas too? This is fatalistic thinking… You don’t have to believe he will change, just don’t commit yourself to the idea that he won’t.
I can't tell if you're just wishing to share some of your experience here or if you are saying that I am a 'crusader'.
I mentioned my wife as an example to you. I do think you are a “crusader” of sorts, not for the cause of others, but for the cause of your own esteem, your own ego. Didn’t you say your ego was one of your biggest obstacles (not your sense of shame that I was talking about at the time)?
Other than that, I'm just concerned about me...I'm not willing to let H break my spirit again.
Yes, but you keep coming back to these types of comments. Are you trying to convince me or you? I don’t matter, but you do. You should not have to convince yourself that you are strong and confident (which creates those thoughts that you are not). Just know that you are strong and confident, as Lil prescribes in her recent messages.
I think you're exactly right, only it's not my FOO. It's my very young history with H. I need some closure, some acknowledgement, some form of recognition from him. Not so I can see him repent, but that so I know he recognizes what he did to me. If he doesn't recognize it, how can I trust him to never try to take me back there? I can't.
I think you need to keep reading Schnarch, if you haven’t done so. Your statement implies that you need your H to become a certain way, so that (in the hugging till relaxed analogy) you will have a trusting partner on whom you can lean. I thought the purpose was not to lean on anyone, rather to balance on your own two feet.
You also seem to have a thread of vengeance running in your comments. I know you have a strong sense of justice, and that he has done you wrong and so must pay. Any injustice can set your blood to boil, it triggers the “crusader” or “warrior chick” in you. But understand that every time you feel that anger, you are really reacting to something from your FOO. Sure, your H could be responsible for setting this response in you, but more likely were your parents.
Why don’t you take the time to elaborate a little on your family. What kind of marriage did your parents have? Was your dad the drinker, shouting and yelling with mom trying to smooth things over and keep up appearances? Was there ever a happy time in your childhood or do you generally have dark memories of your youth?
It seems like living my life as I see fit exacerbates his behavior. Taking karate, accepting a business dinner invitiation.
No, I don’t think any of this exacerbates his behavior, in and of itself. It is how you go about doing these things that threatens him. There are secure happy couples in which each person does a lot more independent stuff than what you describe without a hint of jealousy or insecurity. All the reinforcing and affirmation that goes on during other times allows the spouse to not worry. You and your H are not doing this. There is no build-up in the love bank so a small thing like attending TKD is a threat.
Your H is constantly in the “red zone” so trying to appease him when you GAL is fruitless. He needs to feel secure beforehand, before he enters the “red zone.” Softening yourself will help. Not getting angry and thinking about revenge or the need for his acknowledgement will help.
I've talked about these things several times...these are the things that bother him.
No, what bothers him is fear of having lost you. Those “things” are only confirmations in his mind that this is so. By what you have said on this board, I think he has the right impression. In regard to your commitment, I think he has a very accurate view of you.
I'm not willing to let him decide everything I do in my life, so it looks like I will either continue exacerbating his behavior or he will recognize my free will for what it is and not as a demonstration against him or a sign of my lack of commitment.
I agree with this logic…. once you two are healthy and secure enough to tolerate it. For now, it is only escalation to him. Everyone here has been saying to re-enmesh. Do this on a temporary basis for the sole purpose of defuse his anger and letting him lower his shields. For sake of argument, if you were to let him “control” you, just what terrible thing do you think he would do?
I meant perceived by the person who's trying to be authoritative.
This is irrelevant. Do you pay attention to some looney who is trying to convince you to prepare for the coming of aliens or something? Do you pay attention to someone who is trying to convince you that you are really a male?
One should not have to resort to belittling, condescension or other power plays in order to be get the recognition they feel is warranted. If you don't get the recognition you think you deserve, then apparently you don't have as much authority with the person as you thought you did.
True. So ignore them. Why do they make you mad?
Our reasons are different for choosing to believe vs not believe. I don't like to get into lengthy discussions on this either way.
I agree, no need to get into a religious discussion, but the leap of faith is critically important to relationships. If you do not have the ability to trust your H, he will know it and it will be a barrier to your marriage. You’re not quite there yet, so this may be premature, as long as you are not telegraphing you negativity.
Just like my view on my R with H, I take the same view here. I'll try my hardest to be a good person. If it's not good enough, well I guess I'll just have to live with the consequences.
This statement is in the same spirit as your above statement – it is sidestepping your responsibility and assuming a martyr-like position. Your H does this enough for the both of you. Try to stay out of it.
Maybe it would help if you thought of your H as a mentally sick person (which he is) and is actually a victim of his FOO (as you are). Think of him as someone who is shell-shocked, suffering from post traumatic stress disorder, or something like this. He is damaged goods and really deserves sympathy. Would that you help see him in a different light and allow you to better hover above the chessboard?
Again, I’d like to suggest discussing your FOO more. I really think there is a lot holding you back there. Sooooo much repressed anger, not just toward your H but toward life in general.
