I know that many of you have read the dialog between Joanne and me. IF you have reactions, thoughts, questions, responses, here is a place for you to post them.
I am just thrilled that Joanne and her husband are feeling better about each other and they are committed to working things out. That's great news.
Hi Michele - I have been following along on Joanne's thread. I think it's wonderful that Joanne has "opened" up her situation to us so that we may learn from/with her. Thanks Michele for taking the time, you are special! I am going to print it so that I may break down my goals more clearly and effectively.
To Joanne and H: Congratulations to you both for continuing to recognize that your marriage has the chance to survive and for putting forth the effort to do so. The two of you have been through a tremendous loss and I again extend my deepest sympathies to you.
I wish you continued success in your marriage and hope to work along side of you to save my own.
Had it not been for this bb, I know I would not be where I am right now.
Thank you for your kind words Chelsea. Like you I wouldn't be where I am without this BB and Michele. She put me through a wonderful exercise in thought process agility and truly opened my eyes to action oriented goals and thinking. She truly is a very special person with such profound caring and interest in communicating the way to happiness in ourselves and our relationships.
One of the most important things I've learned is that rigid thinking is so narrow and non-productive. To detach from strong emotions is to open your mind to all possibilities, both for yourself and others. Life is about learning and growing and being happy. It doesn't seem like a tall order, until you get right down to it.
Here's hoping we all do better at opening up ourselves to ourselves and making those connections we all want with our significat others.
Well unfortunately my journey has been very long and for along time so frustrating.
Joanne: You have gotten what you deserve, your husband is awake and wants to work through things with you,but some of us on this board haven't gotten YET what we deserve, so we have to keep searching. Give your an almighty hug for facing his issues and working on your marriage. AND from me to you a big hug for also facing your issues.
Chelsea, Joanne is an inspiration for both of us but I am sure one day will be our moment, just have to keep dbusting and working on our selves LOL
Michele: Well what can I say, your a woman in a million but you already know that.
Your thread with Joanne was a great help, it came at the right time for me, I needed some help setting some goals and as you have seen on my other post I've started to work on meeting them.
I faced my fears but its hard not to look back and go back for the crumbs, but I know I owe to myself not to settle for anything less than I deserve. You taught me this!!!
Michele, is it true that however, much I dbust my h would still have his anger from his past seeping out wouldn't he??
Thanks to Michele. Three cheers, hip hip hooray!!!
In the Michele helps Joanne post, Joanne says she'd like her H to bring up talk about their relationship. You, Michele, say, don't hold your breath, men don't like to talk about relationships, a better goal is to act in a way that will persuade him to engage in the conversation when you talk about your relationship. Other places I'm reading to avoid OR conversation all together. There is absolutely no doubt that personally, I need to decrease OR talk significantly, but cut it out all together???? It is one of the things that helps me feel close to my H when he is willing to talk this way (he does not initiate conversations like this and most of the time is mighty tough to engage in this type of conversation). Please help me understand.
Dear alottolearn, I think I may have answered you elsewhere on this board, but I want to clarify something here.
I didn't say Joanne shouldn't have OR conversations, I said she shouldn't sit around expecting her husband to initiate them. There's a big difference.
Secondly, Joanne differs from many who visit here in that her husband wants to stay married. He's invested in their relationship. I suggest that visitors stop haivng OR talks when their spouses are half way out the door. Then, OR talks are almost always destructive and hurtful and the leaving spouse feels pressured. Don't ask questions if the responses are going to be negative- is the rule of thumb. Hope this helps. Michele
Hi Chelsea, thanks for your enquiry and kind words and sorry it has taken me so long to reply.
I'd like to say things are going great but this past week I have found my frustration and critisim have started flowing again. Attitudes and behaviour seem to have been reverting backwards and my intolerance is showing. Basically he says he loves me but doesn't put it into action. Things have been very busy and tiring, we've been moving house and dealing with all the things to be sorted in the new one. But OR has been shoved on the back burner and everything else takes precedence. That leaves me feeling very unloved and unimportant.
Last night was a prime example. I won't mention the lots of things that went on to really make me angry but we were supposed to be going out. We haven't been out in ages and I was, and assume he was, looking forward to it. However there were other things that had to be done that night as well. The upshot was that he gave them priority and it became too late for us to go out. He got everything done that he wanted to do and took as long as he wanted over them all and I ended up the loser. As far as I'm concerned, he should have thought about it, sorted out the timings and made sure that our night out happened. And he has not a clue as to why I'm upset and ticked off about it all. All I get is a question, "why are you ticked off?"
It wears me down that he cannot do the thinking for himself. The whole evening could have been done differently with everything getting done and everyone happy and I really don't think I should have to point that out to him. It didn't come under discussion, we just did everything his way.
We really needed that night out as he left today and will only be home for about 8 days split into two lots over the next two months.
He wants to stay married, he loves me but he thins everything should be fine without any effort in any direction as far as our relationship is concerned. When I ask him how he's changed I get a list of negatives, I don't do this any more or I don't do that any more. And he thinks that should make a huge difference. His litmus test for things being good between us is that we don't fight any more. I find it very difficult to see where the progress is in that, it's simply a status quo.
He stared off quite well, was reading DB and realising that if he dealt with people differently, it had a different outcome and a more pleasing outcome for all concerned. He tried it out at work and was quite amazed at the result. However, it didn't translate back to us and he soon became distracted with all the other things going on in his life and our life and just didn't bother to do any mroe thinking or put in any more effort.
Right now I'm feeling very fed up and very tired of hauling him back on track. He wouldn't dream of treating his job or the people he works with this way, so why is he doing it to me and to us. How can he love me and treat me and us with such indifference.
All his controlling behaviour is back all his denial about his own behaviour is back. Quite frankly, I don't know what to do next. He obviously didn't take the soul searching on board, he isn't putting in the effort to be the person that makes him happy. He doesn't love himself therefore he doesn't know how to love me. He takes it all from me but doesn't give it back. I've said all this before and this far down the line, here I am saying it all again.
His idea of letting go of the past is forgetting any of it every happened and carrying on as usual, no real changes required. I don't want to drop a brick on his head, more like a mountain.
Sorry for moaning, but my mood is not good tonight and PMA is in hibernation.
Hi Joanne, Thank you for responding. I understand your disappointment. I'm sorry this is happening.
From my own experience and from lots others here, the first time trying is not always successful, but a time for ironing out the bugs.
As for what YOU should do next, I wish I had the advice. Frankly, it sucks pulling the relationship wagon yourself while he rides. This I know all too well.
Hang in there. The answers will come to you. You are a smart woman with great knowledge and understanding. Sending you some PMA and a great big {{{{{hug}}}}}}}.
