Amy, I know this is a little strange, but I tried to read those threads and it seems like I am looking in on a private conversation. I did go back and try to get some history. Is there any way you can catch me up on the finer points of JSD's sitch so that I may be able to pick up from here?
"We have shared our stiches before. Things got better, than I pushed recommitment and she ran upstairs. She says she need her space and time to figure things out. She is tired of counseling and is still very angry with me. I keep pushing her buttons by not respecting her boundaries.
She keeps pushing my buttons by threatening divorce and leaving. I keep trying harder. I am really like you at my wits end. I would rather get a divorce than keep livinbg like this. The only reason I am still trying is for the kids.
i try to DB, but I don't have the self-control. My mother, the therapist (really), says that I may be subconsciously sabotaging the marriage. Sound familiar. Then we can blame her.
We have agreed to space, no heat emotioanl realtionship talks for one month. She will live upstairs. I will live downstairs. We will be friendly and can go on dates. We can interact as friends. She is still wearing her wedding ring, kissing me and saying "ILY". "
Okay so we talked to him about pulling back some and he is trying to do that. He is feeling that that is not working because she is withdrawing now. I tried to tell him that's good thing and it is to be expected. She needs to see herself without him since that's how she's suggesting it'll be...
He has a tendency to be controlling and a personal observation from me is that he is unable to hold his tongue for long...IMO he will require a VERY detailed step by step plan. He is a bit high strung. A high achiever.
One seemingly small question he asked today is whether or not to get her an Easter gift. I think Frank_D handled that one though.
Can you go from that info?.....I encountered him through Shark so I don't know about his very first posts.
Thanks Grasshopper!
And GOOD LUCK!!!
Shark's threads tend to run at the speed of light so buckle up.
This is not going to be long. Not much happening. I carried my W "like a baby" upstairs at the boy's bedtime much to their amusment...and my W's last night. Good laugh had by all. That was NOT planned but is a good representation of my effort to be more physical (in a positive way) with my W.
This weekend WAS going to be good because it was one of the last free weekends I have for awhile and we were just going to bump around for a bit, shop some and then on Sunday, do the Easter thing with another family. THEN my parents called and asked if they could visit tomorrow after saying they weren't comming for Easter.
It kinda sucks because even though I love my parents, it will now be a stressful rest of the day for my W because the obsesses over the house being spotless when people come over. She usually needs like 3 days notice. It's crazy but I am used to it and like last time when her parents came, I now know how to BE when she is like that.
I was just looking forward to a nice, stress-free evening, maybe watch a movie with W or something else together. Now we will be cleaning all night. Oh well, such is life.
I will try to make the most of it, be cheerful and do what I need to do to make this as good as possible.
Is it a foregone conclusion that your P's have to visit, and/or visit at your house?
Other options: -- Wow, we'd love to see you but this week doesn't really work for me. Is there another time in the next week or two? -- How about we meet you half way and have dinner and a movie out? Or a hike and brunch? -- Wow, we'd really love to see you but I'm not sure we're up to hosting, how about we come over and bring dessert? -- Hey, I know I said OK but I guess I felt put on the spot and panicked. I need to ask you to let me off the hook so we can find another option that works for everyone.
Do not be afraid to make your quality time with W a priority right now!!!
Well, my parents always come over for Easter and my W even made sure I call them and invite them a few days ago. At the time, they said they were busy. Now they want to come. Since they have not seen the kids in months and it will be a long time until I have a free weekend, it really does have to be this weekend or not at all. The good news is that they don't stay long and in all honesty, the cleaning would have been done tonight anyway. It won't be that bad and if we feel like we have too much on our plate, then we will cancel the plans for Easter day and just have family time then.
Another reality is that the time I spend with W cleaning tonight is likely to be "closer" than if we had nothing to do. I know that is sad but these days it's the truth. I am working hard to change that and have faith that I/we will.
It's really ok, and actually, my W was stressed that my parents somehow felt slighted that we didn't call to invite them earlier. Easter with them is something that is somewhat a family tradition and my W likes traditions so...
My negative reaction was a bit exaggerated and premature. W called and is happily going to the store to buy a few things for their visit and I assured her that our plans of shopping, ect were NOT going to be altered just because they were in town. I told my mom that already and she was perfectly cool with it. Dad, well, he can live on the couch for a few hours while we all go out as per his usual.
It will be fine. Probably a good opportunity for me to DB, be positive and make the most of the weekend! The old me would have already been trying to "fix" everything and everyone, and when I couldn't do that, I would be a basket case right now. In the past I would be stressed to the max right about now anticipating a mood that would never come from my W...in the past, I would have expected that phone call to be full of resentment and anger over my parents coming...even though I have never known my W to feel that way when they did.
In the past, I would have projected my negativity onto the whole scene, been angry all night tonight, aloof and absent tomorrow leaving W to entertain my parents while I sulked somewhere and then probably an ass on Sunday because I didn't get my way either day.
Not gonna do it. Not this time. PMA rules the day!!!!
That was helping tonight, having a PMA, making sure to mix in some laughter with the work, falling down the stairs, finishing up the work and finally getting some "down time". Lol.
Thanks for all the smiles OT. That makes me feel good.
So far it's been a good weekend, sorta. Friday we had another R talk initiated by W where she said she knows I am the "one" and that she would never do anything like this again. She said she learned so much from this in terms of how good things are in her life. At the same time, she said she was really depressed about things (I would assume OM) and just needed time to work things out in her head. She said she wants our marriage to be better. (btw, this was all said while we were embracing in the kitchen)
In the course of this, W said at various points that she loved me very much.
Later that night, talking in bed, she started to get upset, just like the other night. She talked more about OM, his obsessiveness and her fear of him. She said they have had NO contact, in person or on the phone since last week. She said he calls many times a day and she does not answer. She said there were things she could tell me that he did that would piss me off (not towards her, but him according to her). To that, I told her that I really didn't NEED or WANT to hear all about him or their A, but I was willing to listen. I told her to understand that I could listen without judgment and realize that I had done that to this point. She seemed relieved. I also said, and this was important to me, that even though I had no real need to hear more for my sake, I needed her to tell me whatever she needed to tell me so that the barrier that was between us (and she admitted there was one) could be removed. I said that I felt there were things that she has not told me that somehow prevented us from moving forward. I said I wanted to have much more passion, romance and affection in our new marriage and she kinda stopped cold...
W: YOU want that. We have spent the last 6-7 years of marriage without any of that. It's been boering. Especially after the kids. You think that can just change all of a sudden? M: Well, have you not noticed the changes over the last few months? W: Yes. M: To the extent that our current relationship permitted, I think I have shown you how I want things to be in the future. I have done this not for a day or week, but for months now, and as things grow between us, so too will my expression of how I feel.
We explored this for a few minutes with the gist of it being that we both wanted the same thing but that she was going to have to work towards it.
Also, it came up that since my W was feeling VERY stressed and tired over all this, that she really wished my parents were not coming the next morning. I offered to call them and tell them to come next weekend (not really good for me but I decided I could make it work). She said no, that she would "suck it up and do what she had to do like she always did." I kinda let it drop with a "I know how you feel, it's overwhelming and then we have to spend the day entertaining my parents. It's hard."
She gave me hug and we talked a little more and went to sleep.
The next morning I asked her again if she wanted me to call my parents and put them off. I was feeling a little sick and usually my parents (in their 80's and prone to catching everything these days) don't like to come over when we're sick so it was a good excuse. She said no but then said "they would never forgive us if we did that.", which is her code for "I don't want them to come but I'm afraid they will be angry." When she said that, I just made up my mind and called them (she offered no resistance to it) told my mom that we were up late and I was feeling sick. I asked her if it would be ok to move things to next weekend and she was totally ok with that. W was VERY relieved.
After I rested for awhile and was feeling better, we had a nice day together with the kids shopping, eating lunch and playing around. Good move I think. In the past I would NEVER have done that. We have always done whatever our parents wanted to do, even at GREAT inconvenience to us, which actually is still what we will probably do in the future because it's who we are but this time, we needed "us" time. I wanted W to know that she comes first. There would be more opportunity for that later too...
I had planed to take S5 to a basketball game that night. I offered to change the night we went considering W was not feeling well but W insisted we go, saying it was bad timing but S5 and I were looking forward to it so we should go. I agreed with her and since she seemed to be feeling better in the evening, we went. Well, at around half time of the game, W calls saying she is thought she was having a panic attack. She has had panic episodes in the past but not for a long time and there was a time when I dismissed them and blew her off when she was having an attack. Finally after a doctor told us what it was that was happening to her, I wised up and became supportive of her but not until a lot of damage was done because of my lack of support in the past. Anyway, she's not had one of these in a LONG time so this was a bit out of the blue. I immediately said we would come home. She said no, that she would feel better in a few minutes, or just go to the neighbor's and could I just talk to her. I said sure but told S5, who had been acting like he was ready to go anyway, that we needed to go at half-time. He had already had a blast so he was good, and so was I. I told W I would be right home. She protested for a few minutes, trying to get me to believe she was ok, but I just said no, I will be there in a few minutes.
She was VERY grateful that I did that. She was still not right when I got home but was ok in an hour or so after I talked to her, held her for awhile and took care of her, something she likes every now and again even though she tends to be pretty independent. So, we watched the rest of the game on TV and had another nice night together. Non-eventful on the romantic front, but really good.
Today (Easter) we did the bunny egg thing, went to the beach and then chilled at home. Again, other than getting to hang with W looking hot in a bikini, really non-eventful. Just another good day to build on.
I am not really frustrated these days. After Friday night's talk, when I told W what I wanted to happen, that I saw us having a passion, affection filled M in the future and that she should tell me whatever she needed to remove the barriers to that, I feel good about where we stand. Slowly but surely things are warming up.
Tis' another week and another part of the journey. We'll see how it goes.
GH, I think your Friday night convo was awesome. Letting your W know what you wanted in your M and getting her to agree that she wants the same is a huge step for you, especially your letting her know that she needs to tell you whatever is holding her back.
I would urge you not to let it die there. The next time your R comes up, ask her what she would like to do to have more passion and affection in the M. Don't wait for her to tell you -- ask specifically what you can do.
The LORD is near to all who call on him, to all who call on him in truth." (Psalm 145:18)
so buckle up.
