Well, I wasn't going to post anything because I really didn't feel like talking about things. But, I did promise to keep posting as things move in some direction with the hopes that my experiences are helpful to others.
Old thread locked, so I decided to move back to 'piecing' after the 'surprise' change in W's outlook last thursday. So technically we are 'piecing' but it's more like we're 'starting over' so that's the name of this new thread.
let's see. 2 days ago as we recall W said she wanted to see 'something different' in the things I do with her.
So , Wednesday ------
I came home and she was in the kitchen standing at the stove making dinner. Nobody was in the room. D10 was in the dining room but that was around the corner. So I thought I would do 'something different'. I came up behind her. put one arm around her waist, and my chin on her shoulder and said 'Hi!'. She turned her head to face me, smiled and looked like she was kissable so I gave her a kiss. She kept her lips straight and had no reaction. ok.
Later Wednesday nite I gave her a gift - a certificate for a massage by one of her favorite therapists. Now, on tuesday she had lamented about how she 'needed a massage' but only does 'trades' with this particular person, and has no 'credit' with her but owes her one, which she is doing thursday. So I thought I'd buy her one so she could either get it sooner, or save it for when she doesn't have any trades 'in the bank'. I even wrote a nice poem I included that talked about how much I appreciate how she takes care of us and works so hard.
Well, I gave it to her, she read the poem and didn't seem impressed. Then she went on about how she has trades already so why did I buy her this? I explained that she could use it any time, when she doesn't have trades, like it was this past tuesday. She was like 'oh, ok. thanks'.
After the kids are put to bed, We sat together and she gets out this book her (sane) friend had suggested we read together. It's called "Embracing each other: Relationship as teacher, healer & guide". It's a kind of psychological / spiritual book on how we suppress parts of ourselves in our relationships, and talks a lot about healing ourselves AND our relationships. Here's a quote from the book:
Quote: "The fairy tale version of romantic love teaches that once one finds the right mate, there is a marriage and then the two live happily ever after. Somehow the relationship magically brings out the King or Queen in each of us; therefore, our task in life is to find the correct mate so that we can be truly ourselves. In contrast to this, many of us now have a real fear that we will lose ourselves if we "give in" to a relationship and make the adjustments that are necessary in order for it to work, that the changes demanded of us by relationship are a weakening or a lessening of who we are." --Embracing Each Other, pp. 227-8
She says she's been reading it a little and wants to read together out loud tonite (something her friend suggested and so did our counselor). Specifically, the chapter on AFFAIRS. Ok.
We take turns reading and discuss (in an abstract way, not talking names or specifics) some of the concepts and how they applied to our 'recent and past life'.
Fundamantally, they say that when we are in a relationship, some of us deny parts of ourselves. In W's case, when we had D15 she went from a pretty sexual woman to a 'prim and proper mom'. As she tells it, she felt like it was 'wrong' to be anything other than a serious caretaker. In fact, because SHE was not well taken care of as a child, she obsessed over D15. So, I was very 'left out', which of course hurt my 'inner child' and I did what I would do when I was a kid - I withdrew emotionally.
So, for years we weren't really connecting emotionally and physically like we had BEFORE D15. And, she wsa denying a part of her that was very important.
About 6 years ago she says, she realizes that she became very close to her female friend who was always over the house hanging out with her. I was depressed and drinking and eventually that was when we had our first breakup. She realizes now that in some ways the relationship she and her friend were having was something like an 'affair' because she was getting her needs for companionship and emotional connection from her and excluding me.
The chapter discusses how affairs 'happen'. A lot of what it says is very much like things I've read in other books but with a more psychological / spiritual view. And remember, we're reading this together at HER request.
Basically, when one persons core needs are not being met by their 'primary partner' because THEY are denying parts of themself, if someone comes along and pushs that 'button' and seems to fulfill that denied need, the person is so desperate for the feelings that they lose all track of the rest of their world and will do anything to keep that feeling going. (Which she did).
It goes on to say that it's so strong that they often find that they can't stop themselves no matter how hard they try.
In W's case, she was denying her sexuality and her need to feel and hear that she was loved for so long, and she had cut off her emotional self from me. Then I shut down. So, when OM came along he triggered that part of her. Of course, it was mostly because he is an emotional predator, a chameleon, so he knew what she needed.
As we read this I think she was looking for me to give her some 'understanding' of her affair, and for her to see it for what it was - an attempt to 'fix' a part of her that was missing. We were very respectful as we spoke about these 'concepts' - without speaking about the actual affair itself. I think she felt some relief that I understood how we got there.
Now, the chapter also speaks about how an affair is so disruptive to a relationship that it will often trigger the other person to go into a 'growth mode'. I think we all know this, as DB'ers, because that's what we're doing - growing to the next level in OUR lives by being triggered in some way from our spouses actions.
She could see that I had done just that - re-examined my life and chosen to grow from this. The chapter makes the point that this is NOT common. It also makes the point that because the inner child has been betrayed that MOST spouses can never forgive the betrayal and hurt. However, those who see it as an opportunity for growth can forgive, and it will often end up creating a stronger relationship because the couple is actually talking about things they had repressed in their lives for years.
She said "Maybe you're one of those people who can do that?"
I looked at her and said "I AM one of those people".
I said "I really hate to think of it, but in many ways if this hadn't happend to us we'd both be still livng unhappy lives. I know we needed to trigger growth and change, I just wish it didn't have to be the way it happened. But I am grateful for the change.'
Overall it was interesting reading, we both shared some of our 'old' feelings relative to what we have learned now. I got the sense that she was looking to see if I COULD truly forgive her, and if she could open her self up again to the parts of her she had repressed for years and be with me. It was good quality time spent together.
Then it's bedtime. As we are 'parting' to go our separate ways she comes up to me and puts her FACE right in mine as if to kiss me, so I kiss her. Same response as earlier. tight lipped, no returning of it. We smile and I leave the room.
Thursday morning we go for a walk together - morning exercise. I actually initiate it and ask her to come along.
I don't recall anything earth shattering that we talked about but afterwards when we were home she came up to me and asked me if there were any sports I like or used to like to do that are 'testosterone' sports. I ask her why and she says that she realizes that she is 'turned on' by a man who is passionate about something 'with testosterone', i.e. some kind of athletic activity. I like biking, hiking and several other things that I mention and of course realize that I haven't done a lot of them for years. My bike needs the wheels fixed because she borrowed it a few years ago and bent one. She's embarrased that she hasn't fixed them. So I took them to get it done.
Later that day we have Couples Counselor meeting. We talk a little bit about how it's hard for me to know what she wants from me and what her boundaries or needs are because she doesn't tell me. It's 'come close' 'go away'. Interestingly, Counselor helps us to see that W has trouble using her 'voice' to ask for what she wants, and in the past I have had trouble LISTENING to her to learn what she needs.
Her family never talked about their feelings, and neither did mine. However, her Dad was a 'I know what's best and your opinion is worthless' kind of person (still is) and my Grandmother was a 'whatever rules exist today in your life will be different tomorrow so you can NEVER be right.' So I generally back off when someone is blocking me.
So, Counselor does an exercise she calls "Don'ts".
She asks W to come up with a "don't" to tell me. For example, W says "When you help me with computer stuff don't talk to me like you think I am stupid" or "When we're areound other people don't embarass me". She comes up with several that are things I never would have thought were issues with her, some that I knew were old behaviors of mine (taking her for granted, for example) and one I would NEVER have guessed because it was something her father used to do thatI could never understand why it bothered her so much when I did it".
I also had a chance to say some "Don'ts", the most important being "Don't think the things I do for you are out of guilt or trying to please YOU. I do them because they give me pleasure. Especially things that have to do with taking the kids places so you don't have to".
I also brought up the Kitchen Kissing episode and she said she felt like we weren't being 'discreet' enough. (baloney) So W said to me that she was 'fine' with 'stuff' as long as we were really discreet.
She gave another example that was really bothering her: When we went out to dinner monday nite she had at one point turned to me and said something like "Babe, would you do...." and she said that she felt so uncomfortable that she said "Babe" in front of the kids. She felt like the whole table froze.
Counselor commented that what she said was 'natural' for someone who has a fondness for the other person. If the kids ever ask her about things like that she should answer "No matter what happens between us, I'll always be fond of your father and treat him well". I thought that was a pretty good way to say "It's ok, you're feeling!".
Overall it was a good session. It aired out a lot of issues in a safe way. W was able to tell me a bunch of things that really bother her with her "Don'ts" and with some of them I was able to show her that I had not done them in months, which she recognized. Several of them had to do with 'social situations' which to me implied that she was either looking that far ahead, or she was just hurt by the past and wanting to say so.
Later that evening I was watching TV and she came and sat on the couch near me. After a few minutes she looked at me and smiled, then leaned over and lay on my chest. I rubbed her head a little. Ten minutes later she gets up and gets a hairbrush and hands to to me and lays her head on my lap and spreads out her hair for brushing. This is new. I brush her hair for a good 40 minutes and I must tell you it's a pretty sensual experience.
She really enjoyed it and I got an occasional 'mmmm' from her. After a while it's bedtime and she's practically asleep, she is so relaxed from brushing. She tells me how much she really likes her hair being brushed and I told her how much I liked doing it. What was weird for me was I can't think of any time in our marriage where either I or someone else, perhaps a girlfriend, has done that for her.
She finally gets up, and says goodnite, goes to her room.
Well, that's pretty much the events of the past couple days. I would say that it's like we are starting all over, she is trying to see how she likes living with me, how it feels to be close to me sometimes. I think she is also looking to see if I will become 'needy'.
We have very little physical contact, it's a lot different than the intimacy of several weeks ago. I spoke to counselor about that and she suggested that maybe at the time SHE was needy and now she isn't so it's not on her agenda yet.
C also believes she is still trying on her feelings. She just needs time to feel safe. I hope she is right.
Today has been uneventful. It's lunchtime and I gotta go. Hope this was not too long!
