You know, sometimes CeMar gets on people's nerves... I know. He does seem like a broken record, and often doesn't answer questions directly, etc.

BUT he is the authority on what is going on in his marriage. It can't all be coming from him. If I remember correctly, he and his W did have sex when they first married and then it changed. So he has a memory of what things used to be like. And according to him, she shows no particular desire or enthusiasm when they have sex now... and that's only been a few times in the last year.

As much as there have been times when I wanted to throttle him, I'm uncomfortable with trying to convince him that he's overreacting to her jumping up to wash after sex or wearing Eskimo gear to bed. Within the context of a non-SSM R, those things could be dealt with by having a damp towel next to the bed... a dual control electric blanket... by having her compromise and wearing a heavy turtleneck to bed with no bottoms... see what I'm getting at? CeMar's wife shows no interest in sex. He is sure of that, and I think we should believe him. I feel that it is dismissive of him to try to say that "oh well, here are the logical reasons why she does what she does." I'm not saying this very well, for some reason...

Okay. Let me try again. Others on the board describe rejecting behavior by their spouses and get sympathy, hugs, understanding. When CeMar describes rejecting behavior from his W, we rationalize it and suggest he's overreacting or imagining things, OR that he is causing it (not just CONTRIBUTING to it but CAUSING it) by his insensitivity. He is as deserving of compassion and understanding as any one of us. In some ways we've made him the whipping boy because he can be kind of annoying and doesn't respond to our questions. But all that notwithstanding, he IS describing rejecting behavior and it hurts.

Take the jumping up and washing thing... for a woman to do that, there are ways, and ways. The yukky way is as he describes: she jumps up immediately, runs to the bathroom, then covers herself completely in heavy pjs, and retires to her edge of the bed. You can't rationalize that into kind, loving behavior. I don't care how cold she is or how much she doesn't like the feel of fluids seeping out. She could convey this in a loving, sexy way by tucking a towel between her legs for a few minutes of snuggling, then going to wash with a complimentary comment about the volume of moisture , then put on a warm top and snuggle her bare bottom against him. Her behavior, as he describes it, is hurtful.

Yeah, he's whiny sometimes (as aren't we all?) but he is still hurting.