Quote: You or anyone else out there: Please tell me everything you know about DBing as it relates to snooping.
I can't really tell you what DBing says about snooping, but I can tell you what I think. DON'T DO IT unless a lawyer says you have to in order to gather evidence to be used in divorce proceedings. Otherwise it will just give you nightmares. SO much of what you will find is TOTALLY out of context of reality, and your H even knows it but when you read it, it WILL BECOME your reality. You WILL believe everything you read and it will haunt you. You already know enough to make decisions. Knowing more will NOT make things easier for you unless you are just looking for the one thing, say that they ML on your birthday or something, that REALLY crosses the line and will instantly make you end things with him. Other than that, and I am not too sure THAT'S a good reason, don't do it.
I did it twice in my sitch and I fully regret both times. Once was just to see if OM called my W, and the other was reading texts that HE sent HER. I was devastated for weeks and this was at a time when I could have been making REAL progress on myself instead of worrying about something I ALREADY knew was going on.
Others may have different advice, but mine is to NOT get those emails translated. Curiosity will pull at you, but don't let it win.
Thank you RB and GH, I am grateful to both of you for your presence and your sanity. I was listening to my body and reactions, and realized the content of those e-mails will not serve me well. So you have both given me exactly what I needed - confirmation that I am on the right track. I am grateful. I will shred what I printed. I have not spent too much time reading the DB boards, but last night I was up late, and you were 2 of 4 people that I marked as needing to pay attention to and read more of. No coincidences here. I will hang in here, and I will calm myself. After all, I only have a few more days before he goes away, might as well make the most of it and be my perky best self. I was up 'til 1:30 am reading the new adult ed class schedule - so many great opportunities. I think I will take yoga and sculpture.
Please hang in with me. I really appreciate your wisdom.
PositivelyListening ************************************** When one door of happiness closes, another one opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us. - Helen Keller
You are just coming to the point where you have that "ah ha" moment and realize that you really ARE in control of you.
I hope that you find SOME way to occupy yourself while he is gone, miss a few calls, and really give yourself the opportunity to live without him OR the constant worry about him. There will be time for all that when he gets back.
Look, you already know he's going, and what he's going for. You know you can't stop him so reality is defined. Accept it (actually I think you already have) and now consider this a vacation from all this for YOU!
Truly, I sometimes wish my W would go somewhere (not with OM mind you, never think I am diminishing how much that would hurt) so I can REALLY do some things for myself. When she is around, it's hard to actually GAL, etc.
I think you are doing a GREAT job now. The email decision is the first step and I think it will snowball from there. Keep it up girl!
I'm so sorry you are going through this. His treatment of you in your own home is appalling and I see no reason for you to tolerate it. 'The first thing to do is to take care of yourself. I make the following suggestions:
1) Copy the file and put it in a safe place in case you need it. 2) Tell H he cannot keep using his computer in your home. He crossed a boundary and you need to protect yourself by respecting yourself. 3) Remove yourself from any shared credit cards so that you are not responsible for the costs of his A. (Average cost, $25,000 I believe.) (Trust me, the old promises about supporting you through grad school, if made, in all likelihood will be broken.) 4) Change your locks or ask for his keyes before he takes his trip. He is no longer acting like your H and should not have access to your home as if he is your H. 5) If you can't stand not reading the emails, don't involve a friend. Use Babelfish. 6) Spend more time hanging out with your fellow grad students and enjoy school.
Once again I must reassert that you are an extraordinary person in that through all this you really DO have it figured out. You actually KNOW and UNDERSTAND what you must do, but you struggle with, like everyone else here, battling your emotional responses. You are fighting the urge to be reactionary rather than visionary. You have a vision--a goal--for your marriage, and you know as good as anyone here how to get there...obviously, being a reactionary is detrimental in this case.
But oh if I could sometimes listen to myself!!! HOW HARD IT IS.
After two solid weeks of keylogging and p*ssing the heck out of my W because I learned her passwords every time she changed them, and then getting her emails...if there is anyone on this board who has the art of espionage down to a science (sadly, it's something that an electronics man knows by education, haha), it's me.
I'm conversational in Spanish, but that doesn't mean I catch everything said in an email between my W and TOM because of the amount of slang and common usages present. Babelfish, as mentioned already, became a friend....but it comes with a WARNING:
online translators have a keen sense of translating verbatim, word for word, without any context or understanding of the text. Cultural idiosyncracies fail to show through. For example, a word meaning one thing in English may have a close meaning in German, but is ultimately nuanced to mean something that could mean a lot less. Languages are a hobby of mine and even I can't catch these nuances, and it has led me down some VERY DARK TUNNELS full of nasty demons. Did the phrase, "I denied having sex with you" mean she just didn't tell me she had sex with him and she did, or did it mean she never did and was denying it ever happend??? See what that nuance can do to a person???
It was complete self destruct. I still have that email stored somewhere in hopes that one day I can go through it with her, but I still struggle as to if that will do any good, if not to just set the record straight.
PL, I am still struggling. I spent years in the 'internet underground' where I was highly involved with illegal software trading, hacking, phreaking, data mining...you name it. I am a 'pseudo'expert at finding info. If I can't find something about someone, I know spooky people who can. But even then, I haven't had to resort to anything at that level simply because I have most of the information I need.
But I still struggle because I 'have' the capability, and it's a temptation so powerful if anyone struggles with it I can surely understand. This week even, I am waiting on a phone call from a duty-free store in Dallas International to explain a $200 charge on my shared credit card. As I've said, my W has gone down to Costa Rica for the week, and that charge has me beside myself.
SELF DESTRUCT. I can preach it, but I can't practice nearly so easily. I hope you can have more strength than I for your sake!!!
Listen to RB and GH, they are dead on. At least you know the truth, despite the pain it is causing you. You aren't gaining anything by reading the email. We are both in envious positions, you and I. I am envious that you have it all in front of you spelled out--you know what you are dealing with. You are envious of me because my W has indicated that she's all about working out and is definitely falling back in love. But I can speak for myself that a great impediment I'm having is not knowing the whole story and it's a resentment that is growing rapidly and dangerously.
****
Now I wanted to address Oldtimer's reply. OT, I greatly respect your posts from what I've read in the past so I'm hoping that my respect can show through in my disagreement, as I don't intend this to be in any way, shape, or form, offensive! But again, I am not sure I agree. This could be because I'm naive (I'm not afraid of that term, so if you feel I am, please share) but let me respond in hopes of generating more discussion:
Quote: 1) Copy the file and put it in a safe place in case you need it.
Good idea. No problems here.
Quote: ) Tell H he cannot keep using his computer in your home. He crossed a boundary and you need to protect yourself by respecting yourself.
Here's when I start to get uncomfortable. The sentiment I hear loud and clear. I have to go back to the question: "Will this bring me closer to my goal?" It seems that this kind of boundary setting is borderline an emotional response rather than a rational proactive one. Hear me out...
When I learned that TOM (the other man) was calling my W frequently, I wanted with all my might to set a clear established boundary, since it is nothing short of abuse to have him calling. It is highly inappropriate and we all know this. We are justified in setting that boundary no doubt, but does it help? I'm not convinced. What I did instead was to at first encourage it. It was a 180. My W did not know what to do with that info. I told my W in no unclear terms that I was more concerned that she was happy and that if he was a friend and wanted to call him, then go ahead. A week later, I took another step. I told her that it "hurt me a great deal to have him calling her at home." I reiterated that I can't control her relationship with him, but I demonstrated that her behavior was destructive as it was really hurting me.
The point I wish to make here is that it is without a doubt imperitive that you remove the reasons your partner has for being with this other person. Control is a major factor. While we are certainly justified in setting up these boundaries, telling my wife that she must not talk on the phone with him would just be perceived as a method of manipulation or control, which is EXACTLY what they would need to justify their behavior.
I believe in this case the more appropriate action in DBing would be to detach from that activity, and then share to her H that his actions hurt her, all the while being supportive of his need to sort all this out. It seems like asking the impossible, but this sort of thing is not a show-stopper such as physical abuse or drug-alcohol addiction where boundaries must be clearly stated and established. This is a relational issue where PL must swallow some of the ol' pride that she is certainly entitled to have and justified, and let this activity slide. This will allow her H to make the choice for himself, rather than having it made for him. That's the entire key to this mess. Most people who have affairs are looking to absolve themselves by having another person make their choices. They either want their spouse to ditch them or give them justification for why they cheated in the first place. Remove that and they are left holding the bag and wondering, why did I ever cheat??
Quote: 3) Remove yourself from any shared credit cards so that you are not responsible for the costs of his A. (Average cost, $25,000 I believe.) (Trust me, the old promises about supporting you through grad school, if made, in all likelihood will be broken.)
That seems extreme as well to me. It signals to him that she is cutting off. This seems like it would fit under the "last resort technique". Yet PL has indicated that although her H is confused, he does not wish for a divorce. I'm concerned that this sends the wrong message, as it would once again provide justification for him to say, "see, it's over, she's starting to pack up the relics of our marriage, starting with our financial ties...maybe divorce is the only resolution".
Finances are a tough topic that I don't feel comfortable advising on. It must be a personal decision as the risk is great. For me, at 26, I am young and successful enough to rebound if I make a bad decision. My mother, however, got nothing from her divorce (our family really had nothing) and at 55 with chronic health issues starting to materialize is in a world of hurt on the retirement future. These issues must all be considered so I don't want to hedge my bet in any way here...I just urge caution.
Quote: 4) Change your locks or ask for his keyes before he takes his trip. He is no longer acting like your H and should not have access to your home as if he is your H.
This to me sounds too much like an emotional response to anger. However justified this is, it doesn't put out the 'welcome mat' for the marriage. Right now he is confused, not stupid. He isn't either convinced he wants out, either. If he was signalling that he wanted out under no uncertain terms, then giving him exactly that would be warranted and I'd be more supportive of this decision. However, he's not. He's weighing both sides in an excruciating fashion. PositivelySexay is not being a doormat either for doing all this. She is being the one in control, in the drivers seat. It takes a lot of mental/moral/emotional courage to do what she's doing and she will be better for it. In the end she will get to say, "I did all that I could for this marriage and he is a sucker for not taking the unconditional love when it was there"...I EMPHASIZE that it is UNCONDITIONAL...meaning that at least for now, she just takes the licks on the chin. It sucks, but if she wants it to weather and things to come back, putting the deadbolt on the door is not going to help this!!
Quote: 5) If you can't stand not reading the emails, don't involve a friend. Use Babelfish. 6) Spend more time hanging out with your fellow grad students and enjoy school.
Both good advice. Don't bring in 3rd parties to do your snooping! And definitely enjoy your friendships.
PL, what is your degree program?? I'm excited to hear that you are working on a PhD...are you almost finished? What's your dissertation about??
Oldtimer, again, I respect you greatly and hope that I haven't set your teeth on edge all that much. I can agree to disagree and have nothing at all against you personally! I hope you feel the same!
Good thoughts. Personally I think there is a big difference between a spouse that is still at home and cheating, in which case it is still a shared home, and a spouse that has moved out and is coming into one's own home to practice infidelity. My undertstanding is that her spouse is not living at home.
It hurts the R and oneself not to enforce boundaries. She set a reasonable boundary that H not engage in activities related to infidelity in her home. He violated that boundary.
Protecting oneself financially when one's spouse is out of control is not reacting out of anger, it is taking the situation at face value (no one knows what will happen) and acting responsibly.
Her H is going to visit another country to visit OW. This is a very significant expense, emotionally and financially. There is nothing wrong with her H feeling as though he is putting his marriage at risk by doing this. He needs to understand the stakes. More important, she needs to have a safe space during this process and my suggestion that she secure her household is related to that, not a way of punishing her H. This should be about her, not him. She needs to accept that he may not return and do what it takes so that she can be happy and secure not matter what happens. Giving someone access to one's own home--it is not his home now--to practice infidelity does nothing to help in terms of that goal.
And, like my C used to say to me, let him see your anger and pain once in awhile. Acting like all is hunky dory just lets him stay in his comfort zone.
It is time for her to let him go for awhile and see what happens while she works on herself and takes care of herself.
I appreciate your thoughts OT and they are certainly not without merit. I'm looking at this through my own prism, of course, like we all do, and trying to apply it to my sitch where appropriate. This is obviously not the same as PL's sitch, but it's the only way I can process! hehe
Quote: Personally I think there is a big difference between a spouse that is still at home and cheating, in which case it is still a shared home, and a spouse that has moved out and is coming into one's own home to practice infidelity.
You are quite right. I didn't look at it in that context. In that perspective, if I understand you correctly, her H has his own place and should practice his infidelity in his own space and not bring it to her like that. I can definitely agree.
Of course, however, there comes nitty-gritty details that serve to exacerbate this problem, wouldn't you agree? Details like, it's both their computer, and they have an agreement to share its use still from the sounds of things. Could it get ugly for PL if she puts her foot down and says, the PC is now 'mine' and I will regulate its use. Even in the pretext of these boundaries which I can now agree with, I am not sure if we are getting anywhere nearer our goal of reconciliation.
It will be interesting to hear PL's view on this, as only she has the intimate knowledge to forsee what effect this would have. For now I'll just say I'll agree up to a point
Quote: It hurts the R and oneself not to enforce boundaries. She set a reasonable boundary that H not engage in activities related to infidelity in her home. He violated that boundary.
First of all I agree and disagree with that statement. I disagree because the R is already hurt because the boundaries of marriage were ignored and crossed. However, I know from my own experience, I understand the need to set boundaries and the importance of their enforcement. However, I take the tack that it's how it is enforced that makes it a reasonable boundary, not the boundary itself.
Removing the power of choice from her H I don't see as healthy in any circumstance. Recall in my sitch that I indeed establish a boundary regarding my W calling and receiving calls from TOM. Not appropriate! But I did so not by screening all her calls, I just said what I felt--"I am deeply hurt when you are receiving calls and I feel this is highly inappropriate. Do what you will, but know that this hurts me." I can't emphasize enough that the first signs of controlling behavior will have him running to the OW even more. He may feel 'controlled' by her communicating her feelings but it would be due to his own internal pressures of guilt and remorse, and not any direct action against him by her.
He isn't stupid. He knows he's breaking boundaries. He wouldn't be hiding it in spreadsheets and estimates like he has been. That takes effort. Energy. He's investing energy to cover his tracks. The boundary is there, it is simply not being enforced. That leaves two choices: a) Take away his power of choice by say, selling the computer, or b) telling him how his boundary crossing is affecting you emotionally and letting him be responsible for those emotions. I still opt for (b) in this case.
Quote: Protecting oneself financially when one's spouse is out of control is not reacting out of anger, it is taking the situation at face value (no one knows what will happen) and acting responsibly.
Once again it is hard to argue against your point. Personal finances are all about risk and I'm not going to say anything against anyone who wishes to protect him or herself from that risk.
Quote: Her H is going to visit another country to visit OW. This is a very significant expense, emotionally and financially. There is nothing wrong with her H feeling as though he is putting his marriage at risk by doing this. He needs to understand the stakes.
Maybe I haven't understood properly. PL, are you supporting him financially?? Who is funding these escapades? Are his contributions to your joint investments equitable and fair?
If he is still being fair and equitable to the investments you have agreed upon, and you aren't carrying a financial burden that otherwise he would help with if he wasn't spending on the travel, then I don't see how you are any more at risk than if he was spending that equivalent amount on something more akin to a MLC--boats, new car, plasma screens, etc...If it's his money and he's meeting his financial responsibility then what he does with that may be hurtful behavior, but not putting you at risk.
I don't know the details. It's important to keep the argument relevant. I wouldn't go to the drastic steps of changing accounts and moving assets and cutting him out financially until he is being irresponsible to his commitments or is mooching off you to continue his affair.
Quote: More important, she needs to have a safe space during this process and my suggestion that she secure her household is related to that, not a way of punishing her H. This should be about her, not him. She needs to accept that he may not return and do what it takes so that she can be happy and secure not matter what happens. Giving someone access to one's own home--it is not his home now--to practice infidelity does nothing to help in terms of that goal.
I totally see that this is about her and not him. But let me speak to that. What is her interests? Her primary stated goal is to reconcile in her marriage. To get closer to that stated goal, it won't help (in my opinion) to reinforce any notion that he is being punished, as it will only make reconciliation more difficult.
It certainly DOES sound like I'm proposing she be just a doormat to be walked over. But that's not what I'm suggesting. This man is carrying two lives, yes. However, he is not physically abusive, and as far as I know does not have a drug/alcohol problem. They live separate, but her home is open to him to come home permanently. Since she has not in direct words (as far as I know anyways) told him to his face that his actions of communicating with her and doing things for her in her home tears her up inside and hurts her terribly, I would definitely advise giving this a chance to work first before going to that extreme.
Yes, PL, you definitely established the boundary early on. You told him to take all the stuff that had anything to do with her with him when he moved out and told him that he was not welcome communicating with her in the home. Nothing wrong with that. But that was all it was--established rule. NOW, as the case is currently, he has violated that established rule and I would strongly recommend you tell him how it makes you FEEL rather than telling him that he's crossed the line. He may get defensive (probably will) because he will probably be indignant saying he hasn't done so. Let that deflect off you and don't react. Just say, that regardless, it completely turns you into a wreck and hurts you deeply.
He may think more strongly and longer next time before he does. IF that doesn't seem to reinforce that boundary, I'd THEN consider something more drastic to protect yourself.
Changing the keys seems so harsh to me. To me, you change your keys after you've had your keys stolen or you have a relationship actually END. I would agree that one can draw metaphors here to both those scenarios, but I truly believe that one can achieve the same or better results without resorting to such harsh measures.
Anyways...I appreciate your further thoughts OT. I'm not sold on them but you helped. I think I'd like to hear from PL first before I go further because I am starting to see lots of my own fixed assumptions creeping into the mix.
Well it was certainly exciting today to come home and see so much attention and thoughtfulness related to my situation. The thing I am feeling the best about right now, is the dawning realization that I actually will find inside of myself what is best for me, out of the kind dialogue and caring concern of people like you. I think I am beginning to get the hang of what I need to be doing here. God bless you both.
So, where I am on all this is relatively simple. I have decided that all steps motivated by fear will not serve me, and that negative action will generate more of the same in return. Likewise unconditional love and positive regard will generate the same (and more of that!). It is the realm I must live in, it is the only solace I have. Otherwise, the world makes no sense to me at all. If it turns out I am terribly wrong, I would rather be wrong and die penniless than be wrong in witholding love (in every way, including trust re: material possessions) from my chosen partner. Now does that scare the living daylights out of me sometimes? you bet. But along with patience, I am developing courage - feel the fear, but do it anyway - because if it matches my values and my personal goals for reconcilliation with my husband, then it is all there is to do.
My dad left my mom after 35 years of marriage, for a 37 year old woman. He never even came back to get his clothes or his shoes, but the accounts got emptied and my mom lost their home in the divorce. She later ended up developing Alzheimer's disease, and living with my daughter and I (I was a single mom) until she passed away in 1994. Now, I suppose you might say I had a difficult time forgiving my dad. I never saw him again either, and I was 24 when he left, and had always adored him. I actually had never liked my mom that well either - too many power struggles between us. So shifting to being responsible for her well being, and having the patience to repeat myself over and over again to answer her sweet but forgetful mind, knowing it felt like the first time for her each time she asked, well what can I say? That was good preparation for the patience I will also need today. I never would have appreciated and loved my mom the way I did if my dad hadn't left. She was a total blessing in our lives during the time she lived with us, and it taught me some amazing lessons about faith, patience and humility. This week, my dad has been coming up a lot for me. Came up in counseling last week, so that was my homework, to mull on some of this a bit more. I have decided that my daughter, my mom, and I all got the better deal. I do not know what personal hell he may have gone through at the end of his days, or maybe he actually got a final stab at what he had considered to be lifelong elusive happiness. But I do know that he has taught me to value the people in my life all the more, because for one reason or another, they are not here forever.
Anyway, regarding the finances and trust and my husband and all that, all I can say is that I love my husband, and I want him to come home. I will not do anything right now to make that harder than it already will be, if he ever wakes up from the grand illusion fogland he is in. I have been reading "When your mate wants out" by Sally and Jim Conway, and I am sure they are on to something. Although it is a bible-based book and my spiritual leanings are much more ecclectic, the wisdom is powerful and it resonates with me. My husband is not a bad guy. Unfortunately, he is just caught up in a really heated affair that has him all in a twist. Makes me want to puke, and I hate it. But here's the deal. If I let my emotions run away with ME right now, then I'll be just as crazy as he is at the moment. So, I just won't go there. I don't even have keys and locks where I live :-) and truth is, if he came over in the middle of the night, I'd be thrilled :-) I wish.
I was the controlling one in our relationship. I didn't mean to be, but frankly I've always been so damned in charge and so competent at everything, how in the world was there ever room for him, for him to show up and take charge and be the man he really intends to be? This is my last shot at getting it right with him, and for me. I'm up to this. I am letting him decide, him call the shots, him make this right again. I will take care of myself. If he leaves, I keep the house and he keeps his business. His affair is getting funded right now through his business, and I could tap into that account on-line if I needed to, and honestly I am much savier computer-wise and financially. I have to watch myself to be the generous loving person I realy am, and not to allow the fear, greed, pride, or resentment to take over. I'm just not going to let the finances run me, naive as I may be (or not.) I'm going to catch a lot more flies with honey than vinegar, I say. I must learn this lesson or I will for sure be doing it alone. Alone and in charge, I'm good at. It's true love and partnership I want to master. And yes, I am being tested big time.
However, so far, we have plans for him to install 7 windows, re-side the house, clean the garage with me, and house-sit for me while I take a vacation. He's actually contemplating taking a trip with me this summer, and we will be attending my daughter's graduation in May together, staying in the same hotel room. I was the one that asked him to move out when I found out about the affair, and as much as I want him to come home, I need to see the affair peeter out first. Meanwhile, he's living in a rented room with a thrice-divorced guy that drinks too much on the weekends. He comes over here to work in the office and get an occasional home-cooked meal, and see my sweet and sexy self. I don't know how long I can do this. I am hoping and praying that next week while he is with the OW, that he will see who she really is and think at least a little about who I really am. I believe to the bottom of my heart that my husband is my partner and my lifelong companion, and if he leaves me, I believe he will be in a lot more pain than me in the end. I really believe in him and believe in our marriage. Stay tuned next week :-) But I am just feeling the PMA tonight.
BTW, I had dinner with a friend tonight and this may have helped. She has been married 12 years, and she had an affair at the 5 year mark, like my H. She really helped me get into his head, and understand the crazy feelings she had of being "in love" with this other person. She had all her reasons, and it was all so false for her later. She reassured me, to please hang in there. I say this for all of us. It saddens her so much that she hurt her husband the way she did. They have actually found some humor around it now, believe it or not, but it still hurts too. Since her husband is now heading into MLC and she is a strong in-charge woman, I encouraged her to read Divorce Remedy now as preventative medicine for her guy who is beginning to withdraw from it all. But her feedback was so important to me. I am hanging in.
I have not experienced ANYONE yet who has told me that the partner who had the affair didn't want to return later. Every person I know who has knowledge of someone who has had an affair, has told me that s/he has chosen and wanted to return to the marriage. Often, the left behind partner has "moved on", and it was "too late". What a sad sad thing. Patience, I say. I can do this. I know when my husband comes home, our relationship will be better than ever. Watch me. I'm hangin' in.
PositivelyListening ************************************** When one door of happiness closes, another one opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us. - Helen Keller
That was a really good post. I don't have much time but I wanted to comment on this...
Quote: I have not experienced ANYONE yet who has told me that the partner who had the affair didn't want to return later. Every person I know who has knowledge of someone who has had an affair, has told me that s/he has chosen and wanted to return to the marriage.
You know, not that you mention it, neither have I. Really makes you wonder...maybe this Michelle chick is on to something...lol.
Well, every "up" seems to be followed by a "down". Sometimes the smallest tiniest things start such a slide. I used to like rollercoasters! Currently, a nice slow flat walk on the beach (like I had today) is the only thing for me.
Last night I talked to my H on the phone, briefly. It was sweet at the start, he still calls me honey, sweetheart and such, and he was a little sleepy relaxed on the phone which I find very cute and is one of the things amongst 1000 other things, that I miss. He seemed really happy to hear from me (I called), as I have learned he seems to enjoy the periodic reassurances from me and acknowledgements from me, which defies some of the techniques I thought would be helpful to my situation. But since I have discovered that he was really low and vulnerable in his MLC, the reading I have been doing has led me to believe what he is getting from her is what he needs more of from me. So I have been very loving and charming and soft and kind, although trying to keep a balance of not pursuing (which is often hard to guage). I like me better this way too, it is not all for him. I am learning!~ However, sometimes I feel so vulnerable to his fickle moods too. In any case, at one point during the phone conversation I mentioned that my daughter is going to visit her long distance boyfriend this week, and that it has been about 2 months since they saw each other which they have determined is just about as long as they can manage. He let out a laugh, and said an overly enthusiastic "I know". You see, as soon as I commented on my daughter's situation, I realized that it has been exactly 2 months since he has seen the OW, and he is flying out this week also. There was this moment on the phone where he just went away, and my stomach turned with that feeling of knowing he is all infatuated and caught up in this affair, and the conversation between us was just gone and the phone call ended pretty quickly after that although I did keep my cool with him. But I was in the place of I can hardly bear it, and worse I even felt like I put myself there even though it was a totally innocent conversation initially. It feels like there are all of these reminders of the OW's existence, and I am haunted. In any encounter with my H, there is a good possibility something will trigger a reminder of the OW's presence, even though I do not ever intentionally bring her up. And it disturbs me greatly. How can anyone choose to do this to another human being?
So this little incident, this almost unnoticeable change in his tone, these two words spoken by my H, and I fell down. Lost so much sleep, woke up so upset I could barely get myself up and to work. Cried so much at work and at lunch and was unable to pull myself together. My H left me a message on my cell (the tax preparer says our forms are all done, what should he do?) and after 2 hours I managed to call him, asked him to pick them up and bring them over on Friday night when we will also have dinner together and sign them. He noticed I "sounded tired" and I said there was a lot going on at work. However, I proceeded to cry in my office afterwards also, to the point that I finally took 3 hours sick time as I was getting nothing done, and crawled out of there (with my sweet staff thinking "what can we do for her?") and I came home and cried another hour or so. Finally checked in here for a bit, then took a nice long walk on the beach with the dog, cried at the beach, coming and going, and now here I am, back here again.
I am usually very together. I am usually the one everyone else comes to for guidance. I have a background in counseling, coaching, and educational advising and I am enrolled in a PhD program in Human Development for God's sake. But this emotional upheaval, this betrayal and the aftermath, is beyond anything I have ever dealt with. I am humbled, beyond beyond beyond.
So I dunno what else there is to do. I feel like my life is already busy and full, I have friends and family who love me. I journal, I have counseling, I get a massage every week right now, I have all of you. But my life feels so unbearably empty and alone, and every white truck going by (do you know how many white trucks there are in the world?) has me looking for my husband. I can't believe he has spent two months away, and there is no sign of plans to return, and on top of that he is all giddy with excitement to go visit the OW and I just want to know how could he not MISS ME?
So, if this is about grief, I am definitely grieving. If I could fix this right now (I am so good at fixing things too!) I would certainly have it fixed. Nothing matters more to me than my marriage right now. And I can't help but feel so badly for everything I said or did that hurt my H and made him feel like he had to go away instead of telling me what he needed. You see, we are perfect for each other - I have fear of abandonment issues, and he has fear of intimacy issues So here we are in the mud.
I am thinking my friend Mr_MD asked me to write out my relationship goals, which I have in my Solutions Journal. Action Steps, Behavioral changes, something to DO - that should help! I thought it would be good to put them here - then you can all align with me too, and I won't feel so alone. Right? Also perhaps you will have some feedback for me, which would be VERY good. Maybe my goals are too lofty? I want to believe I can have this, it's what I want. I have Relationship Goals, Specific Actions I am looking for that would indicate a change of heart, then the "Thinking small/baby steps" I am looking for during the next two weeks, and then of course the Actions for me that I will be taking that will hopefully cause these changes to occur . So here they are:
Relationship Goals: I want my H to choose to be married to me, and to recommit to our marriage.
I want my H to return to living with me in our home.
I want my H to choose to end the affair and relationship with the O.W.
I want honesty, trust, commitment and open communication to be the cornerstones of our marriage.
I want us to enjoy time together, and to have fun.
I want balance in how we spend our time and energy.
I want us to laugh together, often.
I want great sex, sexual attraction and passion in our relationship.
Specific Actions that would indicate movement towards our marriage:
My H would show romantic interest in me (buy me flowers, write me a card, make me a music CD, plan a surprise for me, do something generous/impulsive)
My H will spend the night with me at our house in our bed.
My H would say that he wants our marriage to work.
My H will end the relationship with the O.W., and will share his feelings with me about that.
My H will be open to, and excited about, flirtations and sexual advances from me.
My H will show sexual attraction to me, and will act on it.
My H will create and share future plans for us as a couple, and for our family together.
My H & I will enjoy doing fun activities together (dining out, plays, movies, dancing, horseback riding, whale watching, etc. - the sky is the limit)
My H & I will discuss what happened, the areas where we were not "in integrity" and state our forgiveness to each other.
My H will tell me ILY.
My H will make plans with me to return home.
My H & I will create action steps to benefit our marriage, and discuss them regularly together.
"Thinking small" - the baby steps I am looking for in the next two weeks which will tell me if my behaviors are working:
My H will call me at least 3 times on the phone this week My H will ask to spend time with me (non-work, non-business - fun time) My H will rehang the photo of me in his workshop, and will tell me he did that. My H will acknowledge that he is still attracted to me. My H will continue to use endearments with me (sweetheart, honey, darling) My H will express doubts about the relationship with the O.W. My H will compliment my appearance. My H will hug, kiss and cuddle with me when the opportunity arises. My H will express curiousity about something new I am doing. My H will say that he misses me. My H will share his worries with me, and will feel more connected and closer to me afterwards. My H will call me at least once while he is away in Germany.
Actions/Behaviors FOR ME: Keep busy! Be mysterious and surprising Be patient Exercise and self-care Be happy, be positive Respond but don't pursue Enjoy the peace & quiet & space Walk on the beach w/ my dog and friends Organize all of my educational program paperwork Do something new and different Pay attention tomy appearance Be fun, playful, sexy, spontaneous Speak softly, be confident. Keep phone calls you make to him to a minimum Be unavailable at least 50 % of the time Be happy, be light Make plans with others to go out work nights and weekends Focus on myself, my needs and my wants Be less predictable Be very cute and friendly Have a great life, and share about it Stay centered, and love myself Laugh!! Stay interested, but cool Be loving, but not overly enthusiastic
And then, my final notes:
DO NOT PURSUE! DO NOT INITIATE! DO NOT BACKSLIDE! (no anger, no neediness) DO NOT GIVE UP!
Anything worth having is something worth waiting for!
So my friends, let me know your thoughts. For now, back to bed, and journaling some more. Thanks for being here.
PositivelyListening ************************************** When one door of happiness closes, another one opens; but often we look so long at the closed door that we do not see the one which has been opened for us. - Helen Keller
I will hang in here, and I will calm myself. After all, I only have a few more days before he goes away, might as well make the most of it and be my perky best self. I was up 'til 1:30 am reading the new adult ed class schedule - so many great opportunities. I think I will take yoga and sculpture. 
So here we are in the mud.