Well, to use Mojo's analogy about being a nutritious oatmeal cookie with surprise chocolate chips inside - H has been eating his oatmeal cookie and liking it. We have ml three times in the last week and it has been very connected, erotic and loving. No - we haven't done anything new but I feel that I have put more of myself out there and so has he. It does happen to coincide with our house being put back together again -just a few minor details left. I would like to think that the reason for the sitch was the housefire and all the stress but experience tells me otherwise. Experience tells me that a SSM is our status quo and that regular, connected sex is the rare but enjoyable exception. I still have to talk with him about our sl in general and how porn affects it in specific.
The thing I am currently wondering is - if we are capable of wonderful, connected sex then what causes us to revert to either miserable, unconnected sex or not having sex at all. Instead of asking why don't we have sex more often? and better sex more often? I am wondering why do we have such good sex sometimes? I don't buy the theory that it just so happens that H hasn't mb that week or that I was the kinder/gentler me or that we have less stress. What makes those times that we connect in such a sublime manner?
Quote: The thing I am currently wondering is - if we are capable of wonderful, connected sex then what causes us to revert to either miserable, unconnected sex or not having sex at all. Instead of asking why don't we have sex more often? and better sex more often? I am wondering why do we have such good sex sometimes?
Maybe because your H and you don't have completely incompatible sexual philosophies but philosophies that only overlap. For instance, perhaps your H has the philosophy "Sex with my wife should be a celebration." and you have the philosophy "Sex with my husband is a cause for celebration.". For you, sex with your husband is something you need in order to be happy in your marriage. For your husband, sex with his wife is something he wants when he is happy in his marriage and with life in general. When he is unhappy he prefers to take care of his physical sexual needs himself.
It's pretty easy to see how this difference in sexual philosophy can lead to some vicious cycles. If he only wants to have sex with you when he is happy then you might be tempted to put yourself on some horrible hamster wheel of trying to make him happy so he will want to have sex with you. Also, the more you make it clear how unhappy you are with your sex life the more unhappy he becomes and the less he wants to have sex with you.
IMO, all you can do is accept, respect his philosophy but be honest about your own philosophy. For instance, you might say something like "I think that it is okay sometimes for people to seek comfort from sex they are unhappy. I might want that from you sometimes. Would that be okay? It would be okay with me if you wanted that from me even if you don't feel comfortable with offering it to me in return.".
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
That is a remarkably accurate analysis. I guess I keep hoping against hope that one day H would decide/learn to push past times when he is anxious or stressed. That one day he would be so bowled over by my loveliness/sexiness that he would not only push past anxiety/stress but come actively seeking raw, agressive sex (without any prior indication of interest from me). Or even (gasp, horrors) come to me and say "God, I'm stressed and I don't want sex but I would love to make you squirm all over, grab the bedsheets and scream for mercy so I'm going to lick you all over until that happens." It is silly, fruitless, a cheeseless tunnel and likely, sinmply not who H is.
And yes, I am already on that hamster wheel of keeping/making H "happy" to maximize chances for closeness - both sexual and non. And yes, whenever I express my unhappiness that we aren't having more sex it prolongs/complicates the no sex phase.
Lately, I have done better with more acceptance and more GAL activities and lately, we have been having more sex.
So, I take it, Mojo, that you credit your shift in philosophy with making you happier in your sl and likely, happier in general. I feel as if I can shift the philopsophy and then I will just become more philosophical about not being happy.
I am glad things are on the upswing for you right now. And that you are realistic in the fact that it will probably come to a halt.
I really liked the question you stated. And MoJo's answer made real good sense to me. Though not saying that is the how your relationship works. But I could see that dynamic or a simular one working in my relationship. My H derives happiness from sex I on the other hand want sex when I am happy. Both revolve around happiness but comming from different angles. You could replace the word happiness with Emotional Connection also in my case. Gonna ponder this one a while.
Quote: So, I take it, Mojo, that you credit your shift in philosophy with making you happier in your sl and likely, happier in general. I feel as if I can shift the philopsophy and then I will just become more philosophical about not being happy.
LOL. The thing is I didn't set out to reconcile myself to my situation by using philosophy. I tried to figure out how to make myself happier in my situation and after the fact I realized that I did it by applying philosophy. I should explain that I went through some pretty unhappy phases with my relationship after I left the board before I got to my current good state of mind. I didn't just give up initiating sex, I gave up initiating anything to which I received a negative response and then observed my own emotional reactions.
Example: MM: Good morning!
H: grunt
Back in my wimpy days, my natural response to this would have been to wonder if my H was upset with me and maybe ask him what was wrong. During my angry phase, my response would have been to get p*ssed off and think "Why do I put up with this sh*t." and confront him about his disrespectful behavior. Now I just assume he is in a bad mood for some reason that may or may not have anything to do with me and I feel sorry for him because he is unable to control his grumpy behavior and will now have to offer up some sort of token of apology before he will be able to engage in pleasant interaction with me. I remain happy because I feel strong and control my own emotional reactions, not because I am able to control or change his emotional state or reactions to me.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Thanks for the kind words. I learn so much on this BB.
Mojo,
I guess this is what is referred as holding onto oneself. It is separating what is under our own personal circle of influence from what is not. So much of adulthood lies in figuring that out and refraining from personalizing or trying to control what is not in that sphere.
Do you initiate sex now. What happens if your H responds poorly?
Quote: Do you initiate sex now. What happens if your H responds poorly?
I don't initiate sex. The simplest explanation for why I don't is that I've determined that it is a cheeseless tunnel and I am too lazy to run down cheeseless tunnels. IMO there are three kinds of work you can do in relationship. You can work to get what you feel like you need/want from the relationship, you can work to give your partner what you think they should or might need/want or you can work to give your partner what they have clearly expressed that they need/want. My working theory is that you are going to have a better relationship if you put your limited energy into the latter and a lot more free time to breed dahlias, daytrade stocks, play with the kids, lay on the beach etc.
"Tell me, what is it you plan to do with your one wild and precious life?" - Mary Oliver
Soooo....basically you give in to what he wants and thus are happier.
I mean I see Philososhy of it. But is that really a workable solution for both people. Do you ever worry that you will wake up one day and go, damm, I'm unhappy and I've wasted away my youth. It hurts when I hear stories that Lil tells about never experiencing any more adventurous/passionate/intimate sex. I don't know. Most people on this board are here because they Can't give up on having a fulfilling SL. Aren't you basically saying to give up, to some degree?
I understand clearly how this kind of philosophy would help you be happier in general and happier with your general R. Out of curiosity, what has been the net effect on your sex life? The fact that you don't initiate at all - do you have sex any more than when you did, is it more of a shared experience? I understand that you didn't change your philosophy in order to create a certain change in your sl. I am just curious what, if any, the change has been.
Last night, knowing that we had ml 2 night in a row (and knowing that I would have still enjoyed sexual contact but it was a cheeseless tunnel), I worked out extra hard, showered, put on a really nice fragranced lotion, a pretty silk nightie and snuggled with H. It was nice. I would be better able to enjoy it however, if I didn't consider the night after a week where we ml three times to be the beginning of the famine to come. I really have trouble when I suspect that the famine is coming on. Actually, it won't come yet because we are going on vacation and H is always ready for vacation sex - sometimes even twice in one day but if we weren't going on vacation we probably wouldn't ml for two weeks. It would take some pretty fancy mental gymnastics for me to be happy with H's all or none philosophy though I can appreciate the wisdom of coming to terms with it.
FWIW....I know exactly what you are talking about when it comes to viewing the night after as the beginning of the famine to come. This is one place I have definitely changed my thinking in my R.
I know my H, like yours won't be up to it at that time....so instead of viewing that time as a famine, I view it as his time to recoup....a break...and time to work on me doing the things he needs for us to maintain our EC. I'm finding right now, that by changing my thinking I'm more easily able to do the things he likes....snuggling (like you did) on a more regular basis (that's something that fosters an EC in him) and a few other things....then in 3-4 days, I might do something to set that sexual spark again for a day or two. Because I've been working on making sure his EC is maintained in the ways he needs he is much more receptive to doing what I need as well.
I'm finding that our vicious cycle is turning around into a pro-active one. I'm now not getting resentful during those downtimes....because the EC is being maintained too. Take this past week for example...it's been since last Thursday since we ML. In the past I'd be getting kind of resentful right now that nothing has happened....again. Instead I'm fine, I know there are reasons...we've both been kind of puny lately....but what's different now is we are both doing other things to make the other feel special and wanted...and we're both looking forward to this weekend
