When snuggling up behind her, I can expect to get that elbow pushing me back off. When I keep trying, then I have a very angry wife yelling at me for the fact that she said "no" and I continued to push. And if I act light hearted about the rejection, then I am "not taking her feelings seriously" and "disrespecting her as a woman".

- HG. I don't know how you are going about this but this is not normal behavior from an F IMO. I have never run across an F who reacted with hostility to my compliments on their physique while being playful. Sure, some get into the "no I'm not. I'm fat. blah blah blah" self-deprecation but that's usually it. At which point I just ignore and plow with more "you call this fat? You're insane, woman. Mmmm it's like a peach." [grabbing her a$$ etc.] "Maybe I should just go and take a little nibble on it."

Does your W have a sense of humor? Here's how at least I would handle that scenario:

I snuggle up. She elbows me away. "Oooo, I've got a frisky one." I compliment her body again, mmmmm, snif her deeply. I am always projecting positivity and playfulness. And she then yells at me?? WTF?

If she were ticklish and she were laying there or standing there in the hostile posture you suggest, scowling. "Hey, I didn't say I wanted to have sex with you, for godsakes. Get over yourself. Not with THAT Scrooge attitude, you big grouch. I simply wanted to....

...tickle you!" [diving my hands on her and tickling her all over].

And if she hauls off and screams or punches in anger? Game over. I stop all humor and playing. Get up. Stare very seriously.

"I'm not putting up with your pi$$ poor negative attitude. I was just trying to have some fun and play around with you. If you don't want sex, fine, you don't have to if you don't feel like it. Message received. I respect that. But I will not respect your displaying anger towards me while I'm just trying to have a good time with the woman I love. When you feel comfortable enough to tell me the real reason why you're so angry with me let me know. I'll be downstairs (or wherever) giving you your space."

...then I am "not taking her feelings seriously" and "disrespecting her as a woman".

- Sorry, HG. I find this manipulative. If it were me. "Maybe if you could share these feelings you're having with me maybe I could better understand where I am going wrong."

And the last part. "How is being in love with you and admiring everything about you, physically, mentally, and emotionally showing you disrespect? Please explain."

Along with:

"And how is lashing out in anger at your H who is just trying to show his love for his W not disrespecting me as an man? Again, please explain."

But, you may be right.. if I did all of those things, I may also get sex.... sex, not intimacy with a woman going "I can see that you are going to continue to bug me until I just give in and let you do it. So... get it over with. And now, you have gotten me to the point where I am PI$$ED off, and if you don't do it.. you're really going to be hating life. so do it. do it now and get it over with quickly".

- I agree with Lil. Are you Fing serious? Do you know what I pictured with this kind of an response? I know it's not literal and probably a bit extreme but most of this would be the response of:

An F tied up in some basement in Iraq held hostage by a bunch of let's just say very bad kidnappers. Especially if you replace "bug" with "beat" along with the last lines.

As I've said a number of times before, an F happy with herself internally is an F who embraces or at least is comfortable with her own sexuality, and the pleasure derived from such. If she was always like this then maybe it's something else. But to act in this manner is a red flag to me she needs to open up and tell me what's really bothering her. No way I'm letting this fester. Her inner dialogue must be really dragging her down for some reason.

I hate that. It creeps me out. I feel like a terrible person when that happens and it is soooooo not what I am looking for while trying to re-establish an EC. It is far easier to go without and keep some peace than to try to initiate and feel like a creep.

- HG. I feel for ya, man. Who wouldn't feel like a creep? But listen to me. If you don't listen to anything I've ever said, listen to this. I devoted a freaking thread to it.

Stop being a beta male.

You are telling me you're rolling over; giving up. Or at least it's easier and you are leaning this way. Miserable in your R while enabling her super thick walls.

And, heck, Corri even devoted another thread addressing your wish to "keep the peace." Cage rattling, from her Stupid Question thread.

You do not have to "go without." W does not have all of the power in the R, even though you are choosing to give all of yours away to her. Fifty-fifty. Don't give up. And don't personalize her rejection.

Confidence. Determination. Counter her shtty attitude with strong boundaries as to what you will and will not accept from your R. I'd start with a discussion about what makes each of you most happy and fulfilled within the R...along with an open and frank discussion about what bothers you both as well so you can both get on the same page of an healthy happy R.

2 schillings.

-Stigmata-

The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge;
the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.

-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-

...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ

-Stigmata-