Old age is so sad.

[Greeneyedlass]

Chrissy,

This comment says so much to me.....(His solution is that I need to go to the doctors and get something that will make me horny for him.) It's obvious that he doesn't see that for you to feel "horney" for him you require that EC so many of us speak about....no pill is going to provide that. Heck the pills on the market right now don't even always work for women who do have an EC for their H and want to feel horney for them.

I'm going to be my normal honest self with you here Chrissy. I see you working your way towards ending this R. I just see this in the change of your tone when talking about your R. I guess the best way I can relate this is back to when I was inching my way up to getting out of my M with my XH. It's like....once I started thinking about something, it was merely a matter of time before that thought became reality.

There was so much lacking in my M to my XH (primarily due to the addiction to alcohol) that I finally reached what I call my point of no return when it came to trying anymore. I talked til I was blue in the face, but he didn't get it even though he said he did....his behavior would change for awhile....then right back to where it was. I tried and tried to find happiness in that R and just couldn't....not when dealing with an angry drunk any given night and every weekend. I guess I equate that to your H's anger/abuse issues.

At one point I finally got to a place where I was numb where he was concerned. I didn't care if he came home, preferred he pass out asleep early in the evening when he was drinking so I wouldn't have to deal with him.....and couldn't wait for the times he'd go fishing on the weekend with his best friend so I could have some peace.

I see you doing some "inching" out of the R, just as I did. Although I believe you are in a slightly different frame of mind than I was because you are at least saying "it doesn't have to be the end". For me, I knew it was. I suspect though, that if either of you does move out....you will like your freedom and you will move on.

But that's my take on it.

GEL

[Chrissy]

Gel

Your dead on. I think I am coming to the realization that I hit my point of no return long ago. Hence the fact even with changes in H's behavior I still cannot form any line of connection with him.
I have hide from the inevitable with the attempts to fix the problems. Mainly due to how trapped I feel with other issues like our kids and his anger.
I have resolved myself to this life until now. But now the winds of discontent with my life as is not just this relationship (even though that is a circular pattern also where one is because of another) is dismantling my resolve of this is all I will ever have and it will have to be enough.

My mindset is no longer I would like to have more then this. It is I need more then this. If I cannot find it within this relationship then I will set off to find it on my own.

And as the example with the horny pill shows my H and I don't see our problems as the same. So odds are I am going to end up solo. I have spent two years trying to make him understand that sex is not the issue it is a symptom of a much larger issue. But he refuses durring feast or famine to except that fact.

[Baltoman]

I know I'm going to sound like a broken record here, but have you tried any of the intensive weekend retreats? My wife and I were at a similar state of resignation before going on ours. Hell, the night before we were to leave I picked up a woman at a bar and didn't come home until 7:00 AM. (I didn't sleep with her and I did tell Judy all about it, although I wouldn't recommend the tactic.) We still have a lot of problems but the weekend broke down some walls and gave us new resolve to work them out. You sound like you either need to get out or you need an intraveneous injection of hope. Would you try something like this? Would he if faced with the reality of the alternative?

[Chrissy]

Balto,

Would I consider this. Yeah if the cost is not much (finances cant stand much more of a strain around here)
Would my H probably to appease me. But in a group of people open up and talk about our problems no so if that is part of the program that would be a part he would rebel against and not go into with a open mind.

Oddly right now I do not know how open minded I am being about fighting this fight anymore. And I can see that.
I just have come to a place I want more then this and I don't want to spend years trying to get it. When the odds are already stacked against it ever happening. And the past 16 years do tend to sway my opinion in that direction.
And I am not just talking about in my relationship but my life in general. But my H and his temper and his views taint my ability to live life to my version of full.
Friends family activities and so forth. Individualism is a word the sums it up and still does not sum it up.

Something Cobra said in a post to Bube struck home with me. Cannot think of what exactly it was right now but it was profound. Made me take pause.

Also when thinking about if my H was to leave I realized it might just be the push I need to overcome this depression by forcing me out of my comfort zone.
His being her and our problems enable my depression to breed/feed and me to surcome to it. If he was not here I would have to get up everyday I would have to do all the things I don't right. That may be a very positive thing for me.

Well my son leaves for a field trip at 4 so I must end to get him where he needs to be.

If you have more info on the retreat I would be willing to run it past my H and see what he says about it.

[LustForLife]

Also when thinking about if my H was to leave I realized it might just be the push I need to overcome this depression by forcing me out of my comfort zone.
His being her and our problems enable my depression to breed/feed and me to surcome to it.
You are way too enmeshed with your H. Codependent. You rely on him to let you know what is going to happen in your life, what feelings you will have, what behaviors you will act out.
If he does A I can do B.
Stop this enabling dynamic the two of you clearly have. You need to find Chrissy, the individual, yet whole person.
And you know what? I could totally relate to what you wrote. It wasn't until after H left that I figured most of that out though.
So you are correct, if your H leaves that may provide the "push" you need. But why wait for the push? You can do it on your own Chrissy.
I tell myself I was forced to make changes but that's not true. I still chose to make them and you can do the same thing. I could have curled up in a little ball in bed when he left but I didn't (after the first few days anyways). I made up my mind to live my life the way I deserved to live it.
Got a job I like, started working out regularly, just taking care of myself better, mentally and physically. And I am still doing it with H back in the picture. I have not reverted back to my old ways.
So it can be done even in a R that was once enmeshed (like ours). Make a decision Chrissy. If you stay in the M or not, make the decision to take care of yourself, either way. Right now you are becoming your own worst enemy, and that has nothing to do with your H.

[Stigmata]

Good points, LFL.

Yes, Chrissy, you don't need him to push you to get your head together. Go someplace very quiet, sit in the lotus position if you have to, and just clear your mind completely.

No thoughts about how things will affect H etc. No worries about kids. Past abuse or future doubts. Just one question when all is silent:

"What does Chrissy want?"

Sounds like you 2 need to hit the enmeshment "reset" button; not pull the plug as of yet.

I'll say it again, I really think you should express yourself in words on paper to your H. If he went on this site and started reading your thoughts I think it would scare the sht out of him.

Plus that way if you do separate for a time he can have the hard facts in hand to re-read...and not skew all the crap that led up to it through his own version of events that he will convince himself is the truth.

Hard to refute your words/pain on paper as to your state of mind. Clear your head, Chrissy, don't chase the answers you want...just create an quiet empty space for yourself and they'll float right in.

-Stigmata-

[Baltoman]

Chrissy, the cost of Retrouvaille is completely up to you other than the approx $100 deposit. They do not turn away for lack of finances. They "suggest" about $550.00 if I remember correctly which includes the food and lodging.

There isn't sharing in front of the group unless you want to. They talk about things and then there is a lot of one on one couple time to discuss. I don't want to give too much away or I could drain the power of the program. All I know is there was about 16 very tense, pissed off, at the end of their rope couples on Friday and by Sunday it looked like a room full of newly married couples.

Of course the glow fades a bit with time. Not all is perfect in my R but I would be divorced without Retrouvaille. I have a vested interest in your sitch as I feel like I have made a lot of the same mistakes your H has but I feel I am about 12 months ahead of where he is. (Edit: I checked out your bio and another thing we have in common is I'm younger than my W by a couple of years. Hmmm, interesting...) Check out their home page.. Do not be put off by the Catholic slant if that offends you. I am not Catholic and the religious aspect was very low-key.

[Stigmata]

Baltoman-

Dude, you're killing me. This line, about the night before your M weekend retreat:

Hell, the night before we were to leave I picked up a woman at a bar and didn't come home until 7:00 AM. (I didn't sleep with her and I did tell Judy all about it, although I wouldn't recommend the tactic.)

- I don't mean to make light of such serious situations, Balto, but I couldn't help ROTFL. I think it was the "Hell," kickoff and the matter of fact tone. All I could think of was it's akin to, say, me needing a liver transplant in the a.m., So I go down to the local bar for some lemon water and convos. At the other end of the bar I then see my "donor" guy slamming down shot after shot of Wild Turkey...and 3 sheets towards unconsciousness....

And I'm like, "Dude....but....that's my liver. WTF??"

No, Balto, I would not endorse that tactic either to help patch up an struggling R.

Hell, this site needs SOME levity from time to time. Otherwise I'd be out somewhere with my "donor" guy finishing off my own liver, probably.

Thanks, Balto, even if unintended.

-Stigmata-

[Baltoman]

Ya know Stig, I never considered the comical aspect of it but your description had me rolling in the aisles man. I have to admit my approach was a bit, how shall we say, unique. The point I was attempting to make, sans the humor, was that I had reached the point that the inevitable had already occurred and I was already looking to a future life.

[Stigmata]

Whew!

Thanks for the clarification, Balto. I'm guessing you 2 were living apart at the time. I was reading that comment with the assumption that the 2 of you were still living together in the same house and working on things...which makes it read way different than the way you intended.

All the same, glad it helped. Might be worthwhile Chrissy. Plus you won't have any regrets later by saying "if only." Just have to decide how much it's worth.

Frankly, if I could have avoided the pain of the last 5 months and successfully worked on issues at a place like this I would have gladly paid 5k, let alone 100 or 500 etc. But you both have to want to want a positive solution. That's the most important thing. Otherwise someone will be going through the motions.

-Stigmata-