Everything's going reasonably well. Maybe it's the lava lamp I just put on my desk that's helping to keep me calm. I'm taking Corri's advice for the moment and just doing nothing. At least on the relationship front.
At work, I am swamped. Since I've switched to a new unit, there's a HUGE turf battle going on. And I'm the turf.
Without getting into details, I'm currently doing the work of at least a person and a half, I've had to work nights and every day for the last few weekends. And this is not private practice, so I'm not getting paid extra. On the other hand, my new office does have a beautiful harbor view...
Anyway, oddly enough, my putting in all these extra hours and just letting go on the relationship front, has had a positive effect on X.
He keeps complaining that I'm not around enough, that we're not doing enough things together. And he's even managed to give me a couple of hugs and pats on the arm Which is a BIG thing for him, given his aversion to physical touch. And he bought me a nice present. And he's started doing a project I asked him to ages ago, but haven't mentioned since.
Perhaps I just need less than other people. I don't know. I don't care so much about physical touch, though it's nice.
The only thing I really miss is hot wild monkey sex. You know, the kind when afterwards, you can't believe that you actually did that. And I've accepted that I won't be getting that any time soon. And that X is far, far away from feeling comfortable with something like that.
One not-so-good thing. A couple of days ago, X got an email from the coach who sexually abused him. Just a nice chatty email, asking how X was doing, and what he was up to, and, by the way, did he hae any kids?
I was furious. As far as I know, this is the first time X's abuser has gotten in touch with him since X was 14 or so. I told X that we should threaten to sue or prosecute him, since, undoubtedly he had just moved on to (or was looking for) some new victims.
But other than that, things have been pretty calm. I've basically removed myself, mentally and physically from the situation and I do feel a certain peace in not trying to do anything.
Oddly enough, I was more upset about it than he was. He said that he couldn't really blame his abuser, since probably the abuser was himself probably abused as a child.
X also said that the fact that he's messed up emotionally is only 20% the abuser's fault and 80% his own father's fault. Which, I suppose, may have some elements of truth to it.
X has been in VERY EXTENSIVE therapy in the past, but it hasn't helped him at all. Quite the opposite, in fact.
Quote: If we had never been married, I might consider a marriage contract just a piece of paper. But we were married. And now we're not. I think of myself as single. It actually would mean a tremendous amount to me if X wanted to get really, legally remarried. But I know he doesn't want to. And that hurts. And makes me feel less committed to him. And also more worried that he'll leave (which, yeah, I know, might not be such a bad thing). But, for me, it's not the same as being married.
questions.
If your H was to dramtically change and the R be better, what difference would that POP make on your day to day life, your R, and your emotions?
Since things arent good why do you wnat that POP. Who filed for the D?
You feel single? Why arent you out dating and acting single then?
Its not the same you said. what is the difference?
Im not going anywhere with this, so dont try to figure out my motives for it. I just want clarification, at this particular moment, at any rate.
I think it would not be a good thing if he left. MO.
his current behavior seems pretty normal considering the sitch.
Quote: X has been in VERY EXTENSIVE therapy in the past, but it hasn't helped him at all. Quite the opposite, in fact
Most Foo driven therapy is about revisiting, delving, understanding, etc. Being a non emotion liking kinda guy, this approach for H, forcing him to actually RE-live all that horrible crap is going to make things worse. The "therapist" is just going in with a shovel and flinging crap from one stall to another. Not helpful.
What he needs is repetitive, baby steping actions that result in Positive emotional reactions/ memories/responses. This requires a lot of patience on your part for him to reach out, give him a positive response and wait for him to reach out again.
He does have need for physical touch, etc. He is human. as he is proving.
You say your H has overcome alcohol addiction, and some other addictions? He is a 'succesful' functioning member of society, to boot, --excepting his personal interactions with you, we will acknowledge -- Id say he is quite mentally strong, resiliant, and has overcome a lot, despite the muckings about by irresponsible pyschs and other respected figures in his life.
more questions... (with reasons though)
why did he have his affair? did he say? why do you think? and lastly, you say he makes substantially more then you, but you are paying off the debt.... .
Quote: If your H was to dramtically change and the R be better, what difference would that POP make on your day to day life, your R, and your emotions?
Since things arent good why do you wnat that POP.
It's really more the other way around. If X really wanted to get remarried, to make that commitment to me, I would feel somewhat better (even if absolutely nothing else changed) because I would feel that X cared for me, wanted to be with me, not that he was just hanging out at the house because it was convenient.
Quote: Who filed for the D?
I'm not sure. It was really a joint thing. I think we both thought that we could start to move on with our lives and stop spending so much time together if we really got divorced.
Quote: You feel single? Why arent you out dating and acting single then?
I'm not sure. I guess I feel that no worthwhile man would date me if I told the truth and said, "Oh, by the way, I'm living with my ex-husband."
I sure wouldn't date someone who told me he was living with his ex-wife, even if he claimed they weren't sleeping together and it was just an arrangement of convenience for their kids.
Quote: Most Foo driven therapy is about revisiting, delving, understanding, etc. Being a non emotion liking kinda guy, this approach for H, forcing him to actually RE-live all that horrible crap is going to make things worse. The "therapist" is just going in with a shovel and flinging crap from one stall to another. Not helpful.
This is absolutely on target.
Quote: What he needs is repetitive, baby steping actions that result in Positive emotional reactions/ memories/responses. This requires a lot of patience on your part for him to reach out, give him a positive response and wait for him to reach out again.
This is hard, since he doesn't like compliments or me making a "big deal" out of positive things that he does. I try to keep my positive comments very low key, but I think he sees them (partly correctly) as implicitly pressuring him for more.
Quote: more questions... (with reasons though)
why did he have his affair? did he say? why do you think?
This one I'm really not sure about.
And you have to remember, it was a long time ago -- over 10 years ago. It was when his drinking was at its most extreme. He would go into the office and just sit there all day drinking or drunk. He would hide bottles in his bookcase and behind the washer in the cellar.
At the time, he said that this woman (girl, really) just started coming on to him and he just decided that he wanted to leave his old life and start all over. He said that he thought it would be easy. He would just move out and life would go on.
Quote: and lastly, you say he makes substantially more then you, but you are paying off the debt.... .
Yeah, I'm confused by this too. I've taken over the responsibility of paying off big chunks of his debt because he just can't seem to do it.
He spends money compulsively. For example, he decided that he wanted to start dressing more formally for work (there's no dress code and he had been teaching for years in jeans or khakis). So he went out and bought (I'm not kidding) probably 25 suits and 100 ties. Very expensive.
Then he decided that he wanted to learn more about art and literature. So, every day (again I'm not kidding) 10 to 12 packages would arrive from Amazon, loaded with expensive books, most of which he never read and which are now lying on the floor, because he can't decide how to organize them.
He also decided to remodel the basement and his study and spent tens of thousands of dollars (all on credit cards) on that.
He also is always planning extremely expensive vacations (again all on credit cards).
This is definitely something I resent, feeling that I have to use every penny of my salary to pay for household bills and his debts, while I am unable to figure out what he spends his substantially greater salary on. To be fair, he does pay the mortgage, but he should have plenty of money left over after paying that.
He spends money compulsively. For example, he decided that he wanted to start dressing more formally for work (there's no dress code and he had been teaching for years in jeans or khakis). So he went out and bought (I'm not kidding) probably 25 suits and 100 ties. Very expensive.
Then he decided that he wanted to learn more about art and literature. So, every day (again I'm not kidding) 10 to 12 packages would arrive from Amazon, loaded with expensive books, most of which he never read and which are now lying on the floor, because he can't decide how to organize them.
Sorry if I missed this already but it sounds like your H is BiPolar. He appears very depressed for a time and then his mood swings to manic behavior, such as the complusive spending habits. 25 suits and 100 ties? That's not "normal". Of course the real question is, if you are not even M to him anymore, WHY ARE YOU PAYING FOR ALL OF THIS DEBT? The two of you as a couple seem to feed off each other's dysfunctions. He knows you will enable his behavior (get him out of trouble). This probably also gives you some sense of being needed that you crave even though your self-esteem must be in the crapper for putting up with this man. Your story frustrates me to no end. As does Chrissy's and some others. It just makes me sad and perplexed that women get stuck in these ABUSIVE R. And it's not just women. Some of the men on this board do the same thing. You seem like a very intelligent and interesting woman. You deserve better. That's my 2 cents.
Just wanted to pop in here. Didn't want to hunt you down so figured would post here JIC.
I remember your D-Day is tomorrow. Curse of having a stupid photographic memory (very bad in recountings of past arguments/transgressions BTW, just ask my x)
I just wanted to wish you peace and tranquility during an understandably bitch of a day tomorrow.
As I said to BF, just focus on the bright blue sky in your mind's eye. Tomorrow is a storm cloud passing in and out of frame; that's all...then back to blue sky. Saturday the sun will come up and we all will continue in our struggles...
I'm sure you won't sleep much tonight. But try to tell your thoughts to give you a break until tomorrow. They can make themselves known, but only after allowing you to clear your mind tonight for a maybe dreamless relaxed sleep. So you can conserve your energy for tomorrow's emotions. The more you dwell the more you give the negativity power over you. Only thought you need to try and have tomorrow should be, "this guy is about to lose something he one day will regret; he just doesn't know it yet. His loss for sure."
And I speak from impartiality. Truly. You've scaled mountains in order to gain self-understanding....and without a sherpa guide. Most addmirable and honorable IMO. Most unhappy people would have just unplugged and tuned out until the next "happiness" cure came along for them to pursue...in human, liquid, or pharmaceutical form. No growth. No search for meaning. Just sign the exit clause and let's look down the road.
The throwaway society where bigger is better, easier is....well, easier.
Anyway, if you read this before your date tomorrow, just remember this Latin phrase. (some of us around here also can read Latin btw, not just you hoity-toity lawyer types)
NIL ILLEGITIMI CARBORUNDUM
or:
" "Don't Let the Bastards Get You Down."
You're one cool chick. And sooner or later that, along with your search for greater truths and meaning, are going to make you the center of some poor XY chromosome shlub's dogged attention.
Tu Veritas-
-Stigmata-
The difference between a warrior and an ordinary man is the warrior views everything as a challenge; the ordinary man views everything as either a blessing or a curse.
-Yaqui shaman Don Juan-
...and that holds 2x true for nice guy wussies, DJ
If possible, or not to emotionally destructive, I would like to know H's opinion on who filed for the D.
I guess I feel that no worthwhile man would date me if I told the truth and said, "Oh, by the way, I'm living with my ex-husband."
I think there is more to it then this. Or you wouldnt have froze out freezer guy.
since he doesn't like compliments or me making a "big deal" out of positive things that he does. I try to keep my positive comments very low key, but I think he sees them (partly correctly) as implicitly pressuring him
remove the implicit pressure. Only praise him when it is truly warranted, but look for them. Ignore his comments about not liking it. That is just a defense to unsuccessfully block out feeling warm fuzzies from you.
When he touched your arm. Did you show him you appreciated it. allow yourself to glow. appreciate it but dont chase for more.
I've taken over the responsibility of paying off big chunks of his debt because he just can't seem to do it.
Do you want to be his mom or his W/lover? If thats possible, you cant be his mom also. Pick one.
I would say divvy up the house hold expenses split them by percentage (your income compared to his) and hand him a budget or spreadsheet and say this is what I am paying for. I would consider a home remodel part of that.
Do you go on these Vacations? whats fair? what does he think is fair? if he doesnt care or wont discuss it then whatever you decide is fair.
if you decide to move on at some point he will have to figure it out. He had to do it when you were seperated. stop enabling. you cant make him stop, but you dont have to assist. If he can overcome alcohol addiction he can figure out how to pay his bills. he just needs the proper motivation. Shake the cage -a little. If he doesnt like it, he can go.
Time to lovingly detach before you reach uncaringly unattached.
Quote: Sorry if I missed this already but it sounds like your H is BiPolar. He appears very depressed for a time and then his mood swings to manic behavior, such as the complusive spending habits. 25 suits and 100 ties? That's not "normal".
This is *exactly* what I've thought. He's even been "diagonosed" as bipolar by one of his doctors, but rejects that diagnosis and refuses to take lithium or one of the available substitutes.
Bi-polarism (bi-polarity???) is something I've had some experience with.
My first real boyfriend (before I met X) was bi-polar. But he was mostly on the manic side of manic depression -- staying up to all hours, lots of energy, always up for anything.
In fact (and I probably shouldn't be saying this, because ex-boyfriend is now a respected pediatric neurosurgeon ) he used to smoke a ton of weed -- and I'm sure still does -- on the theory that this would help bring him down, making him able to function more "normally."
Anyway, let's just say that I manage to hook up with people with serious psychiatric problems. Maybe 'cause my mom's a psychiatrist.
Anyway, my view of X is that he's basically continually substituting one addiction for another -- that he's able to "cure" his alcoholism by becoming a bulemic. And able to "cure" his bulemia by becoming a compusive spender and/or porn addict.
You get the picture.
Anyway, on the money issue, I feel that we've made enormous progress. Though it probably isn't evident from my posts. X has gone from angrily denying that there's any problem, to admitting that he has a problem, but not wanting to fix it, to working with me to come up with a solution.
The solution, admittedly, isn't ideal, but in theory, X is supposed to give me $x,000 a month, paid electronically to my account, which I'll allocate to pay off his credit card bills.
It's not ideal because it places the responsibility for paying the bills on me. On the other hand, it puts the responsibility for giving me the money on X, instead of spending it on g-d knows what. And I'll be using *his* money to pay his debts.
I've also *persuaded* X after a million very unpleasant fights, to cut up all his credit cards, except one.
Look, I know it's far from ideal, but given the fact that I just don't trust X to pay his bills, I'm going to give it a try. And at least, from now on I'll be paying them with *his* money, not mine. So, it's a start.
Quote: You deserve better. That's my 2 cents.
Frankly, I agree with you -- at least intellectually. Putting it into practice is another thing altogether. My experiences with other relationships (even putting aside the Steve/Sarah episode) have been pretty unpleasant.
Which is a BIG thing for him, given his aversion to physical touch. And he bought me a nice present. And he's started doing a project I asked him to ages ago, but haven't mentioned since.
(with reasons though)
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