How many REALLY reconcile??? Before or after D...

[DavidM]

I want to be blunt but I do not want to make you angrier.

You are too angry to see this situation clearly.
You are still blaming.
You need to back off a little and see things objectively.
You are panicking and scared and there is nothing you can do right now except to wait things out.

You won't make me angry! And you're right, I am scared; she is being selfish and immature and is trying to find herself. Part of me knows she needs to do this, but she has gone about it in a bad way... (Did you read my original thread?) OUR joint counselor said this, BOTH of my daughter's counselors said this (they both met W) and three of HER best friends all said the same thing! That she's acting like a 16 y.o. And YET, I know she has some growing up to do; just wish she'd do it while SEPARATED and THEN decide.... She doesn't want to be in limbo and that's why she's filing... I say that's ONE more step down the road that makes it harder to reconcile if she ever decides that's whay she wants.

I'm NOT blaming. I have owned up to my role in this; she has trivialized HER role in things and STILL doesn't see that her involvement w/ OM was an EA even if you buy into the fact that the PA didn't start until she moved out.

You want success stories, go over to piecing.
You want to hear about stories of people who are working their arses off to become better people and forgive their spouses, then go to midlife crisis or separated.

I have forgiven her; I did last summer because I saw how whe was eaten up by not being able to deal w/ my sitch from 1989! And OM is just an immature clown. Nice guy but socially/emotionally immature... Shoot he still calls his mom "mommy" sometimes...!

WE have all done something wrong to contribute to the demises of our relationships. Every single one of us.

ABSOLUTELY! And there is another forum I post in where I have been even more open about the relationship than here. I have owned up to MY role in things.

You had an affair in 1989, you keep referring to it as though it was nothing and it was 17 years ago so what the hell.
To her it was a big deal.
She may be just saying this as an excuse for her own actions but it sounds like the two of you never dealt with it properly and it has been festering for years.

Oh, it was a big deal and you're right, we didn't deal w/ it. We let it slide. She didn't push me and I was glad of it and we didn't talk about it much. Every few years she'd ask about it, I'd deny it was a PA, she'd say she forgave me and that was that. No mention at all about it for the past 6-7 years until she started grief counselling two years ago for her parents death in '01 and '03; the issue came up and I again denied it...
BUT, it was 17 years ago, I've been penitent and we've had two kids SINCE then. And 3 diff. clergy have told me that she's fooling herself to think she has scriptural grounds for a divorce (she says she was told she DOES!) and that she DID have an affair regardless of how she defines things. That is a priest and two ministers saying so.

What the counselor(s) have said is that this is NOT the only issue as W has said. She HAS admitted that she has issues w/ her mother and that relationship has affected how she copes w/ things and interacts w/ people. (well duh, everyone that knows her could have told you that!) She definitely has a lot of work to do on herself as she has admitted. But when she looks at our relationship all she sees is a pile of doodoo...Nothing else. I say she's looked at me for so long w/ bitterness/resentment that she can't see the real me and isn't willing to even consider that.
Not much else I can do except be a good Dad, not blast W, try to be cordial,etc. Last summer I basically had a falling out w/ my first L b/c I didn't want to do ANYTHING legal; it wasn't necessary in my view and time bore that out. Thankfully I didn't nuke her in the legal arena; that would have gotten real ugly by involving a lot of people.
Gotta run and ride herd on the offspring units!